I just bought a new DPMS 308 and have a problem, help?
- Thread starter HKUSP45C
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8 Pics
The following pics show what I suspect to be rust, not machine oil. Also, the charging handle has been wiped dry for taking the pics...the oil was too reflective. You will note how heavily lubed the bolt (beside it) is for comparison purposes:
Bolt Pics:
View attachment 296107
View attachment 296108
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View attachment 296110
Charging Handle Pics:
View attachment 296111
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Thanks for the fedback thus far.
Doc2005
The following pics show what I suspect to be rust, not machine oil. Also, the charging handle has been wiped dry for taking the pics...the oil was too reflective. You will note how heavily lubed the bolt (beside it) is for comparison purposes:
Bolt Pics:
View attachment 296107
View attachment 296108
View attachment 296109
View attachment 296110
Charging Handle Pics:
View attachment 296111
View attachment 296112
View attachment 296113
View attachment 296114
Thanks for the fedback thus far.
Doc2005
hacksaw
Member
Silly...
All of these issues and these rifles are cost so much money. For the amount of change you have to part with I'd be more tempted to hunt up a nice m1A of 70's or 80's manufacture. I like the AR platform, but the pains you guys are going through makes me wince in sympathy. Just my humble opinion and worth every cent you paid for it...unlike those rifle's you guys are wrestling with.
good luck.
All of these issues and these rifles are cost so much money. For the amount of change you have to part with I'd be more tempted to hunt up a nice m1A of 70's or 80's manufacture. I like the AR platform, but the pains you guys are going through makes me wince in sympathy. Just my humble opinion and worth every cent you paid for it...unlike those rifle's you guys are wrestling with.
good luck.
I have an M1A "Loaded", and I wanted an AR-styled rifled to supplement it. Both had to be 7.62X51.
DPMS has been all-over-the-problem! Grass does not grow under their feet! They have already advised me that they have sent out (same day) a pick-up tag. They are paying the shipping, they are making the repair (if needed) fully-under-warranty, and have stated that they will try to turn it around in days...not weeks. We'll see how the repair goes, and I'll post an update.
Doc2005
DPMS has been all-over-the-problem! Grass does not grow under their feet! They have already advised me that they have sent out (same day) a pick-up tag. They are paying the shipping, they are making the repair (if needed) fully-under-warranty, and have stated that they will try to turn it around in days...not weeks. We'll see how the repair goes, and I'll post an update.
Doc2005
Titan6
member
That is just sad. I don't know what that big scar on the side of the bolt carrier is but it should not be there and is more than likely the cause of your dragging.
There is some machine oil there but that does look a lot like rust inside the chamber. DPMS sends the rifles in plastic cases. Could be a lot of reasons that happened including not enough desicant in shipping container or the shop kept the weapon cased without the dessicant.
Whenever I have a weapon in a plastic case more than a day or in damp climate I always slip a small dessicant pack into the chamber and leave the bolt part way back. Then put a pack at the rear of the action and the end of the barrel. Weapons don't normally rust that way.
There is some machine oil there but that does look a lot like rust inside the chamber. DPMS sends the rifles in plastic cases. Could be a lot of reasons that happened including not enough desicant in shipping container or the shop kept the weapon cased without the dessicant.
Whenever I have a weapon in a plastic case more than a day or in damp climate I always slip a small dessicant pack into the chamber and leave the bolt part way back. Then put a pack at the rear of the action and the end of the barrel. Weapons don't normally rust that way.
Here too! Any time I travel more than the distance of the local range, with my firearms in plastic, I take my Rig Rag and Rig Grease and give a once all-over. I remove the stock and coat the entire exterior, remove the bolt and coat the chamber and bore, etc. If I can see it, reach it, I coat it.
When my firearms are stored in the vault (100% of the remainder of time), I remove them weekly, apply M-Pro7 oil, manipulate the action, trigger, safety, etc and return them. It is also a good idea to store them coated or in a silicone "sock".
I know, I know...I am hyper meticulous with my firearms. But, I believe that if I take care of them, then, if someday I need them, they'll be there to take care of me.
Thanks for all of the info all. It has been greatly appreciated. Any additional information will be equally appreciated. No such thing as information over-load regarding firearms care and maintenance.
Doc2005
When my firearms are stored in the vault (100% of the remainder of time), I remove them weekly, apply M-Pro7 oil, manipulate the action, trigger, safety, etc and return them. It is also a good idea to store them coated or in a silicone "sock".
I know, I know...I am hyper meticulous with my firearms. But, I believe that if I take care of them, then, if someday I need them, they'll be there to take care of me.
