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How dangerous is a chambered Kahr to a gun with safety? CCW.

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by Orion8472, Oct 26, 2011.

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  1. Orion8472

    Orion8472 Member

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    For carry purposes, how safe is it to carry a kahr with one in the chamber compared to one that has a safety? Right now, I have a Springfield Armory and am in the process of selling it for something a bit thinner, lighter, and withOUT a safety, so I was going to get a Kahr CW9.

    With all that said, the EMP is a fantastic gun. Never has given me a problem. However, wanting something a bit lighter and thinner is my focus. . . . NOT on "the quality of one gun over the other". I also know that the triggers on these two guns are completely different. The trigger of the EMP is typical nice 1911. I also like the feel and pull of the fat kahr trigger. Again, this is strictly about having a better suited [for me] carry gun.

    My brother thinks it is a bad idea to get the kahr because it has no safety on it, . . . and could promote an accidental discharge far more easily than a gun with a safety. What is your feelings on this matter? For me, I think of it as, . . . the gun is as safe as you are with it. It won't discharge on its own.

    So, . . . . discuss. Thanks! :)
     
  2. 788Ham

    788Ham Member

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    Other than a revolver, I wouldn't have a pistol on the place without a safety!

    No, the pistol won't discharge on its own, and you made the statement, "The gun is as safe as you are with it". How many times have you been in a SHTF situation? You'd best stay with a firearm and a safety! JMHO
     
  3. REAPER4206969

    REAPER4206969 Member

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    Stop getting firearms advice from your brother.
     
  4. ugaarguy

    ugaarguy Moderator Staff Member

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    Your answer is correct. Tell your brother to keep his booger hook off the bang switch until he's ready to fire, and keep his gun a sturdy holster that covers the trigger. If he does that he won't have an AD. Failure to do that, and failure to follow the rest of the four rules, could very well lead to an ND - but not an AD.
     
  5. 167

    167 Member

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    +1

    And a correction, it is not absent a safety, it is absent an external safety.
     
  6. easyg

    easyg Member

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    1) Keep your pistol in its holster till you are ready to shoot.

    2) Keep your finger off the trigger till you have the target in your sights and are prepared to shoot.


    Follow these two rules and you will never have a problem with the Kahr (or any other handgun for that matter).
     
  7. Inebriated

    Inebriated Member

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    Booger hook off the bang switch.

    Every firearm should be carried in a proper holster... With a good holster, that trigger will never be pulled. And if you exercise basic gun-handling, you'll never touch the trigger.

    I don't like safeties on defensive handguns, and feel 100% safe carrying a gun with out a physical safety.
     
  8. Steve C

    Steve C Member

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    All modern guns you buy will have a safety, often several, but there are passive safeties and active safeties and some guns will have both. Lack of an active safety does not mean the gun has "no safety".

    Of the 2 IMO the passive safeties are inherently more "safe" in that they can't be forgotten, inadvertently disengaged, or fumbled.

    Finger off the trigger until ready to fire is the safety procedure one needs to make a habit of.
     
  9. R.W.Dale

    R.W.Dale Member

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    I utterly reject the notion that you can "be a little more careless" with a pistol with an external safety

    posted via tapatalk using android.
     
  10. engineer88

    engineer88 Member

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    As others have wisely stated above my holster is my manual safety. It keeps the trigger from being depressed. If my gun is out of the holster, it is being put away, cleaned or fired only. Those scenarios involve me unloading my guns in different ways, but the end result is safe handling. In fact all of my carry guns sit in a holster in my safe if they remain loaded.
     
  11. Dr_2_B

    Dr_2_B Member

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    Your quality holster that covers the trigger is safety #1. Your careful handling (avoiding placing your finger on the trigger until ready to fire) is safety #2. I believe your well meaning brother isn't the best source of advice on this matter. The reason many of us feel that external manual safeties on defense pistols are unwise is that there are documented cases of people in life-threatening sit'ns failing to deactivate the safety in the heat of the moment and squeezing the trigger to no affect. The particular case that comes to mind is a jewelry store owner with a Walther PPK.
     
  12. Hangingrock

    Hangingrock Member

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    How dangerous only as dangerous as you make it to be. Correct handling procedures and proper holster should prove not to be problematic.
     
  13. Orion8472

    Orion8472 Member

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    Please no hatin' on the bro. :scrutiny: Thanks! :)

    Most of what has been said here has been my thinking. The most important is what Dr_2_B illuded to. The "what if" of a manual safety and fumbling it during a highly stressful situation.

