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I joined the cult of CZ...

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by MTMilitiaman, Aug 25, 2020.

  1. Erief0g
    • Contributing Member

    Erief0g Contributing Member

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    20200311_194905.jpg 20200311_194924.jpg 20200311_194847.jpg 20200311_194823.jpg

    It's like cheating when you shoot them. The double taps are almost accidental, just oops...i hit the gong again.
     
  2. MTMilitiaman

    MTMilitiaman Member

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    Is there anything that can be done about this reset besides removing the firing pin block? I spent the money on the CGW SRS-1 short reset kit, and in retrospect, shouldn't have, because I can't really see how it did anything at all. The extended firing pin is in theory a boost to reliability, but in terms of decreasing my reset or improving my trigger pull, I can't really see much, if any, difference. I tried to run a few mags of drills through it the other day, but I just can't get over this atrociously long reset. Any time I try to run her fast or maintain any sort of cadence, I keep hanging up and not full resetting the trigger. It is annoying.
     
  3. Mauser lover

    Mauser lover Member

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    Yes, there is. Let me get what you have done already figured out.

    Did you convert to single action only (pretty sure you have)? Have you replaced the hammer?

    I think you have the right parts to decrease the reset (Cajun Gun Works short reset kit), and you do not need to remove the firing pin block to decrease the reset.

    If you did convert to SA only, you can make your reset length very short (think... almost 1911 short). I need to take mine apart to remember what I've done to mine. Mine is an 85, I'll need to see what the difference is between mine and yours.

    Check out this thread. I think it's okay to link to it? I hope?

    https://forums.brianenos.com/topic/191773-cz-tuning-101-with-professor-atlas/

    And check this one out too.

    https://forums.brianenos.com/topic/265569-cz-open-build-theory/
     
  4. swoter

    swoter Member

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    I think the CZ 75 is probably my favorite pistol. It just fits my hand. I have a 75 Omega, and a 75 Cold War edition. Both DA/SA. I had a 75 compact one time, but sold it after a couple of years. Just didn’t like it as well as the full size. I can use either brass or steel case, hollow point or round nose, they don’t care. I don’t remember having a jam in either one. I have an assortment of mags, and they don’t care about those either. Yes. My favorite pistol.
     
  5. I6turbo

    I6turbo Member

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    In addition to what Mauser lover wrote above... If you want the ultimate short reset and 1911-level trigger pull, you can get it with the single action only conversion, some additional Cajun Gun Works parts, and no firing pin block. The entire range of fore-and-aft movement of the trigger on my 85 Combat (top center in the photo below) is within the thickness of the trigger (at the vertical center of the trigger). The gun has the following parts in it:

    - CGW 54460 Ultra-Lite Kit using the range hammer spring (provides a noticeable improvement in DA and also SA trigger pull, and makes it easier to rack the slide (not that CZ have hard-to-rack slides, but the kit will make it quite a bit lighter)
    - CZ Pre-B short trigger reset (does what it says, shortens the trigger reset -- this is a CZ factory part)
    - CGW 6-SAO trigger (with adjustable uptake and over-travel)
    - CGW Race Hammer Kit (improves trigger pull and essentially eliminates the characteristic CZ hammer "camming-back" in S/A.)
    - CGW floating trigger pin (just a simple item you need with the SAO trigger)

    If you put the CGW Pro Package in your gun, you'll probably have the nearest you can get to the above setup in a D/A gun (but I'm not certain -- haven't researched it fully).

    4sIW3e9.jpg
     
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  6. roc1

    roc1 Member

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    I agree I put SAO trigger in mine helps with reset S2 doesn’t have firing pin block do no worries there. I only changed springs didn’t feel it needed pro kit. I put pro kit in 97 and SP01 those made big difference. My S2 has short reset already in SA mode just wanted try SAO trigger. I like so just ordered one for my SP01
     
  7. tbob38
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    tbob38 Contributing Member

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    Yes, my 527 is in .223.
     
