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How to: Simple High Power Hot Glue Bullets

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by 25cschaefer, May 13, 2014.

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  1. 25cschaefer

    25cschaefer Member

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    I'm not saying to do this but this is how I did it.

    I have seen on youtube, how to make and shoot hot glue bullets and have come up with my own way that most anyone with basic tools can do. This will also work with wax bullets.

    I started with 38 spl because it is pretty universal, everybody has one or ten. I also decided to convert the brass to use 209 primers because it is about the only primers you can get your hands on right now, they are the cheapest, they are easier to handle, they are generally more powerful than pistol primers, and there are a lot of different powers available.

    This will work with the original pistol primers but they wont be as powerful and you have to use a priming tool and sometimes a press.

    First, the 209 primer conversion:
    Decap the spent shell. (I used unsized brass so it would be easier to load the bullets into)
    IMG_20140512_201549_zpsgnvklpwh.jpg

    Second, use a letter C drill to open up the primer pocket all the way through, the straighter the better. (Be sure to shut your shop door so 1 year olds don't eat everything on your floor, I still can't find that 870 mag spring...)
    IMG_20140512_201628_zps1phzbzpd.jpg

    IMG_20140512_201703_zpst7tcnxir.jpg

    Next, use a larger than the diameter of the 209 rim bit to chamfer a recess for it. Cut deep enough for the 209 to fit flush but try not to go deeper to avoid light strikes. (I use a spent primer for fitting, the less tapping on a live one the better.)
    IMG_20140512_201847_zpsokajdele.jpg

    I know it's ugly but it works.
    IMG_20140512_201909_zpsvajwggnu.jpg

    To make bullets, I just put a light coat of kitchen spray oil, PAM, on my bullet mold of choice and pump it full of glue. Some people on youtube say the mold needs o be very cold when you do this but I have found the only reason to use a freezer is to get it to set better. I am using a low temp gun and multi temp glue. Leave a normal sprew.
    IMG_20140512_202035_zpsf261gbmo.jpg

    IMG_20140512_202134_zpstmk3r4nn.jpg

    Just press the bullet into the shell by hand or into the bench, it seems to get higher velocity if you press them further in but I need a chrony to test that. Prime and you are done.
    IMG_20140512_202201_zpstmimbnwn.jpg

    I am going to the range and well report back with accuracy results. I hope these are accurate enough for grouse, they certainly hit hard enough.

    At 20 ft, out of a 20" rifle (I assume that slows these down compared to a pistol) it went through three layers of loosely hung shipping blankets and stopped in the forth with about 2" of stuffing on the nose. If you don't know, shipping blankets are heavy duty cheap blankets that moving companies use to slide furniture on, not thin sheets. I was very surprised at the power of these.
     
  2. taliv

    taliv Moderator Staff Member

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    show a pic of the recovered bullet after going through the blankets
     
  3. ColtPythonElite

    ColtPythonElite Member

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    I just bought Speer plastic bullets.
     
  4. Swampman

    Swampman Old Fart

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    Have you tried these in a revolver?

    I'd be amazed if my S&W Model 29 would reliably set off battery cup shotgun primers since it occasionally chokes up when fed Tula Large Pistol Magnum primers (the trigger pull IS set kinda light). :D
     
  5. 25cschaefer

    25cschaefer Member

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    They have worked 100% in my wife's Taurus, with a very light hammer spring, two different Ruger Vaqueros, and a Rossi 92. As long as the primers are flush, there shouldn't be an issue.

    As for the bullet, my buddy peeled the batting off as soon as I handed it to him, I'll post some pictures of some shot bullets later. Even after ripping through a blanket and ricocheting around the garage (before I found out how much they penetrate) there is little damage, just a scuff on the nose from concrete.
     
  6. TooManyToys

    TooManyToys Member

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    Very Cool!
    Have you tested any unmodified cases using normal primers,.. Reg. or Mag?
     
    IHmagnum likes this.
  7. Dudemeister

    Dudemeister Member

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    "At 20 ft, out of a 20" rifle (I assume that slows these down compared to a pistol) it went through three layers of loosely hung shipping blankets and stopped in the forth with about 2" of stuffing on the nose."

    That's some serious power.

    I have a box of .45LC shells made specifically for wax bullets powered by a shotshell which I've played with a few times, and while they can punch a piece of paper or make ping sound against a steel target, they can't even go through a tee shirt.

    I used to get USPS medium flat rate boxes (14" x 12"), then put a folded T-Shirt inside. At 25 feet, the bullet would go through the thin cardboard, and get stuck in the shirt. I don't think it ever penetrated even 1 layer of the shirt.