    While at the gun store they all were saying that I should keep the EMP because "it is a far better gun". Where that may or may not be true, it is also less concealable. Why I find something like the CW9 as being a better CARRY gun [over the EMP]are:

    Thinner profile
    No external safety adding to width
    No beavertail safety to potentially snag on clothes
    No hammer to potentially snag on clothes
    Lighter weight
    Bore sits lower in my hand

    EMP benefits:
    Potentially more accurate
    Magazine drops free
    Night sites
    1911 trigger
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2011
  14. Screendmon

    Screendmon Member

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    I carry my Kahr CM9 with one in the pipe always.
     
  15. gb6491

    gb6491 Member

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    Not to knock the EMP, but I doubt it's potentially more accurate than the CW9 (at least mechanically). You may be able to shoot it more accurately because of the 1991 style trigger, but I think you will be surprised by how accurately you can shoot a CW9.
    The mags drop free on my CW9 and there are night sights available for the "C" series Kahrs (I see your point though with the EMP already having them).
    Regards,
    Greg
     
  16. ForumSurfer

    ForumSurfer Member

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    I agree with this. Make sure your holster covers the trigger guard and use some common sense. Don't use a flimsy holster that can crumple up and get caught inside the trigger guard while re-holstering. Many of us carry pistols like glocks, m&p's, kahrs or others that completely lack external safeties. Use good equipment, follow the 4 rules, familiarize yourself with it thoroughly before you start carrying it and you'll be good to go.

    So do I. I feel that the cw9 and the cm9 are terrific for the price you pay, especially the cw9.
     
  17. KAS1981

    KAS1981 Member

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    Long double action trigger & a firing pin block.

    I'd say it's just fine.
     
  18. sturmgewehr

    sturmgewehr Member

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    The gun is 100% safe. The gun itself is inherently safe, meaning it won't fire itself and isn't going to fire if dropped.

    The question you need to ask yourself is "how safe am I"?

    Get a proper holster, practice to keep your finger off the trigger. Practice your presentation regularly in a safe manner.

    I've carry a Kahr in my front pocket safely as do countless others.
     
  19. Johannes_Paulsen

    Johannes_Paulsen Member

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    I have had a Kahr MK9 for over four years. It has,thus far, completely failed to go off when I wasn't pulling the trigger. Train regularly, drilling yourself to keep the finger off the trigger until sights on target & decision has been made to shoot, always use a holster (even/especially for pocket carry) and it will server you well.

    That said, I recently purchased a Springfield EMP, with the intent of seeing if it might be a good EDC piece. Not because of the external safeties, but because the trigger on the Kahr is smooth but verrrryyyy long.... I recently took a combat handgun course with it, and decided that I might be willing to sacrifice the ability to pocket carry for that sweet 1911 trigger. (Which will require me to train/drill the extra step to turn the safety on/off when holstering/unholstering. Funny how it always comes back to training, no?)

    Bottom line: these are both good pistols that will be just as safe (or 'unsafe') as their owner. It ultimately depends on what you're looking for and how much you want to spend.
     
  20. EMC45

    EMC45 Member

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    Every gun you pick up has a safety. It's between your ears!
     
  21. Sulaco

    Sulaco Member

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    THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AN ACCIDENTAL DISCHARGE.

    YOU EITHER MEANT TO PULL THE TRIGGER OR YOU DIDN'T.

    IF YOU DIDN'T, THE CORRECT TERM IS NEGLIGENT DISCHARGE.

    THAT'S GUN GOSPEL FRIEND!

    As for having a gun with a "safety", all of my guns, knives, hammers, bricks, anything I'd ever consider using as a weapon, have a safety. It's called my brain.
     
  22. RinkRat

    RinkRat Member

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    ^^^ The *best* safety is the one between your ears ... use it wisely grasshopper !!

    Check your firearm, check it again, and then once more.

    Like a wise contractor measures three-times and cuts-once!!

    Don't need no *unintended discharge* nether ...
     
  23. MikePaiN

    MikePaiN Member

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    Over the years I've carried many Kahrs including my current CM9. I always carry "one in the chamber" and in 1oc appendix position.......Yep, all these years of that and what do you know..? My femoral artery and the boys are all still in tact ;)
     
  24. lead slinger

    lead slinger Member

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    I own the cw its a good light gun. I carry with one round loaded and I feel fine plus it also allows me to carry one more extra round. If you do go with the kahr look at khostler
     
  25. Creature

    Creature Member

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    As long as your Kahr is carried in a quality holster that fully covers the trigger, youre good to go.
     
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