  8. Otto

    Otto Member

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    I have both the Shadow 2 and SP-01 (forgive me if I don't post photos of them).
    The S2 has an improved hammer and it forgoes the FPB. That's why the reset is shorter. To tune your trigger to the same level as a S2 you can either get the Pro Package from Cajun or buy the adjustable sear and hammer kit from them for less than $150 or send it to CZ Custom (my preference). There's other options as well but they all cost money (which you've already discovered).
    Here's what I've concluded...if you want a trigger like that of a Shadow 2 then just buy a Shadow 2. The S2 has better grips, longer barrel, fiber optic /HAJO sights and is heavier. Unless the rules have changed, removing the FPB in a SP-01 is illegal in USPSA production and IDPA. Don't get me wrong, the SP-01's are fine pistols but there are reasons why they only cost $550.
     
  9. Mauser lover

    Mauser lover Member

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    But who wants to stay in "Production" forever?

    The SP-01 model is the ideal base to use if you want to build a small-frame "Open" gun!
     
  10. MTMilitiaman

    MTMilitiaman Member

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    Yes. I installed a CGW flat aluminum SAO trigger and removed the disconnector from the hammer strut. Installed heavy lifter spring hoping to keep a responsible 4-poundish trigger. I am looking for a consistent duty weight trigger, not a race gun. But I do want the shortest possible safe reset. Because a gun this flat begs to be shot fast.

    No, stock hammer. I believe the Short Reset Kit did replace the hammer spring.

    There is definitely something wrong. I think maybe something got installed wrong or I obviously have the wrong combination of springs. The trigger is very sluggish to reset. At first I thought it was the set pins in the CGW trigger, so I back them off all the way flush into the trigger. But the trigger still needs to go all the way forward to reset and if you follow it forward, sometimes won't reset at all. I am wondering if maybe the heavy lifter spring I installed is countering the firing pin spring or something else I installed with the Short Reset kit.
     
  11. railroader

    railroader Member

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    Try calling Cajun Gunworks. They have been very helpful in the past. Tell what parts you have an what you are trying to accomplish with the reset.
     
  12. Mauser lover

    Mauser lover Member

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    Okay, long reset... Part of this is the length of the single action (henceforth "SA") trigger pull with the stock hammer. The CZ stock SA trigger pull is pretty good for a service pistol (okay, it's really good for a service pistol) but isn't anything to write home about if you are already shooting "Limited" division or better. Some of this trigger pull length is the depth of the sear engagement surface ("hooks", it's easier and faster to type) on the hammer. If you don't want to change the hammer out (or modify the existing one) there is nothing you can do about this length, or the camming back of the hammer as you pull the trigger.

    Some of the length of trigger pull is overtravel, which you should have taken care of with that SA only trigger and its overtravel adjustment screw. I'm guessing you already took care of that, and also trust that you do allow enough overtravel to not allow the hooks on the hammer to contact the trigger while the hammer is falling.

    Part of the trigger pull length is the disengagement of the firing pin safety. For the ideal short trigger pull, you would take this out and throw it away. I'm thinking you want to avoid this though, so we'll do the best we can. This safety is the last thing to reset when the trigger goes back forward. Your short reset kit from Cajun should make it about as good as it's going to get. Notice I said "should".

    On my gun (CZ-85 that I got off the classifieds section of THR) that I use for competitions, I purchased a short reset kit, an adjustable sear, longer firing pin, race hammer, SA trigger, etc. I didn't use the short reset kit, because I took out the firing pin safety (legal for Limited, but not Production division, same as the SA only trigger). I took out all DA parts, and I'm very happy with the results. If I put the firing pin safety (and the lifter in the sear cage) back in, the trigger reset is long(ish) again. I replaced the lifter with just a spacer.

    Now, it isn't resetting at all....
    I had this problem. I was trying to get the absolute most out of my pretravel adjustment screw on my trigger, and I was not letting it forward far enough. I fiddled with this to the point that I had it set perfectly, it would reset every time in the shop without a hint of pretravel before the sear started lifting. You know what happened? As soon as I got to the range to test it out, I had to push the trigger forward every shot to get it to reset. The fix? Let it have just a little bit of pretravel. I had to allow a bit of pretravel before it starts lifting the sear, you need to have just a hint of pretravel before the trigger starts lifting the lifter for the firing pin block.

    If it isn't that... did you replace the trigger return spring?

