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How to improve speed while maintaining accuracy?

Discussion in 'Strategies, Tactics and Training' started by breakingcontact, Feb 10, 2013.

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  1. breakingcontact

    breakingcontact Member

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    At the range, I'm getting pretty good while shooting slow. Sight picture, trigger press, grip, stance, ive got those things down well enough to shoot good...slowly. I want to get faster, so some of these skills that I've got down good enough to shoot slow, I need to improve to shoot fast.

    What are some drills that I can do to increase speed while maintaining the accuracy?

    I get the gun back on target quickly enough but it takes too long for me to reacquire my sight picture. I have to let the sights "settle" longer than I'd like. Typically, is this a grip issue? Stance?

    I am committed to improving my fundamentals and not seeking out the "perfect" gun or dumping a bunch of money into mine. I have the ammo and have access to a great range. I want to make my range time count and am looking for good YouTube videos, drills, books, online resources and tips you've picked up over the years to use while training to achieve my goal of being fast and accurate.
     
  2. Shadow 7D

    Shadow 7D Member

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    Spend the money on classes
    paying for the instruction, the coaching,

    they will see stuff you may have though you were doing right, or just not known you were doing wrong.

    Also shoot matches, the coaching you get for ammo will be worth it.
     
  3. thorazine

    thorazine Member

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    Might not work for everyone but I drink a ton of coffee.

    The jitters make me more accurate some how... (ponders)
     
  4. beatledog7

    beatledog7 Member

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    Do everything slowly, focusing on doing it smoothly. When you think about being smooth, you'll gradually become faster without focusing on speed.

    It's amazing how well it woks.
     
  5. breakingcontact

    breakingcontact Member

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    I can't really afford the classes, but would like to get some one on one local coaching.

    I think I got some local recommendations here recently.

    Looking forward to it. Really respect the great shooters I have seen and I'm hooked on improving my skills.
     
  6. Utryme

    Utryme Member

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    Set multiple targets up, number them. Have a buddy yell out a target number, move, shoot twice, next number. Causes you to think and move. Concentrate on staying within 200% of your normal MOA, not a full rest accuracy. Once your timing improves, accuracy will come.
     
  7. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator

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    The Shadow knows.

    I can't see why one on one coaching would cost less than a class, but if your coach is a rated competitor with a track record in instruction, go for it.

    Avoid finding out the hard way that the most expensive approach by far is to learn bad habits that must be unlearned.
     
  8. breakingcontact

    breakingcontact Member

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    Good drills and suggestions.

    Will try it at the range. Need to hold off on IDPA until I can speed up and keep the accuracy.
     
  9. tuj

    tuj Member

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    No, its a practice issue. It sounds like your eye's are not picking up the sight picture fast enough. Two things could be an issue here: 1) most speed shooters use multiple sight pictures, meaning they will take a picture of the index of the slide for a shot say only 3 yards away, but they will line up a 20-yard shot with precision. Good speed shooters are masters of using the appropriate sight picture for their given skill at that distance and still make hits on target. 2) is that your eye's are not accustomed to remaining focused on the front sight. To fix this, you need to shoot without regard for where your bullet hits, but focus strictly on the front sight, particularly tracking it through recoil.
     
  10. Twmaster

    Twmaster Member

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    No you don't. I recently watch a local IDPA match. There were shooters that were as fast a Quick Draw McGraw and slow as Pokey.

    You will fit in. You will have fun. You will learn.

    My shooting skills are about where you are. I'm a decent shot. I have most of my fundamentals down. I just need to step it up.

    Once you learn how to do things slow and smooth stepping up the game is relatively easy.

    Remember, Slow is smooth. Smooth is fast. It's easier to make the shots count than panic trying to make up for hurried misses.

    I'm just waiting on a new holster than I'll be n the line at the next local IDPA match.
     
  11. Averageman

    Averageman Member

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    I have to agree with you begining to shoot IDPA now.
    You dont have to be an expert and you will get better much quicker if you work on it with others.
    I shoot with folks who have been competing in IDPA since they were teens and they have never been hesitant to assist me in becomming a better shooter.
     
  12. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    Instruction really is the best....fastest and cheapest...route. Especially 1:1 instruction, even at $100/hour.

    However, before you get into drills to build speed, you really need to be sure your fundamentals are correct...otherwise your foundation will crumble as you try to build speed and you'll start building bad habits instead. It isn't so much about drills at first, but more about technique

    Just from your quick description, it does sound like a grip and arm geometry issue. Stance is really a misnomer as how you stand doesn't really have a lot of affect unless you are really inconsistent...besides, Weaver and Modern Isosceles use the same foot placement.

    Your sights shouldn't have to settle back onto target, with correct technique, they should just automatically return to the same POA if you aren't moving or transitioning between targets.

