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Hunting buddy who doesn't shoot well. Need advice.

Discussion in 'Hunting' started by 627PCFan, Dec 30, 2018.

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  1. Tilos

    Tilos Member

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    I have found any type of shooting competition is the closest simulation of "buck fever" and a "dueling" type 22LR target can be had for less than $40.
    If you both don't have cheap 22 rifles you need to get them as the low ammo cost promotes a lot of practice for cheap.
    A target like this:
    https://www.midwayusa.com/product/426631/caldwell-resetting-target-system-22-caliber-rimfire-steel
    Shot man on man 2 targets each and the top target resets the bottom 4.
    If you always win, he'll ask what it is he is doing wrong and you can teach him about shooting...
    You can spot him a shot or 2 if you still continue to win.
    Once he's picked up on what needs to be done, move the target further out and his marksmanship will need to improve :uhoh:
    :D
     
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  2. EIB0879

    EIB0879 Member

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    I knew a guy like that once. He was a smallish guy that shot a 300 Win Mag and wounded more deer than he killed. He reloaded and was a know it all about firearms. He never learned and we quit hunting with him. Some people just can't stay calm for the shot either. Training can help but not necessarily solve that.
     
  3. Hookeye

    Hookeye Member

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    I focus on the shot and trust my gear.
    Confidence is hard to measure, but I think it a biggie.
    Never shot at a deer.
    I shoot fully expecting them to die from that shot.
    The bullet hit where I want.

    Did miss one 15 yrs ago w shotgun.
    Heard it running does back and forth in tree farm......for 20 minutes.
    Only saw flashes of deer, occasionally an antler.
    Finally saw him in an opening to my left.
    Edge of safe shooting, and I had to stand on my tiptoes to clear a big branch in adjacent tree.
    Trigger finger turned into crowbar and I missed.

    NEVER had that happen before.

    Thankfully the shotgun was an 870 and in recoil I knew what happened and went into an instantaneos rage.
    Next shot dumped him.
    LOL.........still p*sses me off thinking about it.

    Or maybe it's just the Mortiis on my headphones as I type this LOL
     
  4. Hookeye

    Hookeye Member

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    I work w some experienced deer hunters (so it seems).
    Some take a missed shot pretty lightly, just shrug and say it's part of the game.
    Not going into other stuff, but they seem to be cut in general, from a different type of cloth.
    We'll just leave it at that.
     
  5. Hookeye

    Hookeye Member

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    But to add........a couple shocked me when they admitted that they NEVER shoot offhand, and w a rest don't shoot past 50 yards.
    But then none of them thinks good gear and practice is worth it either.
     
  6. Hookeye

    Hookeye Member

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    The avg deer hunter IMHO is pretty clueless and probably watches the Kardashians and never visits a gun forum.
     
  7. illinoisburt

    illinoisburt Member

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    If he is hunting from a blind or stand which allow a rest then focus on excitement or too much magnication. If its unsupported, bench shooting just doesn't help. If anything it can build very poor form. Take your friend out to the range and spend some time away from the bench. Start close like 25 yards and use hunting rig and ammo. If there is an issue it will show up fast.
     
  8. Bfh_auto

    Bfh_auto Member

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    But you miss every shot you don't take. This is the one argument that makes me see red.
     
  9. ridgerunner1965

    ridgerunner1965 Member

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    I used to hunt with a guy like the op talks about. he never shot his gun other than to sight it in.

    he always shot the cheapest gun he could find with ridiculously cheap optics. it was hilarious, when I talked to him maybe about practicing shooting more? he said ammo was too expensive and he couldn't afford it. then he got in his 40,000$ pu and drove home.

    I really like the guy but started making excuses to not hunt with him anymore.i could not stand the carnage. almost every deer he killed had at least 1 leg shot off with tons of meat damage. I mean how hard is it to shoot a deer in the lungs at 50 yrds? makes for messy butchering and lots of waste. I hate waste.

    I just kind of distanced myself from his hunting adventures. don't even get me started on his bow hunting adventures.
     
  10. J-Bar

    J-Bar Member

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    Take him to a skeet or trap range, wear him out on clay birds. Week after week. Then shoot live birds in the field; dove hunting, duck hunting, game farm birds, starlings and pigeons on a friendly farm. Then squirrel hunting, rabbit hunting, rat hunting at a rural dump. Have him shoot so much that he starts to get bored with it.

    He will learn to see game, shoot reasonably quickly and accurately. Deer become big squirrels and rabbits and birds.
     
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  11. Double Naught Spy

    Double Naught Spy Sus Venator

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    Things like this really sound good and will work, if the 'friend' really cared to put any effort into it, which as indicated by several of the posts, too many of them really do not wish to do. As said above, 'missing' is just part of the game, as if they were playing a pickup game of 2 on 2 basketball - sometimes you make a basket, sometimes you don't - no big deal.
     
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  12. Kano383

    Kano383 Member

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    A few questions...

    Where did he aim at?

    Does he understand the anatomy of ungulates in general?

    Did he see pictures showing the vital zones on a deer or similar animal?

    Often, hunters assume that knowing shot placement is natural... It's not. Lots of people don't have a clue how critters are made on the inside, and where the kill switch is located.
     
  13. Mr. Hill

    Mr. Hill Member

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    He probably needs to move down in caliber. Have him try a .243 and lots of offhand practice at the range.
     