    Sorry for the late reply, I forgot to open up my gun to take a look. Sorry....

    Also, give Cajun a call, they will try to sell you parts, but they will tell you what you need. They talked to me for a good while about what I needed. They might not be able to help right away, but they will help eventually.
     
  13. MTMilitiaman

    MTMilitiaman Member

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    I know it isn't the over travel screws. That was the first thing I thought of and I backed them both off until they are flush inside the trigger. So there is no way the over travel screws are interfering with the travel of the trigger. When the trigger stop resetting, I can take the slide off and if I pull up on the lifter, I can hear a barely audible click. Then I can pull the hammer back slightly and get another louder click. Then the hammer will release when I pull the trigger, allowing me to ease it home (not letting it fall on the sear cage) or put the slide back on and dry fire. With the slide on, it won't recock the hammer moving the slide, however. I have to take the slide off and manually reset the lifter, which is why I am thinking it has something to do with the way the heavy lifter spring I installed is behaving with either the firing pin spring or the hammer spring I installed with the SRS kit.

    I believe I did replace the trigger return spring, but I am not positive.

    I am not opposed to buying more parts right now, actually. I have all this money saved up to do some work on my ARs, but that is proving impossible since nothing is in stock. So until Aero Precision and some others start making handguards and stuff again, I got nothing better to do with this money than fix this CZ. If Cajun has the parts in stock to sell me, I have no qualms buying the parts I need. I just want this thing to function right.
     
  14. Mauser lover

    Mauser lover Member

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    hmmm.... pics?

    I know it is kind of a pain, but you can try putting the stock lifter spring back in, seeing if that works; if it doesn't, try putting in the original lifter, see if that works, etc.

    It sounds like something is either installed wrong, out of spec, or maybe Cajun sent you the wrong parts. Pics will let us know if they are installed wrong, but not be able to rule out something being out of spec.

    I can't think of any way that a heavier lifter spring would mess this up, even if you have changed all the other springs.
     
  15. MTMilitiaman

    MTMilitiaman Member

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    IBBg8GU.jpg

    MHJ93EP.jpg

    I am going to wait to start swapping parts around again until I get proper punches and a decent block, because just going it on my bedroom floor with a small screwdriver last time was a PITA.
     
  16. railroader

    railroader Member

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    Here a video of a cajun short reset. Start watching at about 1:50 to see the reset on the guys gun.
     
  17. sevt_chevelle

    sevt_chevelle Member

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    [QUOTE="MTMilitiaman,

    I am going to wait to start swapping parts around again until I get proper punches and a decent block, because just going it on my bedroom floor with a small screwdriver last time was a PITA.[/QUOTE]

    I suggest the Mayhew 2mm and 3mm pin punch and roll pin punch.
     
  18. Mauser lover

    Mauser lover Member

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    Well... from what I can see, the parts sure look like they are all where they should be.

    Problem: Trigger does not reset and hammer does not cock when slide reciprocates

    Diagnostics:
    Take the slide off
    Lower the hammer, keep the trigger fully back
    Push the trigger bar down with your finger or a dowel or pen or something else that won't scratch it.
    Will the safety reset when you push the trigger bar down?
    If it does, for some reason the slide is not pushing the trigger bar down far enough when the slide reciprocates. Did you polish anything (particularly those two little nubs that protrude upward) on the trigger bar? If so, you may need a new trigger bar, but don't buy one until you're sure this is it.

    You can see just how far forward the trigger goes before it resets if you hold down the trigger, push down the trigger bar, watch the firing pin safety snap back down, re-cock the hammer, then watch the trigger bar as you let the trigger forward slowly. When the trigger bar pops up, your trigger is fully reset.

    Did you leave in any double action parts? Is the disconnector still in?
     
  19. Buck13

    Buck13 Member

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  20. Erief0g
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    Erief0g Contributing Member

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    Sent the slide to primary machine along with a trijicon SRO. had then do the lightening cuts to the slide and what isn't as obvious is how much more aggressive the front serrations are. If you use front serrations these will not allow you to slip at all. They also milled to get the slide to get the SRO as low as possible. Then they black nitride the slide.
    Truly fabulous work.

    25 yards, offhand, 15 rounds
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