30 cal slob
Member
Stevelyn said:
wish i could tell you, but i've never had whale meat. willing to give it a try, though.
only place i know of where you can order it in a restaurant is in japan ("research" wales).
and they eat it RAW.
Hunting Gray Whales, Tribal Style
- Thread starter 30 cal slob
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wish i could tell you, but i've never had whale meat. willing to give it a try, though.
only place i know of where you can order it in a restaurant is in japan ("research" wales).
and they eat it RAW.
Novus Collectus
Member
I don't know about in the restaurants in these two countries, but they do sell whale meat in Norway and Iceland I believe.
Kimber1911_06238
Member
seems a little silly to be busting the stones of a people who have been hunting whales since long before this country existed...sheesh
Cliff47
Member
I say that if the tribe is going to authorize harvesting of a whale (which the tribal council DID NOT in this case), these 'hunters' need to do it in the traditional manner. The use of a harpoon (traditional), and hang on for the "Nantucket Sleighride". None of this safety boat nonsense, motorized chase boat or the oversize fowling pieces to dispatch the whale. Make it a sporting proposition, and let them tow it back to the community as their ancestors did before them.
At the last (authorized) whale hunt, after harpooning and then shooting the whale (multiple times, if memory serves a Barrett bolt-action in .50 BMG was used), the whale was towed back by a motor launch, and then they had some kids doing back-flips on the body of the whale. Not the most respecful way to treat the prize.
At the last (authorized) whale hunt, after harpooning and then shooting the whale (multiple times, if memory serves a Barrett bolt-action in .50 BMG was used), the whale was towed back by a motor launch, and then they had some kids doing back-flips on the body of the whale. Not the most respecful way to treat the prize.
stormspotter
Member
Hunting gray whales
Maybe it was shot with the .50 Jug round.
Does anyone remember this round from the days of Skeeter Skelton. The .50 Jug was a round desigend by his "friend" Jug. It was a 44 magnum necked up to .50 caliber.
Maybe it was shot with the .50 Jug round.
Does anyone remember this round from the days of Skeeter Skelton. The .50 Jug was a round desigend by his "friend" Jug. It was a 44 magnum necked up to .50 caliber.
ArfinGreebly
Moderator Emeritus
Fox News
Saw a report of this on Fox News this morning.
They kept using the term "machine gun," and kept pushing that aspect of the story when interviewing an official in the Northwest.
They asked him if a machine gun had been used; he said "yes" to that.
*Sigh*
I guess someone needs to send Fox News a note with some source material, pointing out that .50 BMG doesn't turn every rifle that fires it into a "machine gun" for crying out loud.
I guess, using that logic, that when I shoot a popular .22 cal cartridge from my Ruger MkII, for that period of time, my pistol becomes a "long rifle." Hey, after all, it's the cartridge that determines what you're shooting.
Saw a report of this on Fox News this morning.
They kept using the term "machine gun," and kept pushing that aspect of the story when interviewing an official in the Northwest.
They asked him if a machine gun had been used; he said "yes" to that.
*Sigh*
I guess someone needs to send Fox News a note with some source material, pointing out that .50 BMG doesn't turn every rifle that fires it into a "machine gun" for crying out loud.
I guess, using that logic, that when I shoot a popular .22 cal cartridge from my Ruger MkII, for that period of time, my pistol becomes a "long rifle." Hey, after all, it's the cartridge that determines what you're shooting.
Vern Humphrey
Member
The tribe contends -- and in my opinion rightly so -- that they have a right to take the occasional whale. Whale hunting is part of their culture and religion -- and the fact that whales are rare nowadays is not their fault. Of only native peoples hunt whales, the catch is sustainable.
They carry a .50 BMG rifle (not a machinegun) to administer a coup de grace -- a humane death.
They carry a .50 BMG rifle (not a machinegun) to administer a coup de grace -- a humane death.
So I guess this tribe had harpoons from the dawn of time and never hunted with anything different, right? I see the ceremonial part being that they hunt the whale, not that they have to use archaic technology. Even primitive tribes adopted better technology when it was available to them, and usually became quite proficient with it. At least that's what Ole General Custer had to say . . .
To complain about using modern technology on this hunt is ridiculous if you ask me (which no one actually did, but I chose to opine anyway).
To complain about using modern technology on this hunt is ridiculous if you ask me (which no one actually did, but I chose to opine anyway).
Vern Humphrey
Member
In point of fact, the .50 BMG rifle is not the primary hunting weapon -- as I said, it's used to deliver the coup de grace.
Novus Collectus
Member
I agree. Not only was it a major part of their tribal life, it can be argued that it still is even with the long hiatus and slightly different methods. They at least still require them to use a canoe and harpoon which means they have to get damn close first.
