How to handle a gun deal

[magyars4]

Mods, please feel free to move this....

Never had this situation before so I am looking for advice.
We have agreed in principle to a trade...my firearm for his, plus money from him.
He is out of state so both guns are going thru FFLs.
However the gentleman wants to hold the money part of the deal until he receives the firearm from me....the money is considerable.
What is normal or usual in this type of circumstance?

 

[edwardware]

Since you're already using FFLs, it's not a legal question. Myself, I would skip it entirely; you might be able to engage the FFL on his end to act as an escrow agent, but the FFL would be a fool to involve himself.

 

[deadin]

How considerable is the money?
There are companies that specialize in escrow (other than real estate), but it isn't inexpensive.

 

[SharpDog]

My idea: Do the firearm swap and the money as a separate deal for example through paypal or your bank. My bank (and I believe Paypal) will allow you to dispute the deal after the fact if the item is not delivered as promised. I have many, many times disputed payment and always have been reimbursed by my bank.

Now: Neither Paypal nor likely any banks will look favorably on a firearms deal but they will still likely honor any claims.

 

[Frank Ettin]

...Neither Paypal nor likely any banks will look favorably on a firearms deal but they will still likely honor any claims.

Why do you believe this is true? Do you have any verifiable, credible evidence to support your conjecture? I suspect that many of us have heard stories about PayPal's refusal to participate in a transaction if it is aware that firearms are involved, and PayPal's closing the accounts of the parties to the transaction.

While such information is anecdotal, it is a least reason to have doubts about PayPal's willingness to followthrough if it learns that a deal involves guns.

...he gentleman wants to hold the money part of the deal until he receives the firearm from me....

Since this is the Legal Forum, the legal issue presented here is that if the OP agrees to the other party's terms, and if the guy fails to pay, the OP's recourse is limited to suing on the debt. That's expensive and time consuming. I would never consider doing a deal on those terms, expect. perhaps. with a very good, long term, close friend.

An escrow arrangement would always be the best way to handle something like this, but finding a suitable, reliable party to be the escrow agent might be difficult.

 

[SharpDog]

Why do you believe this is true? Do you have any verifiable, credible evidence to support your conjecture? I suspect that many of us have heard stories about PayPal's refusal to participate in a transaction if it is aware that firearms are involved, and PayPal's closing the accounts of the parties to the transaction.

While such information is anecdotal, it is a least reason to have doubts about PayPal's willingness to followthrough if it learns that a deal involves guns.



Since this is the Legal Forum, the legal issue presented here is that if the OP agrees to the other party's terms, and if the guy fails to pay, the OP's recourse is limited to suing on the debt. That's expensive and time consuming. I would never consider doing a deal on those terms, expect. perhaps. with a very good, long term, close friend.

An escrow arrangement would always be the best way to handle something like this, but finding a suitable, reliable party to be the escrow agent might be difficult.

I am asserting over Paypal but I can certainly attest to my banks involvement in such transactions. For example I have had a several hundred $$$ transaction overturned for a 6.5 Grendel upper which resulted in a fraud investigation of the seller. I had all my monies returned on day 1. This is one of a score of such transactions (I do a LOT of online transactions). You will need to do due dilligence ... contacting the other party, saving the emails, etc. But you can get satisfaction. I have done it many times. I assume all of the major banks have this policy.

Another example is when someone swiped my CC# during an onling transaction for a laptop and ordered over $700 worth of LaCoste clothes. Also got my monies back on day 1 after filing. Check with your bank and pay with a credit card. I believe that Paypal has a similar policy but IDK about that.

Many, Many times when the item was simply not shipped.

 

[entropy]

In this case, I'd handle it by passing on it.

 

[WestKentucky]

2 ways to do it. Best way is a straight up you buy his, he buys yours deal. Make the price reasonable on the one that is coming with boot money. Make the price on the other that same price plus whatever boot is agreed to. Do the deal however you see fit now because it’s a straight up monetary transaction rather than a swap situation. Other way is to pass.