Thanks for all of the info all. It has been greatly appreciated. Any additional information will be equally appreciated. No such thing as information over-load regarding firearms care and maintenance.
Doc2005
Wes Janson
Member
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- May 12, 2006
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My knowledge is limited, but that doesn't really look quite like rust to me..looks more like some really baked-on grease. The color, pattern, and placement just doesn't suggest rust, IMO. As for the charging handle, have you looked inside the upper to see if there's something protruding into the channel? I'm not familiar with the rifle, but that sort of wear doesn't look right at all.
Actually, yes, I sprayed the entire rifle bare last night with "Gun Scrubber", then looked at the inside of the receiver. It had areas that are raised ever so little, but, as we have seen, enough to tear up the charging handle.
Shocking the difference between DPMS employees. No names here, but the first one was professional and stated matter of fact, that is not right...we will make it right. The second took a "Oh whatever" attitude, stating, "We can take a look at it, because you probably gonna send it in eventually anyhow."
What the "heck"?! $1,200.00 and he says that to me? How about you fix it because it is defective, and only 10 rounds fired through it! That second DPMS emloyee's attitude urinated me right off. That's a good way to loose my business...just ask Kimber!
At present, I am pondering having the receiver upgraded to the steel upper since I have already told them don't even try to refinish (refurbish) my rifle. If it's a lemon, replace the lemon part...just like a car. If there is a price difference, I am willing to pay the difference.
We'll see. I'll post any updates I receive.
Shocking the difference between DPMS employees. No names here, but the first one was professional and stated matter of fact, that is not right...we will make it right. The second took a "Oh whatever" attitude, stating, "We can take a look at it, because you probably gonna send it in eventually anyhow."
What the "heck"?! $1,200.00 and he says that to me? How about you fix it because it is defective, and only 10 rounds fired through it! That second DPMS emloyee's attitude urinated me right off. That's a good way to loose my business...just ask Kimber!
At present, I am pondering having the receiver upgraded to the steel upper since I have already told them don't even try to refinish (refurbish) my rifle. If it's a lemon, replace the lemon part...just like a car. If there is a price difference, I am willing to pay the difference.
We'll see. I'll post any updates I receive.
atblis
Member
Hmm
Is that grease around your gas tube?
Is that grease around your gas tube?
mpmarty
Member
HK, you say you also have a Saiga .308, can you post a comparison on the two after you shoot the new one?
thanks,
thanks,
HKUSP45C
Member
mpmarty,
Sure, I'm actually VERY curious what a 300 dollar rifle looks like next to a 1300 dollar one at 100 meters. There will be some difference inherently because the rifles are fundamentally different. The Saiga is a sporter config and the Panther is .... well an EBR. Both are scoped with identical optics and I'll set up a test with identical ammunition once I get a feel for the DPMS. I'm going to try to make it as fair as possible.
As an aside, even if the Saiga outshoots the DPMS I'll still be glad of the purchase. I've always wanted a EBR even if it's not "Battle Rifle" tough. Hell, with a pistolgrip and a new FCG the Saiga could end up being my MBR. We'll see.
Oh, I lost my Dig. Cam. so no pics as of yet. I'm ordering a long overdue replacement of it and hope to have it arrive next week. When it get to my house the pics will get to THR.
Sure, I'm actually VERY curious what a 300 dollar rifle looks like next to a 1300 dollar one at 100 meters. There will be some difference inherently because the rifles are fundamentally different. The Saiga is a sporter config and the Panther is .... well an EBR. Both are scoped with identical optics and I'll set up a test with identical ammunition once I get a feel for the DPMS. I'm going to try to make it as fair as possible.
As an aside, even if the Saiga outshoots the DPMS I'll still be glad of the purchase. I've always wanted a EBR even if it's not "Battle Rifle" tough. Hell, with a pistolgrip and a new FCG the Saiga could end up being my MBR. We'll see.
Oh, I lost my Dig. Cam. so no pics as of yet. I'm ordering a long overdue replacement of it and hope to have it arrive next week. When it get to my house the pics will get to THR.
Update Re: DPMS Repair of Brand New .308 Rifle:
DMPS did send a pick-up tag for UPS. I sent the upper receiver back to them. It arrived the 2nd day. The day after it had arrived, a DPMS employee contacted me to advise me that he had taken it back to the repairmen.
Re: the charging handle, at first he stated, "We determined you were simply pulling too hard left and up instead of straight back and that's what happened to strip the charge handle".
I countered with the fact that, "I have (X number) of AR-styled rifles! None of my ARs has done this, and some of the them are years old! Some have thousands of rounds through them, and they still look new! I pull straight back. The rifle arrived defective. Either the receiver or the charge handle (or both) was/were not properly milled!"