From Seattle
The problem with the hunt is that it was not a "tribal hunt" it was a few members of the tribe who were not willing to go through the correct processes and went out on there own with improper equipment (motor boats instead of canoes, and seal spears, and I think the wrong rifle) and shot a whale. They are currently be prosecuted by the tribe and then the feds get to come at them.
The problem with the hunt is that it was not a "tribal hunt" it was a few members of the tribe who were not willing to go through the correct processes and went out on there own with improper equipment (motor boats instead of canoes, and seal spears, and I think the wrong rifle) and shot a whale. They are currently be prosecuted by the tribe and then the feds get to come at them.
Cliff47
Member
In the meantime, the whale they killed has become food for the crabs, rather than feeding the tribe members. Anybody for voting them off the island??
DoubleTapDrew
Member
Unfortunately what will come to mind in the majority of the public is this:
Vern Humphrey
Member
The Coast Guard is shooting whales now?!?!
Sharps-shooter
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Well, poaching is poaching, and that's not right. Apart from that, I think:
1. The Makah are allowed to hunt gray whales. They just have to do the paperwork, just like when I want to hunt deer.
2. They hunt grey whales rather than belugas because that is what lives in their neck of the ocean. Same reason I hunt whitetails rather than the much tastier caribou.
3. Grey whales are not that rare. There are probably 20,000 or so in the pacific northwest, probably about as many as before people started hunting them.
4. In recent years, changes have been made to the way people hunt, in order to make the hunting more humane and safer. People used to hunt deer by dropping out of trees on them with spears. Now we use rifles. True, it gives the deer less of a fighting chance, but it also results in fewer spoiled deer and fewer damaged hunters. Same deal with the whaling. The harpoon is there so you don't lose the whale, the rifle is to kill it.
I was working with the tribe when they had their first whale hunt in recent years, back in the late 1990's. I think the people were very caught up in an air of celebration, both about the hunt itself and the fact that they finally got to have the hunt. apparently some people had been pushing for it for years, and it was finally able to happen. I thought everyone was respectful about it, but not somber. Pretty much like when you succesfully hunt any other animal. Only it was big, and it was a group effort.
So, on the whole, I think it's great that they hunt whales. But of course I'm in favor of doing it sustainably, ie not poaching.
1. The Makah are allowed to hunt gray whales. They just have to do the paperwork, just like when I want to hunt deer.
2. They hunt grey whales rather than belugas because that is what lives in their neck of the ocean. Same reason I hunt whitetails rather than the much tastier caribou.
3. Grey whales are not that rare. There are probably 20,000 or so in the pacific northwest, probably about as many as before people started hunting them.
4. In recent years, changes have been made to the way people hunt, in order to make the hunting more humane and safer. People used to hunt deer by dropping out of trees on them with spears. Now we use rifles. True, it gives the deer less of a fighting chance, but it also results in fewer spoiled deer and fewer damaged hunters. Same deal with the whaling. The harpoon is there so you don't lose the whale, the rifle is to kill it.
I was working with the tribe when they had their first whale hunt in recent years, back in the late 1990's. I think the people were very caught up in an air of celebration, both about the hunt itself and the fact that they finally got to have the hunt. apparently some people had been pushing for it for years, and it was finally able to happen. I thought everyone was respectful about it, but not somber. Pretty much like when you succesfully hunt any other animal. Only it was big, and it was a group effort.
So, on the whole, I think it's great that they hunt whales. But of course I'm in favor of doing it sustainably, ie not poaching.
It is not likely a real machinegun. Under CA law all .50 caliber weapons are illegal "assault weapon". Just as named AK models and named AR15 type models and many other semi auto firearms are. Well the only criteria for a BMG firearm is that is is chambered in .50 BMG, it can be a single shot and is still an assault weapon.
I know in Alaska I read about natives hunting whales with such a firearm (legaly), so I imagine they are doing the same in this instance.
Since this is being told from the CA spin on things, any .50 cal used in anything is going to become a ".50 caliber machinegun". They essentialy capture it with other measures, but then give the up close killing blow with a point blank BMG round in the right spot.
Now whether someone feels this is right or wrong is another topic entirely. I find it ironic when people argue for the right to partake in a "tribal" custom yet insist on using the "evil whiteman's" modern tools. Shouldn't they be out there spearing it on canoes as was the actual custom?
I know in Alaska I read about natives hunting whales with such a firearm (legaly), so I imagine they are doing the same in this instance.
Since this is being told from the CA spin on things, any .50 cal used in anything is going to become a ".50 caliber machinegun". They essentialy capture it with other measures, but then give the up close killing blow with a point blank BMG round in the right spot.