    Accuracy is OK at 15-25 feet, if you consider 6-8" accurate. One thing I noticed is that the bullets sometimes seem to tumble, I've seen it where it hit the target sideways.

    Maybe the profile on your bullets is such that they're more accurate, and maybe the hot glue material properties are better that wax and/or produce a heavier bullet (the ones I have are about 17-18 grains in weight). Try casting some wax bullets in the same mold and see if your mileage varies.
     
  8. 25cschaefer

    25cschaefer Member

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    Testing

    Okay, I wasn't able to make it to the range so I built a trap for my garage using many layers of cardboard stuffed perpendicular to the bullet path, like shooting into the cover of a phonebook.

    I did all testing from an iron sighted Rossi 92 with a 20" barrel because I did not want to alarm the neighbors (it reminded me of the sound a hammer makes striking a coffee can).

    Accuracy, offhand at exactly 20' from the muzzle, was awesome. I'm sure from a bench there would be only one hole. These three bullets penetrated 7 layers of packed cardboard, dented the 8th.
    IMG_20140513_145823_zps0qxswjt2.jpg

    This is a hanging pickle jar lid, it almost penetrated.
    IMG_20140513_145843_zpsw5mkniah.jpg
    See the crack?
    IMG_20140513_145850_zpsi7wlwqyd.jpg

    I shot at 4 layers of hanging denim and it split the first two but upon examination of the bullet, it did not cast well and tumbled hitting tail first.
    IMG_20140513_145936_zpsyg9whbza.jpg
    IMG_20140513_145948_zpsvrhlrqbx.jpg
    The denim bullet and a cardboard bullet, notice the rounded corners on the denim bullet.
    IMG_20140513_150116_zpshbmiyodz.jpg

    This bullet was fired at a shipping blanket, wadded up on the bench and penetrated 5 layers, it also has the first layer of blanket perfectly pasted to it's face.
    IMG_20140513_150019_zpsxbsqonk4.jpg

    I also made a buckshot round; 209 primer, three hot glue 000 buck balls (.318"), and a very slight crimp (just enough to keep them from rolling out). I crimped the shell by using a belled out case and mallet to tap over the actual cartridge. I belled my shell by tapping it over the shoulder of a 308 case (remember, I'm trying to do this in a way anybody can, even without a press).
    IMG_20140513_145831_zps94xtocal.jpg
    All three balls penetrated 6 layers of cardboard. I think that would make a large dog or bear think twice about eating out of a trash can again.
    IMG_20140513_150127_zpsubfmvgjr.jpg
     
  9. Dudemeister

    Dudemeister Member

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    Wow,

    I have no idea where all this power is coming from. Maybe it's because the shell is a .38spl, so there's less rom in there and pressure builds faster ?!?

    The .45LC are slower than molasses and can actually be seen in flight.

    I'll try to make some .38spl.

    I don't have a bullet mold, but for wax, I don't need it. I put some wax in a tray and heat it up. As the wax melts in the tray, I add wax until the soup it about the right height, about 1/2" (length of the bullet). Then I turn the heat down so the wax begins to harden. When it's still fairly soft but solid, I push the shells into the wax, and basically punch out perfectly fitted bullets.
     
  10. Doc7

    Doc7 Member

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    What are hot glue projectiles used for??
     
  11. 25cschaefer

    25cschaefer Member

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    Cost effective, low noise, no recoil, short range, low energy plinking. One could probably shoot these safely anywhere one could shoot airguns, provided of course, if the nanny says you can.

    I'm just going to use them for plinking and maybe small game, we usually shoot grouse at between point blank and 10yds, 25yds is a long range shot and not necessary. If this proves to be accurate out of pistols as well, I could carry my side arm with a couple of these in my pocket for grouse while I'm deer hunting. Right now, I carry my deer rifle, a 22 rifle/pistol and a side arm.

    If you figured out where they hit out of your deer rifle, and you don't carry a side arm, you could carry a couple of these in your pocket for small game.
     
  12. wally

    wally Member

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    I used the same basic primer powered setup to practice draw and shoot. But I just used a plug of paraffin canning wax -- deprime, drill the flash hole, cookie cut a pug of wax into the case, prime and go.

    Minimal penetration was what I was after.

    These days I use and Airsoft replica gun.
     
  13. deadeye dick

    deadeye dick Member

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    This concept is new to me. I am assuming that you use NO powder and just use the primer for power? Is that correct? I never assume anything as you know what the first three letters are in assume:)
    I'd like to know more.
     
