How often to chronograph?

[Axis II]

I'm debating on getting a chronograph to check some loads and wondering how often you guys use it? Say you have your good load and it checks in at say 3200fps with say 10 shots do you call it done and that's all the testing you do for that load? Do you chronograph for each lot of powder?

Say I'm doing a load workup for a rifle do you chronograph each load first or find what's most accurate first then see if your pushing it too fast?

Do you try and keep it under book max fps or right on?

I guess another question is as long as you have an accurate load what's the point of chronographing?

 

[wrench459]

Book values are out of a test barrel not your rifle.
Yes get a chrono. Even the so called cheap ones work quite well.
My two pennys.

 

[dgod]

I chrony each load for each caliber. Usually 5 to 10 rounds each, then correlate the data by load and caliber. I have shot as many as 5 calibers and 2 - 3 loads of each over the chrony at one trip to the range.

just my $0.02
dg

 

[Blue68f100]

I've got in the habit of crony every shot. I have my own range so it's not a problem for me to setup. My range is in my front yard . You need to crony enough under different conditions to know how your gun and bullet combo works. What's good at 80F may not be at 32F or 100F+. Barrel cold, hot, etc.......

 

[wrench459]

... You need to crony enough under different conditions to know how your gun and bullet combo works. What's good at 80F may not be at 32F or 100F+. Barrel cold, hot, etc.......

Very true I think that the manufacturer's use a controlled environment with ambient being ~70-80F.
Could be very wrong

 

[Axis II]

Book values are out of a test barrel not your rifle.
Yes get a chrono. Even the so called cheap ones work quite well.
My two pennys.

I understand that part. hahaha. I looked in my Hornady manual tonight and it says Rem 700 1-12 twist 20'' barrel. Well I have a 1-9 twist so I'm assuming my velocity is going to be faster.

My question was what if a book value says say 25gr of powder x is a max load and 3200fps do you shoot for that 3200fps for you max? I am playing around with some varmint loads trying to get a little more flat shooting and maybe hit a little better accuracy. Generally I only use Hornady or Lyman data but having a few years under my belt now I'm wading into Hodgdon data for a higher max data and notice they are quite a bit higher like 2-3gr than Hornady. I understand the book FPS means nothing.

 

[Dudedog]

I chrono when working up new loads.
I also will recheck know loads when I change lots of powder.
Also interesting to do a hot vs cold. (you can make ammo cold in a plastic bag in an ice chest)

I had a Competition pro choro pal. Worked well but would not allow a remote link. I replaced it with the Pro Chrono Digital.
It seem to work quite well and I am happy with it.

On sale now at MIdway.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/852429/competition-electronics-prochrono-digital-chronograph
About $95

If you want to be able to access the results from a distance and save them you will want one or the other of these depending on what you want to hook it up to.

Bluetooth link to Phone/Bluetooth tablet
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/2...oth-adapter-for-prochrono-digital-chronograph
About $60

Cabled link for Laptop (USB)
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/5...-interface-for-pro-chrono-digital-chronograph
About $40

You will something to set it on or a tripod,
I got a cheap tripod from Wally World, about $12

I think it was money well spent. (and a fun toy)

One thing to keep in mind is if you are shooting a scoped rifle be aware of the bullet path vs the line of sight through the scope at close range.
I know lead is not magnetic but from some reason chronos can attract bullets. (maybe a micro sized black hole hiding inside them does it, no other explanation that I can think of),
but there must be a reason so many die from lead poisoning. (can't be shooter error, just not possible, since it seems to happen so often)
So far mine have been able to dodge any errant shots.
When I chrono I just like to chrono, and test for accuracy later. The only accuracy I am concerned about when using the chrono is getting the bullet in the right place over the chrono.

 

[ColtPythonElite]

I loaded the first 20 years without one. I loaded for accuracy and not speed. Once I found a good grouping load, I quit search searching.

