I am having a hard time trying to decide on a caliber for a defensive handgun

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Don't pick a 1911 unless you are going to practice extensively. If you are looking for a home defense gun, you want something that is simple to use and intrinsically safer that a 1911. Chances are, you are going to be woken up from a deep sleep and you brain won't be fully functional. A 1911 is a pro's gun and design for someone with full control of his faculties. You have to disengage the safety and the trigger is relative light.

My suggestions would be a double action revolver, double action auto or something similar. In the case of a double action, there are no safeties to disengage, but the double action is heavy enough to resist an accidental discharge in the event you aren't thinking (half asleep) and put your finger on the trigger. A glock with a 8 pound NY trigger, a Kahr or most double action autos give the same effect.

Remember, you will almost certainly will not be ready, and probably not thinking clearly in the first few minutes when you wife/girlfriend wakes you in the middle of the night because she hears a noise. Pick you gun based on that criteria, not what is the ultimate 'shooter'.

I'd also seriously consider a weapon light. I have a SureFire on my G26. You get the bonus of being able to see, and blinding the other person.
 
.357 mag. As stated...you can use/practice with .38 special and move up to the mag rounds. Weapon of choice: used Ruger Speed Six, 2 3/4 inch barrel or GP100 with 3 inch barrel.
 
All the above will get the job done . . . provided it fits your hand well, you shoot it well and it doesn't malfunction.

It's kind of a champagne headache isn't it!;)

HOWEVER . . .

For home defense, consider these points:

1. OVERPENETRATION - Overpenetration can kill a loved one and/or even exit the house and enter another one, killing or wounding other innocent people. Overpenetration is bad, of course. So, choose your ammo wisely and use a type that will fragment well once it penetrates a simple wall.

If you choose a .357 . . . load it down with .38spl. self defense ammo that won't penetrate. .45ACP? Ditto with the lighter, fragmenting loads.


2. TIME OF NEED - Most perps will come after dark. I'm a huge fan of nightsights and have 'em on my Kimber Ultra CDP .45 auto. Put the center green dot between the back two and there's where the bullet goes.

If you use nightsights, keep the firearm covered with something that blocks the view of the three "lightning bugs" when the perp is working his way through the room, for you don't want HIM to pick up your gun while you sleep.

Lazers say . . . "shoot at the source of this red line." Nightsights can't be seen by the perp as long as the barrel is pointing his way.

3. LET THERE BE LIGHT! - Keep a small tactical-type flashlight handy. Mine stays under my pillow. I would use it to verify my target is hostile, while also instantly blinding him, before I decided to pull the trigger. You sure don't want to shoot your teenage daughter who is sneaking back into the house after sneaking out!!!

4. DON'T GIVE 'EM MUCH TO GRAB ONTO - I prefer my house guns to have shorter barrels!!! The longer barrels can bump into things as you swing it around. Also, you don't want a struggle to break out where the perp may get a firm grasp onto your gun and wrench it away from you.

5. REVOLVER OR AUTO? - Whatever you shoot well. I use the Kimber mainly because of the nightsights, but if I ever add nightsights to my 3" barrelled Model 65 and 25-2 S&W revolvers my preference would quickly swing to those guns.

Why? Well, when your are startled out of a deep sleep to the hint of impending danger your mind will still be a little foggy, and nothing is as simple to bring into action as a point and shoot revolver.

Also, if the perp DOES grab the barrel of a wheelgun you can still pull the trigger. But if he can push the slide of your auto back just a little, all you have is a paperweight you two are struggling to get control of. He's wide awake and you are in a fog. Not good odds!

6. THINGS THAT GO BARK IN THE NIGHT - Get a dog, it will love you for it and give you lots of warning to the sound (or scent) of an intruder. The dog may run the threat off too before you wake up much, so you won't have to shoot the S.O.B. and then spend months in court as the perp or his heirs sues you in civil court to support the low-life's family for the next 50 years.

Plus, the dog will grow on you, I promise!