He then stated, "Okay then, we'll look it over fully. We'll also look into the rust., or whatever it is."
They are targeting 10 days to have it back to me. He advised me that he will contact me by Tuesday with a diagnosis of the problems before they begin repairs.
End up date for now.
DMPS did send a pick-up tag for UPS. I sent the upper receiver back to them. It arrived the 2nd day. The day after it had arrived, a DPMS employee contacted me to advise me that he had taken it back to the repairmen.
Re: the charging handle, at first he stated, "We determined you were simply pulling too hard left and up instead of straight back and that's what happened to strip the charge handle".
I countered with the fact that, "I have (X number) of AR-styled rifles! None of my ARs has done this, and some of the them are years old! Some have thousands of rounds through them, and they still look new! I pull straight back. The rifle arrived defective. Either the receiver or the charge handle (or both) was/were not properly milled!"
He then stated, "Okay then, we'll look it over fully. We'll also look into the rust., or whatever it is."
They are targeting 10 days to have it back to me. He advised me that he will contact me by Tuesday with a diagnosis of the problems before they begin repairs.
End up date for now.
Frankly, I think I would have gone over the edge when they accused you of causing the problem by not charging the rifle correctly.
I think that at that point I would have countered with something like "Well since I am obviously too stupid to operate this rifle, you might as well just keep it and send me a check for $1200. I will let you know when the check arrives in the mail."
Customers should not have to do QC on a brand new gun.
I have had so many problems with new guns that I now basically stick with used ones anymore.
I think that at that point I would have countered with something like "Well since I am obviously too stupid to operate this rifle, you might as well just keep it and send me a check for $1200. I will let you know when the check arrives in the mail."
Customers should not have to do QC on a brand new gun.
I have had so many problems with new guns that I now basically stick with used ones anymore.
HKUSP45C
Member
well....
I finally got to the range. What a great day! I manually bore sighted it and it shoots sooooo sweetly. It did give me fits with the Fed Low Recoil but I had been warned about it before hand. Getting FTEs and FBEs. Hornady TAP, Win Super X and Fed Gold Match all performed better than I could. I love it!
I really need to find a friend or two who shoots rifles though. My technique sucks to be sure. I have a horrible flinch and frankly I'm a bit timid when it comes to the shot. Also, I bruised myself ... I'm an idiot.
Oh, and my NcSTAR scope worked great until I turned on the reticle and fired .... It stopped illuminating after that. I'll call them.
Anyone know of a good gun school on the North West side of Houston?
Doc, I'd make a hobby out of making the life of the guy who said you did it miserable. But I'm mean. I'm curious how well DPMS stands behind thier product, so far, I'm less than impressed.
I finally got to the range. What a great day! I manually bore sighted it and it shoots sooooo sweetly. It did give me fits with the Fed Low Recoil but I had been warned about it before hand. Getting FTEs and FBEs. Hornady TAP, Win Super X and Fed Gold Match all performed better than I could. I love it!
I really need to find a friend or two who shoots rifles though. My technique sucks to be sure. I have a horrible flinch and frankly I'm a bit timid when it comes to the shot. Also, I bruised myself ... I'm an idiot.
Oh, and my NcSTAR scope worked great until I turned on the reticle and fired .... It stopped illuminating after that. I'll call them.
Anyone know of a good gun school on the North West side of Houston?
Doc, I'd make a hobby out of making the life of the guy who said you did it miserable. But I'm mean. I'm curious how well DPMS stands behind thier product, so far, I'm less than impressed.
We'll see the tone of the conversation tomorrow when they call me back for an update. Remember the additional upper (custom upper) I ordered? That can be cancelled if this one isn't done right.
Goon, you're certainly correct about so many new guns arriving defective. The fact of 4 out of 5 Custom Kimbers being defective (about 18 months back) lead me to swear-off Kimbers. I know most of their firearms are excellent, but mine were horrid. Hopefully DPMS will follow through. If not, well, I take that up if it happens.
Thanks for the support.
Doc2005
Goon, you're certainly correct about so many new guns arriving defective. The fact of 4 out of 5 Custom Kimbers being defective (about 18 months back) lead me to swear-off Kimbers. I know most of their firearms are excellent, but mine were horrid. Hopefully DPMS will follow through. If not, well, I take that up if it happens.
Thanks for the support.
Doc2005
Update Re: DMPS Repair.
The repair department has had time to strip my .308 upper and have determined that, "...the receiver was improperly milled by a couple thousandths of an inch...". I have elected to have the upper receiver upgraded from aluminum to steel as long as we are making a change-out! DPMS anticipates 10 days to get it back to me.