  14. 25cschaefer

    25cschaefer Member

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    As for weights...
    My Lyman (steel) 357cal 148gr Wadcutter molds drops them at about 12.5gr
    My Lee (aluminum) 40cal 175gr semi truncated cone drops 15.5gr
    My Lee (aluminum) 000 buck mold drops 4.5gr balls

    As far as cost...
    A pack of 24 glue sticks (125gr each) that cost a little under $5 would make about 200 wadcutter bullets if taking into account sprews. That's about 2.5 cents a bullet and if you shoot a target like a sheet to absorb impact and keep them clean, they are reusable.

    Primers at our local farm store are about 3 cents a shot if you buy in bulk.

    The biggest investment is time but even that is little, much less than standard reloading.
     
  15. 25cschaefer

    25cschaefer Member

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    I am only using primers, today was Winchester Muzzleloader 209s (I think these are hotter than trap load primers).

    The first ones I tried I had to cut apart some cheapy trap loads that had gotten wet, the primers were obviously still good but sometimes the powder would not ignite.
     
  16. 4v50 Gary

    4v50 Gary Moderator Staff Member

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    You sir, are a pioneer.
     
  17. 1KPerDay

    1KPerDay Member

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    What does glue do to the barrel, if anything? I have a LOT of old #97 shotgun primers with nothing to load them in...
     
  18. Reefinmike

    Reefinmike Member

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    Someone with some cnc equipment needs to start reaming out some 38 cases!
     
  19. Busyhands94

    Busyhands94 Member

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    This has certainly gotten my attention, I'm gonna get more glue sticks next time I'm in town!
     
  20. 25cschaefer

    25cschaefer Member

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    The funny thing is, the barrel actually looks cleaner and I was not able to detect with a light, jag, brush or shotgun wad cleaner, any fouling at all.

    I'm not going to make the claim that it cleans the barrel but...

    I'm going to look into making/having made, some drill bits with recess cutters to sell to people so they can do their own with one clean operation, without chatter. If there was interest, that is.
     
  21. Reco Very

    Reco Very Member

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    I would be interested in one, as long as they aren't made of gold.:D
     
  22. 25cschaefer

    25cschaefer Member

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    Ti coating looks like gold.
     
  23. Bwana John

    Bwana John Member

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    Some more notes on gluestick bullets

    In warm temperatures (>75degrees) the bullet can bounce back from a hard flat object just about as far and fast as it was originally shot. (You CAN shoot yer eye out!)

    In cold temps (<35degrees) the bullet shatters when it hits a hard flat object.

    For a "armor-piercing" bullet drop a .177 BB into the mold before adding molten gluestick.

    No mold is needed for 45acp or 45LC, just buy 44 cal gluesticks and cut the sticks into cylinders like wadcutters.

    44 cal gluestick cylinders through a 45 need the primer flash hole enlarged to 1/8" when using standard LR or LP primers. (Case can still safely be used for standard reloading with flash holes enlarged to 1/8")

    44 cal gluestick thru a 45 using LR primers and a drilled out flash hole will penetrate 6 layers of cardboard at point-blank ranges.

    44 cal glue sticks thru a 45 will shoot to "Minute-Of-Dogbowl" at 20 yards (and will substantially dent metal bowl at that range)

    44 cal gluesticks will engage rifling just fine thru a 45.

    ,357/38 cal cast gluestick bullets will NOT leave barrel using standard SR or SP primers and a enlarged flash hole (If you lube the bullet and add a couple of grains of fast pistol powder they will)

    Gluestick rounds with LR primers are substantially quieter than just popping a primer without powder or a projectile.

    Spent primer compound accumulates in the bore pretty fast, much faster than just shooting a similar amount of live ammo, a boresnake every 10 rounds or so keeps it clean

    To make a gang jig for drilling out flash holes use a lenght of 2"x4", scribe a line down the middle of the long axis, use 1/2" drill for 45, 3/8" drill for .357/38 and drill holes along the line you scribed, after drilling out holes saw the wood in half on the scribed line. Put both pieces of wood in vice, and put cases to be drilled out into holes, tighten vice just enough to hold cases from spinning


    Have Fun, and be Safe... Im off to buy some shotgun primers and a letter C drillbit! :cool:
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2014
  24. desidog

    desidog Member

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    I wonder how a gas-checked bullet design would work subbing glue for lead... i ask because i have a couple hundred .30 cal gas checks around, and no lead for my mold... might be interesting in the 1849 pocket.

    The "penetrator core" might help the BC too.
     
  25. blarby

    blarby Member

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    So my question is, could you just use a mag primer ? Without all of the reaming required ?


    With the exception of Fed primers, most 209 primers are large primers pressed in to 209 sized cups.
     
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