Now whether someone feels this is right or wrong is another topic entirely. I find it ironic when people argue for the right to partake in a "tribal" custom yet insist on using the "evil whiteman's" modern tools. Shouldn't they be out there spearing it on canoes as was the actual custom?
The Makah in the canoe do not have a rifle. Once they harpoon the whale a motor boat drives up and delivers the coup de grace with the rifle, in order to make the kill as humane as possible. I was stationed in La Push, WA (about 30 miles south on the coast from the Makah Res) for 4 years and the canoes the Quillayute were building probably could mount an M2. The canoes are carved out of trees and are pretty darn big. This is not grampa's Old Town we're talking about.
Having lived there for 4 years and seen what conditions are like on the reservation I applaud their attempts to keep their culture alive and to resurrect traditions that have fallen by the wayside. I won't try to describe what life is like for some of the Quillayute but it can be pretty grim. Again, they have to paddle their canoe after the whale, harpoon it, THEN they shoot the whale and tow it to the beach.
Please don't mistake any of this as support for anyone who may have broken the law by taking the whale illegally.
Novus Collectus
Member
In the last legal hunt which was the 1999 hunt, the agreement with NOOA and the IWC was that the rifleman was in the canoe with the harpooner.
tinygnat219
Member
Do the Natives up there sell permits for this kind of thing? Imagine, you can actually use that .50 BMG and call it a hunting rifle.
U.S.SFC_RET
Member
dm1333 Quoted:
I love the Makah people. seem to be very accepting to us fishermen coming up there to fish on their reservation, some of the biggest kings I had ever caught came from there. Peaceable people. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water when it comes to the Makah indian people.
Let it be known about the media, again they are misconstruing the truth. My personal feelings are that they should be held for libel in this country when they knowingly decieve the public to get them thinking in a manner to serve their own interests. They don't have your own best interest at heart, you can take that one to the bank. The 2000 election taught me a very important lesson when it comes to people, especially in places of importance. There are hidden agendas and this one is no exception .50 BMG Machinegun Hmmm...
That port did nothing but give me the pucker factor every time I launched from there in '05. Cotton pickin fog would just roll in so fast into the Pacific Ocean. Waves would crash on the rocks comin in when you can't even see five feet in front of your own bow. People die coming into that port involving small craft. Rough water.
I love the Makah people. seem to be very accepting to us fishermen coming up there to fish on their reservation, some of the biggest kings I had ever caught came from there. Peaceable people. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water when it comes to the Makah indian people.
Let it be known about the media, again they are misconstruing the truth. My personal feelings are that they should be held for libel in this country when they knowingly decieve the public to get them thinking in a manner to serve their own interests. They don't have your own best interest at heart, you can take that one to the bank. The 2000 election taught me a very important lesson when it comes to people, especially in places of importance. There are hidden agendas and this one is no exception .50 BMG Machinegun Hmmm...
News Shooter
Member
Correction..We're sorry
No, we're not really
NEAH BAY, Wash. (AP) -- In stories Sept. 8 and Sept. 9 about the shooting of a California gray whale, The Associated Press, relying on information from the National Marine Fisheries Service, reported erroneously that the weapons used was .50-caliber machine gun. Further investigation by the agency determined that it was a large-caliber rifle.
©
No, we're not really
NEAH BAY, Wash. (AP) -- In stories Sept. 8 and Sept. 9 about the shooting of a California gray whale, The Associated Press, relying on information from the National Marine Fisheries Service, reported erroneously that the weapons used was .50-caliber machine gun. Further investigation by the agency determined that it was a large-caliber rifle.
©
Sharps-shooter
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Indeed it wasn't. However, note that state laws generally do not have jurisdiction over Indian reservations (except the Seneca Res in NY). Also note, that the tribe in question is located in the Nw corner of Washington state, and can therefore be presumed not to be bound by CA state law.
Actually, I believe the traditional custom in that culture was to hunt the whales with the best tools you had available.
In the really old days, they used to use falconry. But the birds that could pick up whales are all gone now. Probably because of lead shot.
BlisteringSilence
Member
And DDT. Don't forget DDT. It killed birds. And made a hold in the ozone layer. And I'm pretty sure it killed Kennedy too. I think I read that somewhere on the internets.
Oh I must have been tired when I wrote that. I was under the impression that it was a CA whale killed off Washington and being told by a CA paper. Reading the original post now I do not know where I got that assumption. Posting while tired strikes again
It was a whale killed of Washington, and the story being erroneosly told by a Washington paper.
I still think one should use traditional hand tools to harvest animals nobody else can legaly harvest if the reason it is allowed is to preserve an old custom.
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