After buying a chronograph, I still do the same. I just know the average speed on the test day and record it with my notes

 

[Axis II]

I chrony each load for each caliber. Usually 5 to 10 rounds each, then correlate the data by load and caliber. I have shot as many as 5 calibers and 2 - 3 loads of each over the chrony at one trip to the range.

just my $0.02
dg

5-10 rounds each of a specific load? Say if your doing a workup from start to max are you chronoing each 5 shot spread? say 23, 23.3, 23.6, 24gr?

 

[wrench459]

If your just punching paper..
The most accurate "book" load will be around 3/4 up.
If your loading hunting rounds your going for speed so you'll need to understand over pressure signs.
Over- pressure is very hard to read for us reloaders until it's way tooooo
late.

 

[Axis II]

I chrono when working up new loads.
I also will recheck know loads when I change lots of powder.
Also interesting to do a hot vs cold. (you can make ammo cold in a plastic bag in an ice chest)

I had a Competition pro choro pal. Worked well but would not allow a remote link. I replaced it with the Pro Chrono Digital.
It seem to work quite well and I am happy with it.

On sale now at MIdway.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/852429/competition-electronics-prochrono-digital-chronograph
About $95

If you want to be able to access the results from a distance and save them you will want one or the other of these depending on what you want to hook it up to.

Bluetooth link to Phone/Bluetooth tablet
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/2...oth-adapter-for-prochrono-digital-chronograph
About $60

Cabled link for Laptop (USB)
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/5...-interface-for-pro-chrono-digital-chronograph
About $40

You will something to set it on or a tripod,
I got a cheap tripod from Wally World, about $12

I think it was money well spent. (and a fun toy)

One thing to keep in mind is if you are shooting a scoped rifle be aware of the bullet path vs the line of sight through the scope at close range.
I know lead is not magnetic but from some reason chronos can attract bullets. (maybe a micro sized black hole hiding inside them does it, no other explanation that I can think of),
but there must be a reason so many die from lead poisoning. (can't be shooter error, just not possible, since it seems to happen so often)
So far mine have been able to dodge any errant shots.
When I chrono I just like to chrono, and test for accuracy later. The only accuracy I am concerned about when using the chrono is getting the bullet in the right place over the chrono.[/QUOTE]

Thanks! I had a concern about that. I thought how in the world am I going to shoot accurately with that thing in front of me.

As far as shooting one I just thought maybe take a string and tie to the muzzle and walk it out and through the chrono to see "bullet path" and see where the scope sits according to this.

 

[Axis II]

If your just punching paper..
The most accurate "book" load will be around 3/4 up.
If your loading hunting rounds your going for speed so you'll need to understand over pressure signs.
Over- pressure is very hard to read for us reloaders until it's way tooooo
late.

Punching paper I have my sweet spot which is about mid range mark but I'm not getting the expansion from my varmint bullets like I do when using factory rounds so I figure they are too slow and I noticed comparing reloads to factory scope dopes its off a little bit. I guess I'm not very good at asking the OP questions but I figured if the book says 3400fps is max for that bullet id be in the 3200-3300 range and call it quits. I read somewhere that checking primers, sticky bolt, etc is good but Chrono speeds top those methods for pressure.

I was shooting 55gr v max from a 223rem over the summer with H322 AND CCI 450 primers and it was pretty hot out and I started noticing that when I ventured out of Hornady data and into Hodgdon data I got a lot more recoil, sound and muzzle flip and when I went to the next 5 pack that was 3 tenths higher than the last the bolt was sticky and the primer looked a little funny like it was flowing and I said yeah, I'm done! I went home and pulled all the remaining bullets. Up until that point the primers appeared fine to me but that first one from that next 5 pack looked odd so figured be safe than sorry.

 

[wrench459]

Yes I know what you mean.
I loaded some 9mm Tac-Xp 115gr bullets with my favorite pet load.
Took one look at the shell and thought to myself aint no way in beep am I'm going to fire that thing.

 

[Axis II]

Yes I know what you mean.
I loaded some 9mm Tac-Xp 115gr bullets with my favorite pet load.
Took one look at the shell and thought to myself aint no way in beep am I'm going to fire that thing.

so pretty much the chrono speed means nothing about pressure?

