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How do criminals obtain firearms?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by monotonous_iterancy, Jan 23, 2013.

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  1. monotonous_iterancy

    monotonous_iterancy Member

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    I'm in a debate, and I was told that most criminals get their guns from straw purchases, and if we made certain guns unavailable, criminals would lose a major source of weaponry.

    I'm not sure this is true. I think criminals likely steal most of their firearms. Are there statistics to prove either side?
     
  2. Solo

    Solo Member

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  3. SaxonPig

    SaxonPig Member

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    Most often the guns are stolen. Either by the criminal or he buys a stolen gun from another criminal.

    Straw purchases to supply guns to criminals are actually rather uncommon. They do happen, but it's not a major source of guns for crooks.

    Read the news stories. Most of the time the criminal's gun was stolen.
     
  4. monotonous_iterancy

    monotonous_iterancy Member

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    But are there statistics to back that up? That PBS article, biased as those folks may be, quoted a law enforcement officer with statistics of his own.
     
  5. Solo

    Solo Member

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    And those statistics don't hurt us, aside from calling to attention the lack of regulation of firearms dealers and prosecution of straw purchases, which I think we can all agree should be addressed to the fullest extend of the law.
     
  6. ScrapMetalSlug

    ScrapMetalSlug Member

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    Fast and Furious helped a lot of criminals, mainly the drug cartels acquire weapons by government sanctioned straw purchases. If you count all the Fast and Furious guns, it might make the statistics lean toward straw purchases, but I am not sure anyone knows how many guns they let walk.

    However, I would have to think a great deal of guns used in crime are STOLEN.

    Possibly, a criminal has their girlfriend buy a gun if they have a clean record, which is a straw purchase. It is already illegal though, so how will passing another law stop it?
     
  7. hogshead

    hogshead Member

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    PBS hum wonder where they get they're funding from? The same one who saved big bird and cut defense spending Id say. A bunch of liberal hacks.
     
  8. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Everyone knows criminals buy all their guns at full retail price through the gunshow "Loop Hole".

    Or, they get one AK-47 free with every 10 Kilo's of marijuana they peddle on the street.

    rc
     
  9. lobo9er

    lobo9er Member

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  10. lobo9er

    lobo9er Member

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    funny they have to mention none were AW's, like that means we are safer?
     
  11. Browning

    Browning Member

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  12. Solo

    Solo Member

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    Excellent source of factual information! Seems to indicate that most criminals get their guns via theft. Interesting.
     
  13. heeler

    heeler Member

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    Having had my own home burglarized three times in the past with firearms being stolen twice I am very sure that a large number of firearms end up on the black market in this manner.
    Sure there is the ever now and again dirty ffl guy and the straw purchasers working in conjunction but to think all these guns are coming from ftf sales visa via the "gunshow loop hole...tm" is a bit of a stretch.
     
  14. MErl

    MErl Member

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    was a real nice segment on NPR a month or so back from a nice young lady in Oakland CA. Among the complaints about gang gun culture and guns in general she described straw purchases. An older sibling buys a gun for the younger as they come of age. The serial # is removed so as not to incriminate the buyer.

    That was the gist of it as I recall. The segment upset me greatly as it was against guns and she continually described actions which are already very illegal.
     
  15. danez71

    danez71 Member

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    Not to disparage the post a couple up...


    Any one have any data more current that 27 yrs old?
     
  16. Browning

    Browning Member

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    I'm sure there is, try google.
     
  17. 22-rimfire

    22-rimfire Member

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    I believe most of the guns are stolen. I don't think your typical criminal ditches his gun after a crime like you see on TV. Where are they stolen? From other "criminals", private homes, automobiles, and businesses.

    This is why a gun safe makes a lot of sense. Not a perfect solution and certainly requires an investment. But it certainly is a preventative measure that could be taken.
     
  18. Jenrick

    Jenrick Member

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    Yes crooks don't normally commit a burglary to steal a gun to commit another crime right away, OH WAIT burglary IS a crime. Who knew?

    In almost 7 years of patrol work, I never had a crook use a legal gun, ever. Every single gun was stolen. How did they get a hold of their guns? They largely traded other stolen goods for them. I also arrested a few folks who basically made a living committing burglaries with their best product being firearms. A 60" TV wouldn't fetch the same money as a small revolver. A felon can't walk into Rent-a-Center and walk out with a pistol, no matter how much money they have.

    A case of the article slanting the way the information to support their "opinion."

    -Jenrick
     
  19. gbran

    gbran Member

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    I'm sure there is a fair amount of straw purchasing going on, but for the most part, you are right. The straw purchaser generally pays market prices, then has to drive his merchandise at least a couple states away, then resell at a profit. I doubt common criminals want to pay this kind of price. Stolen guns are lots cheaper.
     
  20. 9MMare

    9MMare Member

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    So far it sounds like most are stolen. (With straw purchases right up there).

    If stolen...does that put any particular responsibility on gun owners? Is it our fault when our homes or cars are broken into and our property is stolen? Should we be held responsible for other people's crimes?

    I know that many antis are trying to say that we should be made responsible if our guns are stolen and then used later in crimes. (There is also another focus around keeping them out of the hands of children in the home...I see this as a different, altho related, issue).
     
  21. Certaindeaf

    Certaindeaf member

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    They probably obtain them the way any other thing is obtained.
     
  22. anchorman

    anchorman Member

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    Actually PBS and NPR get the vast majority of their funding from corporate sponsors (I'm sure they don't have any agenda at all…), charitable trusts/foundations, and from viewers/listeners during those horrid pledge drives.
     
  23. tactikel

    tactikel Member

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    I know Chicago, the gang bangers get their guns from two sources: straw purchases from: KY, TN, VA, and from burglaries. The ratios depend on the connections the Gang has. IMHO if these two sources dried up they would purchase weapons from clandestine manufacturers. The neighborhoods on the west side of Chicago mandate that a Gang member be armed, if you cross into another gangs territory, and flash the wrong signs, you will be killed. Being armed means your life , how much is your life worth? This is why they pay $1500 for a .38 Taurus. When a gang can make $ 10,000 a DAY selling drugs on a certain street corner they will defend it to death.

    BTW Chicago has some of the most stringent gun laws in the country, on an average Saturday we have some 30 shooting victems:what: figure 2-3 times that shot at and missed( it's hard to shoot accurately with the sights at " 9 o'clock"). Over 500 murders last years. :( and our Governor want MORE gun laws.
     
  24. Skribs

    Skribs Member

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    This is an uneducated guess, but I bet they get them a lot of ways...

    1) Stolen directly.
    2) Bought on the black market (likely stolen).
    3) Sold to the drug cartels, smuggled back from Mexico.
    4) Bought in FTF transactions, because he could not buy it legally.
    5) Bought in a gun store, because the person has not been convicted before (whether or not he has committed a crime).
    6) "Borrowed" from a family member who is a legitimate person.
    7) Cheapo weapon that will last 10 rounds that was created by a crook with some machining skills.

    No matter how much gun control we put in place...
    #1 and 2 we literally can't stop. If bad people want guns, guns will be stolen.
    #3 wasn't the citizen's fault (F&F). Although barring that, we can't regulate the drug cartels in Columbia.
    #4 we can legally regulate, but practically there's no way to enforce the law.
    #5 and #6 we can't do away with without affecting every law-abiding gun owner.
    #7 there is no way to do away with, especially with 3D printers nowadays.

    Basically, that's how BGs get guns, and why gun control won't stop them from getting them. At least in my logical opinion.
     
  25. j.kramer

    j.kramer member

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