7. SECURE THE CASTLE - Make it as hard for a perp to break in as you can.

8. FOR $350? - Get a fine, used S&W, Colt or Ruger double action revolver. Either .357 or .38spl. will do just fine to protect your castle from home invasion . . . and all three brands have the quality that you can bet your life on!

Dollar for dollar on a budget, you'll get typically a more reliable and more accurate firearm for your money with a .357 or .38 spl. revolver. If you have a choice and the guns are equal in other ways, choose a .357 over the .38.
 
General concensus is that .380 and larger will do the job.
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According to who? People like dr gary roberts are saying things like the .380 isn't a good choice at all even for a bug.

Get a 9mm, cheap practice ammo (the really important thing), and plenty of power to penetrate deeply enough and expand. You can download a .357 to .38spl but practice rounds are still more expensive.
 
I'd vote .357 as well. I got a used GP-100 in really good condition for $330.
 
Don't worry about the caliber as .380 on up is okay. More consideration should be given to the type of pistol, and that can be determined by trying as many different types as is possible, selecting the one that best fits your needs/desires.
 
couldn't agree more - original posted talked about defense, carry, stopping power and price. Surely you have to choose the platform/weapons system in conjunction with calibre. I for one would be perfectly happy with a .38 revolver or a 9mm semi (give me a g19 for carry) and think that anything more powerful that you can control is just icing on the cake. If you are interested in a revolver I think the benefits of getting one that can shoot both .38 and .357 outweigh the disadvantages.
 
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While there are many good options for you at this point, I'm going to vote for a 9mm semi-auto. You are already familiar with the feel of your Bersa. It wouldn't be that difficult to get used to the feel of a larger 9mm semi-auto, such as the Ruger. I personally find that I don't shoot revolvers as well as I do semi-autos.

In terms of the caliber, I think that 9mm is a good compromise in terms of power, recoil and cost. Lower ammo costs equals more range time, and more range time should lead to better shot placement if you ever need to defend yourself.

Good luck with your purchase!

TMann
 
The .38 Special I know isn't much of a step up from the .380,
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It's a BIG step up, especially with the "FBI" load, especially from Buffalo Bore.

Any reliable firearm 9x19mm and above would do, circumstances depending (your size, build, etc.)

I have four alternate CCW guns, a 2" S&W .38Special Model 36, a Glock 19 9x19mm, a 3" S&W .357 Model 65, and a Norinco M1911 .45. All of them have strengths and weaknesses in various environments, but all are credible CCW guns.
 
A DAO 357 Ruger SP101 5-shot revolver for a CCW... "Capacity" is not a big issue in civilian SD situations, the vast majority end in less than 3 rounds...However, reliability, effectiveness, and ease of operation under stress ARE big issues.
 
FYI, the .38 Special Chicago load is far superior to the .380 ACP and easily tops the 9 mm, shot for shot.

Jerry
 
I think you need to decide what format of weapon you want before caliber,
an auto or a semi. Which one do you shoot best and feel the most comfortble with? Then you decide what size weapon you want, sub-compact,compact,or mid to full size. That will make picking caliber alot easier when you narrow it down to the platform you wish to use. Find the gun that seems to "fit" your hand, and your needs the best. You can almost always get the gun you like in 9mm/40/45 for autos and .38/.357 for wheelies.

I have a gun in each of the mentioned calibers and feel that the 9mm is great for sub to compact guns, the .40 is great in a mid sized gun and the .45 is awesome in a full sized 1911. The .38 is great in an airweight S&W and the .357 is awesome in a larger framed wheelie. I feel just picking a gun because of its caliber and capacity is just a small part of the process of picking the right gun. Figure out what the gun is mostly going to be used for, that will help you pick the platform. If all else fails just rent a bunch at the range, while it may be little expensive, it's cheaper than spending $700 on a gun you end up not liking/carrying or use. Good luck.
 
FYI, the .38 Special Chicago load is far superior to the .380 ACP and easily tops the 9 mm, shot for shot.
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You're talking about a 158gr lswchp +P round? That load is notorious for not expanding after going through clothing out of a 2" barrel. It is in no way better than 9mm.
 