 

[wrench459]

so pretty much the chrono speed means nothing about pressure?

Most of today's manuals will state the pressures "tested" slightly < max. with
there test bbls.

I don't recall even one stating HOT loads.

 

[cfullgraf]

I use a chronograph when working up new loads, working with new-to-me cartridges, or new firearms. Usually, I'll work on accuracy without the chronograph and when I get close to what I want, I'll start running the rounds over the chronograph.

With optical sensors down range, in my opinion, it is a pain to chronograph and try to shoot for accuracy at the same time. It is difficult to line up the sensors with the target.

With a Magnetospeed chronograph, it is a bit easier but with the bayonet sensor attached to the barrel, accuracy is affected some. With a LabRadar chronograph, it is easy to shoot for accuracy and chronograph at the same time but the LabRadar chronograph is pricier than most folks want to buy.

Also, I like to shoot some factory ammunition over the chronograph with each of my guns. It gives me an idea if the gun is fast or slow.

I usually do not re-shoot a particular load over the chronograph unless it is in a different rifle or it has been some time since I checked it. When I was competing, I'd re-chronograph rounds more frequently but not as much any more.

 

[KYregular]

I have been very pleased with this. $100 or less. Setup on a tripod and shoot from my bench. Just make sure that you set it far enough away to avoid muzzle blast interference.

 

[wrench459]

I found a used mx-2000 tripod at goodwill to mount the prochrono on.
Believe that the price was around five dollars.

 

[Chuck R.]

I chrono when working up loads, for velocity and consistency. For the long range stuff I chrono the same load during diferent temp ranges to give the ballistic software some data points to interpolate.

For my handgun defense loads, I chrono the factory stuff, then build a reload using the same bullet at the same MV range for practice.

 

[jmr40]

I only use mine for working up loads. 5-10 rounds at the beginning. I may occasionally check loads from time to time just to be sure nothing has changed

so pretty much the chrono speed means nothing about pressure?

It means everything. While a chrono can't calculate the exact pressure, it can let you know when you are getting above max pressures. Speed and pressure go hand in hand. The more pressure, the more speed.

If your manual says 59 gr of powder is supposed to give 2900 fps @ 59,500 PSI the chronograph is the best way for casual loaders to know if they are approaching over pressure loads. When your chrono shows 2900 fps that is your max load in that rifle and should be very near 59,500 PSI. Some rifles my never reach 2900 fps even with 59 gr of powder. Others may hit 2900 fps with only 57.5 gr of powder.

As long as someone stays with milder or mid level loads a chronograph isn't really that important. But if you want to load to your rifles full potential I think they are necessary. Most cartridges have max pressure of around 60,000 psi. Typical pressure signs that people look for don't show up until you hit 70,000 psi. By the time you see them, you are way over pressure. By using a chronograph I can load a few rounds at 57, 57.5, 58, 58.5 gr and shoot them for both accuracy and speed. If I start getting close to 2900 fps at any point then I know to proceed with caution. Maybe stop altogether.

I also try to balance accuracy with speed. As primarily a hunter anything at 1 MOA is about as much as I can take advantage of from field shooting positions. I'll take use the fastest load that still is 1 MOA. If it is better than 1 MOA, great. But I'm not going to choose a load at 2800 fps that shoots .5 MOA over a 2900 fps load at .7 MOA.

It really depends, but as a rule I rarely load right to max powder charge, usually stopping 1/2-1 full grain below max. But at times I have gone 1/2-1 gr over max listed powder charges as long as I'm under the max speed expected. That is a judgement call. Those loads are perfectly fine in my rifle, but may be over pressure in another.

