How much does chopping hurt .303 accuracy

[EastBound&Down]

I just got my first rifle, a no.4 enfield. It has been chopped from 25 inches to 22 inches.
Does that hurt the accuracy much?

 

[Llama Bob]

Generally speaking making the barrel on a rifle shorter has no effect on accuracy, or improves it very slightly. Like any cantilevered beam, the barrel of a rifle vibrates proportionally to the cube of its length. Shorter is stiffer.

The quality of the new crown compared to the old is going to have a lot to do with what you actually get.

 

[Duster340]

Llama hit it on the head. Barrel length shouldn't negatively affect accuracy assuming it was done well. I stubbed my No4 Mk1 to 17.25" and it groups great with standard battle aperture sights. Has been in my deer stands & blinds all week, and while I have yet to see a dang deer, I have no doubt it'll get the job done

Generally speaking making the barrel on a rifle shorter has no effect on accuracy, or improves it very slightly. Like any cantilevered beam, the barrel of a rifle vibrates proportionally to the cube of its length. Shorter is stiffer.

The quality of the new crown compared to the old is going to have a lot to do with what you actually get.

 

[EastBound&Down]

Llama hit it on the head. Barrel length shouldn't negatively affect accuracy assuming it was done well. I stubbed my No4 Mk1 to 17.25" and it groups great with standard battle aperture sights. Has been in my deer stands & blinds all week, and while I have yet to see a dang deer, I have no doubt it'll get the job done

Cool, Mine probably won't go hunting, still working on fixing the scope mount ( it was loose when I found it at a shady pawnshop)
How does your enfield work? I've read they are accurate, reliable rifles, has that been your experience?

 

[EastBound&Down]

*hunting yet I do hope to take it out in year or two

 

[entropy]

It probably has little effect on accuracy, but it has a huge negative effect on collectabilty.

 

[EastBound&Down]

It probably has little effect on accuracy, but it has a huge negative effect on collectabilty.

IKR, I don't mind the stock change, but I kinda miss the classy irons :/

 

[LoonWulf]

Sooo..... pictures?

 

[entropy]

I think that's it in his avatar.

 

[EastBound&Down]

I think that's it in his avatar.

Yea it is, got it for 200$ at a pawn shop. The scope mount is loose, need to fix that, but other than being dirty thats all

 

[LoonWulf]

...good catch, i shoulda looked closer.....still want better picture lol

 

[Clark]

$50
$50
$50
$80

The 303s were $50, the one in 308 cost me extra.

 

[EastBound&Down]

$50
$50
$50
$80

The 303s were $50, the one in 308 cost me extra.

How in the world?! Dude thats awesome!

 

[Clark]

prices from 17 years ago..... wish I kept renge reports on their accuracy from 17 years ago, that started later.
303 Brit accuracy is now only a vague memory...
It must have been a real party.
The 303 ammo and relaoding box split open and was repaired with duct tape.

 

[EastBound&Down]

Ah, 17 years, back when an sks cost 90$ at Roses

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

Ah, 17 years, back when an sks cost 90$ at Roses

That's not a bad lookin sporter, IMO! Enfield's are great rifles, but feeding em can be iffy, unless ya got a .308 Ishapore, of course. Thank God for PrviPartisan!
I got lucky and stumbled on a super clean 1918 .410 musket, so I can buy ammo at Wallyworld. Accuracy is not too bad with 2.5" slugs out to 50yds or so, for a smoothbore anyway- minute of hog at least, lol.
I did have an 18" chopped Ishapore years ago, but either the crown or lead must have had severe issues. It would shoot 3" groups at 50yds- with perfect prints of the bullets tumbling sideways.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

I traded in 1984 for a used sporterized Lee-Enfield No.1 MkIII* (BSA 1917 manu.) with no provenance on who did the work. It came with a 20.75" bbl, high gloss Monte Carlo buttstock with triangular section forearm, scope base centered over the charger guide and receiver bridge. I carried the gun hunting once with my older son in the early 1990s.