  14. 627PCFan

    627PCFan Member

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    I'm not sold he can handle full power 30-06 non-rested. Hes now loading 200 rounds for this coming years practice and I purchased a 2 and a 4 inch ar500 gongs and rubber hangers for offhand target practice so we shall see. I want him hitting consistently offhand.

    Its his hunting property and I'm his guest and he wants me to hunt it with him regularly so I have a vested interest in getting him shooting accurately.
     
  15. Mr. Hill

    Mr. Hill Member

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    My guess is that he’ll be flinching by the third shot of that .30-06 during practice. If he can’t shoot accurately at 40 yards, I’d keep him on a large paper target to see where he’s sending rounds.

    If you have a .243, take it along on your first range session. Let him shoot that rifle first, then 3 shots from his ‘06, then one more from the .243. He’ll figure it out on that second shot.
     
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  16. TheCpaNextDoor

    TheCpaNextDoor Member

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    My advice would be this:

    1) Shoot at the range standing, crouched, and sitting with no rest (priority in that order). No bench. Only bench to sight in.

    2) 30-06 is kind of a lot for deer. What’s wrong with 270? Even that’s enough for blackies. 308 if he’s a stickler about size. Just know that .243 puts deer down and even .223 is okay in certain states. Don’t need the biggest thing to drop a deer. Hunting ammo on its own goes a long way.

    3) Big bipod is something I always have on my guns (Harris made). Largest size. Love it.

    4) Dry fire with a used colored cartridge or snap cap a good bit.

    #3 is cheap (just do it), #4 isn’t a big commitment by itself and works, #1 is invaluable - must do as it really really shows the difference from bench rest, my arm strength by itself needs to improve for offhand, #2 can help a lot but won’t ever replace #4

    I shoot a .270 from different positions, with a bipod, and fall back on snapcaps if I’m flinching or think I may be. Good expanding ammo juices up an already good round.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2019
  17. 627PCFan

    627PCFan Member

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    I at least talked him off the ledge by using 150gn SP's. He wanted to up the ante with 180gn and 220gn bullets. Yup for whitetails. He "invested" in this 30-06 and the rest are all milsurps he got tired of lugging around last year. I think the only way to get him to downgrade is to beat him up with his current choice.
     
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  18. stillquietvoice

    stillquietvoice Member

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    When I first shot bullseye I was given great advise from an older shooter. He said take your pistol aim it at a point on your wall and hold it for 30 seconds. It was tough at first but after several weeks I could hold that pistol steady for 3 min. Started shooting low to mid 280s
    It was all a matter of muscle memory. Have him mount gun off hand 30 seconds at first teach muscle memory before he even pulls trigger. Cheapest practice going.
     
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  19. readyeddy

    readyeddy Member

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    30 06 off hand standing is a lot more enjoyable compared to the bench. The body absorbs the recoil like a sponge. I’m thinking he’ll enjoy his rifle a lot more standing or from field positions.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2019
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  20. Hookeye

    Hookeye Member

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    Too many hunch over on the bench.
    Shooting more upright is more comfy.
     
  21. buck460XVR

    buck460XVR Member

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    Around here, the most popular caliber by far for whitetail, is the ol' ought-six. Biggest pile on the shelf at the gun shop that disappears the fastest right before gun season? 180 grainers.
    Is it cause folks are stupid?.....nope, cause it's a combo that works and works well.

    What your buddy is using is not the problem. It's how he's using it. Denying it and trying to prod him into using something else isn't helping him any.
     
  22. 627PCFan

    627PCFan Member

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    Lets face it for VA whitetails and Blackbears 150gn Partition at 2860fps is more than adequate. Any additional bullet grains only introduce another issue of flinching if it isn't already there. (TBD).
     
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  23. Bfh_auto

    Bfh_auto Member

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    Good job on that.
    150's in a 3006 aren't bad if it isn't a Synthetic stocked sporter rifle. If it is that, I would try to get him to weight it down a bit at least for practice. I filled my muzzleloader with lead shot until I got close to hunting season. It made 300ssts and 120 of 777 seem mild compared to a 90 gr charge without the added weight.
     
  24. IWAC

    IWAC Member

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    Those three little words that mean so much. PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE!. Also, we shoot best with what kicks us least! In his present condition, the man, no matter how "fragile" he may be is no hunter, and shouldn't even be allowed in the field! At least not till he shows some respect for the animals he is wounding, and displays some middling skill at riflery! Fortunately, he had you to put the deer out of their misery. I think one reason he shoots so lousily is he is afraid of the gun! My son-in-law is an educator, not inclined to take counsel from anyone, and just HAD to have a 300 Winchester Short Magnum, because "his research showed him it was the best caliber." He was always telling me "I missed a coyote at 460 yards. Too right! He was afraid of the gun! It KICKED!:what: He has a beautiful 270 in his closet!

    Anyway, Hodgdon has some reduced load info on their website using 4895 powder, and some manufacturers actually offer reduced recoil loads for children and people like him. He NEEDS that, or a smaller gun! .243, 257 Roberts, 6mm Remington all come to mind. If he got some reduced recoil loads or a lighter recoiling gun, and even 20 rounds of range time before hunting season, with proper coaching, he might be able to kill his next deer humanely. O.K., rant over. Hopefully, he will see the error of his ways.
     
  25. Mr. Hill

    Mr. Hill Member

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    Yup +1 on IWAC’s post, I was looking at Remington’s website about their managed recoil ammunition, and that would really help him out.
     
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