I am quite pleased with DPMS' communications with me. They continue to be timely and professional. I have every reason to believe that the repair will be completed correctly. I will post another update when I hear something again.
Doc2005
The repair department has had time to strip my .308 upper and have determined that, "...the receiver was improperly milled by a couple thousandths of an inch...". I have elected to have the upper receiver upgraded from aluminum to steel as long as we are making a change-out! DPMS anticipates 10 days to get it back to me.
I am quite pleased with DPMS' communications with me. They continue to be timely and professional. I have every reason to believe that the repair will be completed correctly. I will post another update when I hear something again.
Doc2005
Wow-DPMS 308 problems
I am suprised to here of these problems with the DPMS .308 - I have a DPMS LR308 with the 24 inch bull barrell I purchase in Jan, and I have fired over 600 + rounds through it and have only had problems with Reloaded ammo because I did not get the Case sized perfect- but with store bought - Federal and the cheap american eagle ammo I have had no problems and this rifle is very accurate- and it looks new inside after 600+ rounds and has gotten more accurate after about 300 rounds of the break in - mine came with the JP trigger and I love it - I can shoot 20 rounds quickly and it is smooth as silk- I guess thankfully I got a good one - DPMS has a very good rep. and supplies a lot of miltary and law enforcement all over the USA and Abroad I think-They also had the the NRA rifle of the year award for the .308- Sorry to hear of the problems once they get figured out I am sure you will love Them -- Good Luck
I am suprised to here of these problems with the DPMS .308 - I have a DPMS LR308 with the 24 inch bull barrell I purchase in Jan, and I have fired over 600 + rounds through it and have only had problems with Reloaded ammo because I did not get the Case sized perfect- but with store bought - Federal and the cheap american eagle ammo I have had no problems and this rifle is very accurate- and it looks new inside after 600+ rounds and has gotten more accurate after about 300 rounds of the break in - mine came with the JP trigger and I love it - I can shoot 20 rounds quickly and it is smooth as silk- I guess thankfully I got a good one - DPMS has a very good rep. and supplies a lot of miltary and law enforcement all over the USA and Abroad I think-They also had the the NRA rifle of the year award for the .308- Sorry to hear of the problems once they get figured out I am sure you will love Them -- Good Luck
Any company can have a slip here and there. What still impresses me about DPMS, is their zero-tolerance policy. If it's not right, it's wrong. Even if it's a mere 2/1,000ths"! Oh yeah...2/1,000ths"! For that, they paid to have the rifle next-day shipped, and inspected it. And, they have agreed to allow me to have the receiver upgraded to steel?! Wow! They have been top-notch so far. I remain fully confident. I don't want for anyone to believe that I am upset with DPMS. I am posting these updates so that people know what to expect from DPMS in the unlikely event their rifle needed repair.
Doc2005
Doc2005
atblis
Member
Well
In today's day and age, .002" is a lot.
How is steel an upgrade?
In today's day and age, .002" is a lot.
How is steel an upgrade?
Excellent question...
Most people would disagree that it is an "upgrade"...most people don't have a fused neck and an electronic implant in their spine. I have both.
The fact of the steel upper receiver is an upgrade for the extra weight. My neck is fused at C4, C5 & C6, and I have an electric implant in my spine. The steel upper receiver will add over 1.5 pounds to the rifle's weight. I like that fact because it reduces recoil. Also, steel has slightly better wear qualities than aluminum. For me, the "upgrade" is the weight. I admit it is rather subjective, but it is what I wanted, and it was truly professional of DPMS to allow that upgrade.
By the way, factually, it is an upgrade on a DPMS rifle. If one orders a custom-built rifle from DPMS, one does have to pay extra for a steel upper receiver instead of aluminum. That makes it factually an upgrade as well.
Most people would disagree that it is an "upgrade"...most people don't have a fused neck and an electronic implant in their spine. I have both.
The fact of the steel upper receiver is an upgrade for the extra weight. My neck is fused at C4, C5 & C6, and I have an electric implant in my spine. The steel upper receiver will add over 1.5 pounds to the rifle's weight. I like that fact because it reduces recoil. Also, steel has slightly better wear qualities than aluminum. For me, the "upgrade" is the weight. I admit it is rather subjective, but it is what I wanted, and it was truly professional of DPMS to allow that upgrade.
By the way, factually, it is an upgrade on a DPMS rifle. If one orders a custom-built rifle from DPMS, one does have to pay extra for a steel upper receiver instead of aluminum. That makes it factually an upgrade as well.
atblis
Member
That's true
Regardless of your physical condition, heavier guns generally shoot better.
Regardless of your physical condition, heavier guns generally shoot better.
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