Aug 2016 I had not taken it out in years so I took it to the range. I had previously zeroed it with 180gr SP RN Remington Corelokt factory ammo which always did well for me at the target range. Firing was at 100yds. From my notes:

.303 Lee Enfield, No. 1 MkIII*, sporter, 20.75" bbl
7 rounds Brit MilSurp Max spread 2.25" c2c 3.5" high
6 rounds Fed Factory Max spread 1.25" c2c 2" high

I also fired the last of a handload where I had hit the sour note on the barrel harmonics but the less said about that the better.
16 rounds handload (150gr SP spire point flat base bullet, 36 gr 3031) Max spead 6" c2c, 4.5" right 3" low


Aside on sour notes:
Every discussion of sporterized military rifles gets flamed for ruining the collector value. Today any complete military rifle even if beat to haitch condition is considered collectible. That's today. In the 1950s and even 1960s a collectible military rifle had to be near pristine; any wear or tear, it was junk, suitable only as a "truck gun" or as the basis for building a sporter. The US commercial rifle industry was slow to recover from devoting itself to military production in WWII and for a lot of 1950s and 1960s working class guys and WWII vets it was a sportered army rifle or no centerfire hunting rifle at all. I became a gun buff in the 1950s. I have the fully sporterized Lee-Enfield, a semi-sporter Carcano with the stock ala Krag cavalry carbine, and a Mosin carbine I bought semi-sporterized which I redressed in a full M44 military stock set. One more complaint about bubba'd military rifles, I swear, I'll put the bubba semi-sporter stock back on the Mosin.

 

[Tirod]

Different generation only appreciate what they can't get. Because there were so many surplus arms at incredibly cheap prices, spending double or triple was out of the reach of many who wanted to hunt. Before the war the average working man couldn't get out of urban areas - long work hours, high costs, available land, no vacation, etc. Those who lived in the country had it to themselves.

After the war there was better wages, and an interest in getting out - it was the age of the travel trailer, which are being restored and even collected now. You could get out of the city, better hours and competing industries paying better. It was the age of the Great White Hunter with magnum rifles and stories of legendary kills of African game. Still - cheap surplus guns were literally sitting by the barrel full in surplus shops, hardware stores, etc. No FFL required, you could browse thru them while getting a set of new tires installed. Or - just browse a catalog at home and mail order it.

Sporterizing what seemed to be an endless supply of guns is exactly why we seem to have a large number of sporterized milsurps. It was a huge hobby, and even then, gunwriters and smiths knew it was No Big Deal to shorten one. Barrel length by numbers alone does not ensure accuracy. Knowing the best barrel length for that cut and taper is where the money is. What smiths attempt to do is to cut the muzzle where the vibration node exists, to keep the muzzle from moving at all on exit of the bullet. A stationary muzzle is far more accurate than one buzzing from the shock vibration of the powder train.

As far as short barrels go, the Germans scienced it out and found that rounds like .308 worked best at 18" - which is where the G3/HK91 is cut. That's two inches shorter than the M16 at 20". They were planning a much more mechanized use for their troops, too. Even Browning got into the game with a model with adjustable weight on the barrel, you shot it for groups and locked it down at the best muzzle node.

Barrel length is really not involved in accuracy much at all - vibration nodes and crown have more to do with it. And if you find a sporter with an issue that points to the muzzle being the problem - add weight to dampen it. Put the sights and flash hider back on, you got a Tanker Enfield.

 

[EastBound&Down]

The scope mount was loose, and I am working on fixing it, if you have any ideas, here is the thread:
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/putting-mount-on-lee-enfield.828899/

 

[Duster340]

I love it, more accurate than I can hold her at 100 yrds. Great handy rifle where I hunt. In fact, bagged a little doe this morning!

Cool, Mine probably won't go hunting, still working on fixing the scope mount ( it was loose when I found it at a shady pawnshop)
How does your enfield work? I've read they are accurate, reliable rifles, has that been your experience?

 

[EastBound&Down]

I love it, more accurate than I can hold her at 100 yrds. Great handy rifle where I hunt. In fact, bagged a little doe this morning!View attachment 769099

Now That is beautiful

 

[Duster340]

Now That is beautiful

Thanks man. Bought it in its original form in the 80s. Only the find the first 6ish inches of rifling was shot, tumbling at 25 yrds. Buried it in the closet until a few years ago. Decided to cut back the barrel to good rifling. Ended up going for a "tanker" look. Had the vintage spotter stock laying around and put it on for hunting. Really happy to get the old girl shooting again

 

[Clark]

May be off topic, but the finest ammo I have measured for concentricity is Greek 303 Brit ammo.
Better than Federal Gold Match
Better than my best handloads with turned necks, Lee Collet neck die, and sliding sleeve seater die.

 

[EastBound&Down]

on the topic of ammo,
Any experience with .303 Wolf or Privi Partisan,?
Its cheap so thats probably what I am gonna use

 

[dachshund]

I’ve got 4 Lee-Enfields, a No1 Mk lll, a No4 Mk l, a No 4Mk ll, and a No5 Mkl, all bone stock and in very good to new condition, Years ago I used cut them down, cut them off, whatever. These 4 I never touched and am very glad when I see what prices they are going for these days. Any stock military rifle is getting to be very scarce, hence valuable.