 

[Mr. Zorg]

Why do you believe this is true? Do you have any verifiable, credible evidence to support your conjecture? I suspect that many of us have heard stories about PayPal's refusal to participate in a transaction if it is aware that firearms are involved, and PayPal's closing the accounts of the parties to the transaction.

While such information is anecdotal, it is a least reason to have doubts about PayPal's willingness to followthrough if it learns that a deal involves guns.



Since this is the Legal Forum, the legal issue presented here is that if the OP agrees to the other party's terms, and if the guy fails to pay, the OP's recourse is limited to suing on the debt. That's expensive and time consuming. I would never consider doing a deal on those terms, expect. perhaps. with a very good, long term, close friend.

An escrow arrangement would always be the best way to handle something like this, but finding a suitable, reliable party to be the escrow agent might be difficult.

See subparts 2 (j) & 2(k) of this portion of the PayPal User Agreement. I have done business with individuals who stated their PayPal account was closed by PayPal and barred from ever registering for another PayPal account due to violating this portion of the PayPal user agreement.

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/acceptableuse-full

So maybe that point of discussion falls under the Legal area umbrella for discussion, and is more than anecdotal?

Edited to add: I found the info at this link relevant as well.

https://www.paypal.com/us/smarthelp...iolate-paypal's-acceptable-use-policy-faq4268

 

[Grumulkin]

We have agreed in principle to a trade...my firearm for his, plus money from him.
He is out of state so both guns are going thru FFLs. However the gentleman wants to hold the money part of the deal until he receives the firearm from me....the money is considerable.
What is normal or usual in this type of circumstance?

I would have nothing to do with such a deal. I can see it now. You send him a pristine firearm and in return you get one that isn't so good that you never had a chance to inspect. Then you have to ship the gun you got in trade back to a FFL holder; that is if your buyer will even accept the return.

 

[earlthegoat2]

Ok so a standard money for goods deal goes by handing the full amount of money over for the item.

This deal should go the same way. Your item is worth x and his is worth x-y. He then pays y in money all at once just like in the money deal. That is completely logical

This person is checking the boxes of someone who is completely untrustworthy. After a deal like that was proposed to me, it would make me want to take receipt of their item and money before I ever even shipped my end of the deal. This person is apparently illogical or is trying to get some kind of upper hand on the deal. Even if they don’t screw you over directly with the money deal, someone like this may cause trouble in other ways like by being hyper picky about your item and demand some recompense which seems to be the driving force behind wanting to pull this cramp to begun with. Not worth the risk.

Do business with someone else and don’t look back.

 

[lonegunman]

The deal is for the full amount at the time the gun changes hands,period. If he sends a gun and no money, send it back. During the ban years I sold a dozen AR mags to a guy with similar behavior. The ad said, "USPS money order only", he agreed and send a check. I was about to send it back but he whined, so I told him he could wait two weeks for it to clear. Naturally, it did not. He did message me daily asking when his package would arrive, until he got the bad news.

The deal is the deal, period.

 

[whughett]

Isn’t it standard practice for the seller, in this case both of you in actuality, to hold any monies until the goods are received.
The few guns I have purchased were transacted that way. There is a pucker factor indeed. Sounds like he is actually as distrustful of you as you of he.

 

[bdickens]

Mods, please feel free to move this....

Never had this situation before so I am looking for advice.
We have agreed in principle to a trade...my firearm for his, plus money from him.
He is out of state so both guns are going thru FFLs.
However the gentleman wants to hold the money part of the deal until he receives the firearm from me....the money is considerable.
What is normal or usual in this type of circumstance?

*sniff * *sniff* Y'all smell something?

I would never consider doing a deal on those terms, expect. perhaps. with a very good, long term, close friend

I would never consider doing a deal on those terms, ESPECIALLY with a long term close friend.