    1. Are you using isometric tension...push/pull between your hands?
    2. Are you dropping the support elbow to pull the gun back down or have your elbow level?
    3. Are you locking your elbows in an attempt to limit the gun's muzzle flip...hold the gun down?
    4. Are you shooting with your thumbs forward, up, locked down, over lapping...how?
    5 If you were to open you support hand fingers, would they point forward or downward?

    Some other detail questions:
    1. Are you following through after the shot breaks...how?
    2. Are you resetting the trigger in series or parallel with the muzzle flip
    3. Are you seeing the front sight throughout it's arch while flipping?
    4. At what point do you begin your trigger press?
    5. What cues you to begin your trigger press?
     
  13. breakingcontact

    breakingcontact Member

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    Another good suggestion. Going to have to make a list.

    Just shoot into the berm without a target. Nice!
     
  14. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    I've also heard the Bill Drill attributed to Bill Rogers and even Bill Jordan, but it doesn't make much difference. It is a good drill to establish a number of skills.

    I'd refine the description from chest to an 8" circle...paper plates are this size (get chep ones)

    I don't think 2 sec would be extremely fast. I've seen 1.5 secs from highly talented (USPSA) shooters...that was with a .83 sec draw. I would think 1.80 - 2.00 sec would be a good time with 3 sec a good average time
     
  15. Jenrick

    Jenrick Member

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    breakingcontact: Shoot me a PM.

    -Jenrick
     
  16. breakingcontact

    breakingcontact Member

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    Niho, not slow.

    I get hits on target but not nice tight groups at speed.

    As far as your timing request I'm just a recreational IDPA shooter. Perhaps ill do some sort of metric at the range to assess my speed.

    I'm getting a long list of things to do at the range!
     
  17. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    Actually he is a LE friend of mine from KY. He usually shoots it in 2 sec with a G22 out of a Safariland ALS retention holster. His perfect run was with an S&W M&P9 in a time of 1.69 sec.

    Here is the article he wrote for Hilton Yam's MSW (Modern Service Weapons) on the Bill Drill

    I can't do that. The last time I shot a Bill Drill was as part of an IDPA match with an M&P9 and it was right around 2.5 sec...my shots were too close together
     
  18. tuj

    tuj Member

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    One other thing you can do, and I rarely see this system mentioned and don't know why, is you can use a LaserLyte trainer. This thing is a small electronic target and a laser cartridge that you put in your *unloaded* gun and is activated by a strike of the firing pin.

    It's not perfectly accurate since the laser cartridge is in the chamber, but it's fairly close to real-life and allows you to sit on your couch and practice your dry-fires with a good indication of where you would actually hit.

    It's a very good system for feedback as you try to build speed and refine just 'how good' of a sight picture you need to shoot a given distance. Obviously no recoil and but great for working those DA pulls.

    If you can get down to Houston, we will be having some more IDPA classes taught by two highly ranked master shooters later this year. I went to their class in Dec. and it was excellent.
     
  19. Al Thompson

    Al Thompson Moderator Emeritus

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    If you are not using a shot timer, you can't measure your times. Kind of like driving with out a speedometer.

    If you can get active with your local IDPA, you can use the classifier as a benchmark. ;)
     
  20. breakingcontact

    breakingcontact Member

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    Regarding IDPA: that's where I complicated things. I went from shooting in the middle of SSP with a full size, to near the bottom with the Shield.

    Studying on it I think its in the grip because the Shield actually has a better trigger than the full size. The last match I shot was a classifier so my low capacity didn't slow me down.
     
  21. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    It is because of the danger of a newer shooter being tempted, and developing the habit, to watch the laser dot rather than their sights. The other temptation is constantly checking your target after each shot...another very common problem I take quite a bit of time correcting with clients
     
  22. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    This is extremely important.

    You can't go by what feels faster or slower...you have to have a quantitative measure of speed to gauge improvements in technique
     
  23. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    I don't have a Shield, but this is what my grip looks on the FS

    grip052.jpg

    ...and on a SA EMP, who's grip should be about the same length as the Shield

    grip063.jpg
     
  24. Al Thompson

    Al Thompson Moderator Emeritus

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    I do have a Shield and don't see an issue with the grip. In fact, my Shield was more accurate than a couple of full size handguns I used to have. :eek:

    This is exactly where a good coach can come in and diagnose your issues and suggest better ways to do things or at least alternates. ;)
     
  25. breakingcontact

    breakingcontact Member

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    I don't think its an "issue with the grip" of the gun nor how I am gripping it. I've got thumbs forward, I'm high up on the gun. I think its an issue of how much pressure I'm applying in MY grip.

    Hopefully some more range time and whatever kind of coaching I can get will help me improve.

    I think I've just been focusing too much on sight picture/trigger control and getting good results with slow fire that I've neglected to consider my grip pressure.
     
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