 

[dgod]

I chrony each load for each caliber. Usually 5 to 10 rounds each, then correlate the data by load and caliber. I have shot as many as 5 calibers and 2 - 3 loads of each over the chrony at one trip to the range.

just my $0.02
dg

Yes, I work up, then when I'm close to where I want to be, then it's 5 to 10... For Instance, I wouldn't try 10 rounds of 300 Win Mag, but I would try 10 rounds of 5.56mm. If you get my drift. I probably load 12-14 calibers from 9mm to 300WM, so using the Chrony is a planned event for me. Outdoor range that is about 50 yds from parking... That's a lot of packing...

 

[Sauer Grapes]

Handgun is a little different. I chrono for velocity to make sure I hit power factor. Then I test for POA/POI.
I have tested my carry ammo to see where I'm at with shorter barrel guns. Especially with the snub revolver. It's more a curiosity thing I guess.
I have to retest some .40 hand loads when I get a chance, and some warmer weather...lol.

 

[wrench459]

Short barrels are notoriously slow.
So slow that some hollow points just might not open up fully.

 

[hdwhit]

ohihunter 2014 asked:
I'm debating on getting a chronograph to check some loads and wondering how often you guys use it?

A chronograph can be a useful tool when used properly, but it is not an essential piece of equipment.

I've addressed this in detail in other posts, but every light-sensing chronograph I am familiar with has no provision for external calibration. That means the velocity it reports will only serendipitously be correct. It should be "in the ballpark", but it will almost certainly not be "correct". It is useful for comparing with other readings taken by the same chronograph to ascertain relative velocities of projectiles and consistency from round to round.

Say you have your good load and it checks in at say 3200fps with say 10 shots do you call it done and that's all the testing you do for that load? Do you chronograph for each lot of powder?

When I am developing a load, every round goes over the chronograph; some are shot with more emphasis on getting the velocity data and others are shot with an emphasis on accuracy, but all data is collected. The data may not prove to be useful, but if not collected, it cannot be retrieved later.

Say I'm doing a load workup for a rifle do you chronograph each load first or find what's most accurate first then see if your pushing it too fast?

When developing a load, for each incremental increase in powder charge, I load 10 rounds. Five are shot over the chronograph with a focus on getting readings. The second five are shot for accuracy with the only chronograph-related concern being to not shoot it.

Do you try and keep it under book max fps or right on?

Once I start developing a load, I don't pay any attention to the velocity predicted by the book. I will know whether I achieved it once I get my data back to the house and start evaluating it. And the reality of life that I have yet to have a load deliver the same velocity published in the book; mine are always slower.

It's kind of like the old Kenny Rogers song, "You never analyze yer data while yer sittin' at range; there'll be time enough fer analysis when the shootin's done."

If the fact your 16 inch barrel AR is not delivering the same velocity as published data compiled using a bolt action rifle with a 20 inch barrel or a universal receiver with a 26 inch barrel and that's going to cause you to go off trying to figure out how to get to book velocity, then by all means DON'T buy a chronograph.

I guess another question is as long as you have an accurate load what's the point of chronographing?

1. Since the "real world" velocity is rarely the same as in the published data, the chronograph lets me know what "neighborhood" I have actually ended up in.
2. It provides a check on whether or not my components are producing consistent results.

 

[murf]

it is nice to know the true muzzle velocity of the bullet when you are trying to hit things at 200, 300, 400, etc. yards. ballistics tables will get you closer with an accurate mv number.

a chrony will help you tell (extreme spread) if you components are working well with each other. some powders just don't work with certain bullets. some bullets just don't work well in some rifles. gotta love this handloading game!

if your 180 grain bullet in your 300 win mag is showing 3300 fps on the chrony, you went too far. if you are not close to the mvs listed in the manual, something is not right.

i usually work up a rifle accuracy load first, then check it on the chrony and compare the mv to the manual.

i chrony all loads when working up a pistol load because my pistol is almost always different from the test barrel used in the manual. a little adjustment has to be made for the difference so i don't try to match the manual's 7.5 inch test barrel velocity when my gun only has a 4 inch barrel.

i have been using a chrony for about twenty years now. before that, i relied on case signs, recoil, sticky extraction, etc. to make sure i didn't blow up the gun.

the chrony is a lot better, imo, than the old method.

murf