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ID S&W K Frame With Lanyard Ring

Discussion in 'Firearms Research' started by Shimitup, Feb 1, 2021.

  1. Shimitup

    Shimitup Member

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    I'd love have some one tell me what I have here. It's a 4" K frame with the serial # stamped in 3 places, butt, back of cylinder, and bottom of the barrel. On the back of cylinder are s, p, and v. On the Grip strap are WB-S-SDGN. It's an interesting the mix of rough machining inside the frame and and trigger guard and high polish on easy to access surfaces. On the butt opposite the ser# are the letters V and W. also note the screw on the front of the trigger guard. The trigger and hammer are chromed. Ignore the serial# btw it's both scrambled and missing segments thanks to Photo Shop.

    Thanks for the help.

    CollageK.jpg IMG_20210201_172737454_HDR.jpg
     
  2. Shimitup

    Shimitup Member

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    To answer a little bit of my own question I'm a feared what would have been a fine victory model has been butchered.
     
  3. ApacheCoTodd

    ApacheCoTodd member

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    I got nothing. But, I am intrigued.

    I sure hope there's some input on this one.


    Todd.
     
  4. unklebuck

    unklebuck Member

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    Victory Models had U.S. Military Property stamp on left side of top strap, with more information on top of barrel. They, also, had a parkarized frame and barrel. Great idea, scrambling the serial #, but it can be easily identified if you use three of those characters, followed by xxx. Huge numbers of Model 10's have been counterfeited just to make a few extra bucks. Otherwise, you have one of the greatest .38 special's ever made.
     
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  5. Shimitup

    Shimitup Member

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    In this case I suspect a victory model was butchered to look like a model 10, horrible polishing job, very uneven and the S&W logo is nearly obliterated. The parkerized finish is still evident at the inside corners that are hard to get to. I learned a lot at the S&W collectors site this morning, based on the 497XXX I'm guessing late '43.
     
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  6. ApacheCoTodd

    ApacheCoTodd member

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    So then you pretty much have an outstanding pistol with relatively no collector value to worry about protecting.

    And, a lanyard loop. Loops alone can make a pistol halfway desirable to me for some weird utilitarian reason.

    Todd.
     
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  7. Shimitup

    Shimitup Member

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    :rofl::rofl:!! True indeed, I'm not sure even about the outstanding part. It was ground on and polished so much on the cylinder face that I have a barrel gap that runs from .017 on the tight side to .023 on the loose, it's not square to the cylinder axis. Big shame because I completely stripped it down today and the internals show zero wear. Well I can still shoot it though it might singe the hair off my fingers from the cylinder blast.
     
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  8. ApacheCoTodd

    ApacheCoTodd member

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    I wonder if the gap is because of the cylinder face or the replacement barrel.

    Sounds like a damn fine project gun to set the purists aflame.:evil:
    4wg026.jpg

    Todd.
     
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  9. unklebuck

    unklebuck Member

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    It , definitely , could be due to the barrel replacement. When you said that the internal parts were ruff, this may be due to the military production for quick shipping. Please , don't shoot it without having a ' qualified ' gunsmith going over it first.
     
  10. Shimitup

    Shimitup Member

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    Aha, there's your lanyard loop, what is that? As for the gun I'm cleaning up four things are serial numbered, barrel, frame, cylinder, even the extractor on the front side. They all match up. Edges of the cylinder holes are kind of rounded over from spending lots of time against a buffing wheel. This project is for my sister-inlaw who inherited it from her father. My brother said they really don't want it. Hmm, I've got a model 17-5 that could use a lanyard loop. Talk about setting purist's aflame! I think that would be really cool but I don't think it would be a good idea to go drilling through a serial number.
     
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  11. ApacheCoTodd

    ApacheCoTodd member

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    The snub shown was from a pal (RIP) from the old Great Western show in L.A. I'm speeding by his table and he says; "Hey Todd, hold up. I have something to show you." My eyes went straight to the Smith shown and I asked... "How much?" Yeah, he knew me. His wife said he only bought it because he knew I'd want it. Has been a favored hiking snake gun for 25 years.

    True or not it follows surplus guns cut and bobbed for plainclothes in England after the war and then reimported here and also duplicated stateside as cheap snub-nose carry pieces. The trigger guard I've only seen 3-5 other times and I replaced the bobbed hammer with a full size.

    Lanyard loops in numbers? Like this? This one has a great story for its own thread.
    4wgfrt.jpg

    Todd.
     
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  12. Shimitup

    Shimitup Member

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    :) I love it!
     
  13. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    .38 Special? Or .38 S&W?

    I assume Special and that the backstrap markings are for a defense contractor guard. That was the other use, military secondary standard in England and US and plant security.
     
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  14. Shimitup

    Shimitup Member

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    Thanks Jim, at this point I was most curious about the backstrap markings, BTW it's a .38 special.
     
  15. ontarget

    ontarget Member

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    I just procured a M&P from around 1930. After shooting the first cylinder it started to bind up. Upon troubleshooting I found that the ejector rod is ever so slightly bent.
    Anyway all that to say Numrich has lots of parts in stock for these old workhorses.
    I ordered a new ejector rod and some new grips.
    If you need a cylinder they had some in stock.
     
  16. bannockburn

    bannockburn Member

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    Shimitup

    I picked up this S&W M&P some years ago at a gun show. On Saturday I bought an old Pre-Model 10 that was in need of some basic cleaning. Decided I didn't like the way the gun balanced with it's 6" barrel and went back on Sunday to trade it on something else, preferably a Model 10.

    What I found and traded for was this: a wartime M&P Model but not a Victory Model. No U.S. Property markings, no inspection marks, and no V prefix serial number. More than likely this was a gun purchased by the government for use by security guards at banks, strategic non-military locations, and at Defense plants and factories. On the right side plate somebody electropencilled "G. E. Co."; quite possibly it was issued to a security guard at a General Electric plant.

    There is very little in terms of wear on the finish or the grips so I'm guessing it wasn't even carried all that much. The action is a bit stiff in DA mode but the SA pull is nice and smooth. All in all it's a fine example of a wartime .38 Special S&W revolver.
    j4CilkY.jpg
     
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  17. Archie

    Archie Member

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    The Victory model was sort of continued after the Second World War. They were essentially over-runs from the wartime manufacture. They were chambered for .38 Special (not .38 S&W) and sold mostly to police departments and such. They had the "S" and "V" markings on the butt, the S indicated they had a factory installed upgraded safety mechanism for preventing firing of the arm and the V was the standard 'victory' marking.
    The initials on the rear grip strap are likely the department doing the initial purchase. (South Dogtown Gopher Nabbers, perhaps?)
    They were blued but not as nicely as arms for the commercial market. (Paraphrase of Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson, 3rd Edition.)

    I would not change too much. I'd put better grips on it, but same the originals. Find out who SDGN really was, if you can. If you refinish it, it will be different from her father's sidearm. It is most likely a really nice .38 Special revolver.
     
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