I'm with the 357 group. A Ruger will be a good reliable piece. Yeah, you may not get that SA follow up shot like a pistol, but a 357 with HPs doesn't take many shots to do the trick.

I've got a Beretta 9mm and a Ruger GP100 357 and I go for the wheelgun for the things that go bump in the night.
 
Soybomb, Did I say it was out of a 2 inch? I have 40 years of exposure to the 38 Special. And expansion is not all the story,although out of a 4 inch, or longer barrel, expansion is there. There is no way the 9mm out performs the 158 LSWC at, or above 900 fps, on a shot for shot basis. Until, you consider the semiautomatic features,or special loadings, ie DPX. They are close together, but my nod goes to the Chicago Load.

And I speak as one whose second choice IS the 9mm. 45 ACP is the first.

Jerry
 
The answer for the list of calibers you give is "yes."

All are good calibers, all have advantages and disadvantages when compared with each other, but all are good calibers that will do the job. Given that, I think it is most important to decide on a platform (auto v. revolver, and which particular auto or revolver that feels best in your hand) and then worry about caliber. Once you narrow down the platform, you will have narrowed your caliber list at least a little.

That said, some advantages and disadvantages of the calibers:

-.38spl:
Depending upon the loading it may be just barely acceptable, or it can be a pretty good caliber. With the right load it can be a great caliber, you can get very light wadcutters for easy practice, and you can get inexpensive practice rounds. Only 9mm will cost less to practice with in the major service calibers. It can give decent stopping ability while limiting your risk of overpenetration, with relatively low recoil (quick follow up shots) and low report (better for your hearing).

-.357mag:
A revolver in .357mag can shoot .38spl so it is even more versatile. I load my magnums with .38+P for home defense. Using magnums, you have some great powerful rounds to chose from. Some of the best. You also have minimum power for bear defense out in the woods. However, for self-defense (whether CCW or home defense) the .357mag has a lot of penetration, too much- I see overpenetration to be a big issue. I don't want to risk hitting the bad guy, having the bullet go through the bad guy and then hitting a bystander or a family member. Also, it is loud so you can pretty much count on some hearing damage after an indoor defensive shoot.

-9mm:
As cheap as you can get (outside .22lr) for practice ammo and with the right loadings you have some good defensive choices. Recoil is low so you can get quick follow up shots as needed. The guns chambered in it will either be smaller than comparable .40s and .45s or have more rounds in the mag. Drawbacks include: overpenetration (high velocity rounds like 9mm are more likely to overpenetrate than a lower velocity round like .45ACP), less ammo flexibility (while there are some very good loads, there are also some very poor performers in this caliber).

.40S&W:
I used to be with you, it didn't do it for me. Now it is my favorite CCW caliber. Power levels up there with .45ACP, it can be put in smaller guns than .45ACP or it will hold more rounds in similar sized guns, much more flexibility in loads than 9mm (you can buy what is on sale since there aren't really any bad .40S&W defensive loads), to me recoil isn't bad, prices of practice ammo pretty much split the difference between the cost of .45ACP and 9mm. However, I don't like it as much for home defense as it is a high velocity round like 9mm so overpenetration may be an issue.

.45ACP:
The standard everything else is compared to. It is powerful (as handgun rounds go), plentiful (not that any of your other choices aren't), recoil isn't bad, being a slower round (it gets its power from its size) it is less likely to overpenetrate. In my mind it is the best auto caliber for home defense because of the combination of power without too much overpenetration.

I have guns in all the listed calibers (and others) so I don't have to choose. I started with a 9mm and .38spl, and see nothing wrong with you doing the same (though I quickly traded both on a .45ACP and a .357mag, usually loaded with .38+P but I found the ability to shoot magnums reassuring). If I wanted one gun to do it all, it would either be a .45 or a K-frame .357mag loaded with .38+P.

If you choose a revolver, since you are worried about capacity I'd suggest looking at Taurus. They have three K-frame sized .357mag revolvers with 7 shots (the 66, the Tracker, and the 2" 617, plus the 2" 7 shot .38spl 817). If you were looking for home defense instead of carry, you could look at the 8-shot, large frame 608. Anyway, in autos and revolvers there are a ton of good choices. Again, I suggest going to the gunshop and handling them, and try to test fire some at a range with rentals, to see what feels best to you, then caliber will be easier to figure out.
 
If you are budget constrain the best choice would be 9mm . The .38 SPC would be a best choice 10 years ago because the ammo still plentiful and affordable . I think the used 9 mm pistol probably will be within your budget.I pick up very beat up Tanfloglio TA 90 last year for $249 and it shoot just fine (I need to replace a few parts here and there to get it running reliably ).I often spot Ruger P 89/95 and CZ 75/85 in used gun shelf for $350 .
$350 will not get any decent .357 Magnum or .45 ACP in my area -new or used but once in a while Norinco M1911A1 turn up on the consignment shelf .
You should take your time and find the right pistol because I think the Bersa Thunder is not a bad defensive pistol ( I have one myself ) , remember it is the shot placement that count -.380 ACP in center mass beat .44 Magnum that hit the wall .:)
 
If price is an issue, there is someone on Gunbroker selling late model Taurus 82s he got from a security company with a starting bid of $165. There are only a few hours left in his auction, but if he has a bunch of guns like he says, look for his other auctions and I'd bet he'll have them relisted after the current auction is over (he also has a couple S&W M10s for $160 starting bids and no reserve).
http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=79011434

Look around Gunbroker and Auctionarms and you'll probably find a few similar deals. These guns are .38spl and you'll be below your limit by enough that you can also pick up a nice 12ga shotgun for home defense, or you may be able to find a 9mm police trade-in and still be under your limit.
 
I agree, a person sbhoukld get very comfortable with a 1911 before using it for SD/CCW.

You could look for a Sig P220 CPO. Its .45ACP. Mine has been nothing but reliable, with around 1,000 rounds through it.

They sell for around $500 here
 
I would champion a good double-action revolver in .38 Special or larger. I recommend a revolver because I consider it a safer handgun than a semi-auto for someone who is not very familiar with firearms.


Timthinker
 
I would champion a good double-action revolver in .38 Special or larger. I recommend a revolver because I consider it a safer handgun than a semi-auto for someone who is not very familiar with firearms.
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What ever a new, or novice shooter gets, he should attend a decent instruction designed around that firearm. Safety is between the ears, not in the hand.

Many new shooters have been taught well, how to safely use the 1911. It only takes proper instruction and a good learners mindset. Study safety well, use the lessons. A goof up with any firearm is courting disaster.

Jerry
 
3 thoughts

...

9mm if you want to shoot at the range a lot, along with lowest price of the next choice in case/box cost.

40cal if you want to shoot, somewhat, a lot at the range and pay alittle more per case, but gain in size of bullet, weight, and punch. But this caliber takes the most time to get the feel and into the comfy zone with IMHO.

45cal if you believe me, that between the 9mm and the 40cal, is the most expensive ammo, but needs the least amount of time to get accurate with any 45 gun, has the biggest bullet, biggest punch, and requires the least amount of range time to stay current with.

For me, with my 9mm, 150 rounds per range visit, I'm current.

With my 40 cal, 200 rounds per range visit, I'm current.

With any of my 45's, 50 rounds per range visit, I'm current.


I guess you really have to ask yourself "how much shooting per week, or month, do I really want to do, and why."

Accuaracy, sure, but it can be, and is, for MOST, alot of fun too.. There's the catch.. lol


LS
 
I agree with those that have suggested 9mm. It is inexpensive for practice and you can get it in many many variations from +p to +p+ and any style bullet. It appear to be a good compromise between stopping power, price and good choices of guns for ccw. Very hard to beat.;)
 
I would try shooting a few .45ACP 1911's, or a P220 or maybe even a 10mm, and decide what fits you the best.

personally i love my 1911, and would go with anything else.
 
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