If you had to choose between these 3
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tlhelmer
Member
Sell all three and get a better gun!
Kahr carrier
Member
Mk-2,use the derringer as a last ditch gun.
cslinger
Member
No contest, C&B .44. We seem to forget that these firearms were extremely effective "back in the day" and that effectiveness will only be better today with modern powders, caps, metals, and replica guns built to much better standards.
I am sure the .22 would kill the intruder with enough shots but I just do not trust it to induce enough trama to stop the threat quickly enough, not to mention it just doesn't have the scary look of a big bore revolver and sometimes the mental aspect of getting shot by what is perceived as a very deadly gun can incapacite as well.
All that being said 6 shots of .44 is nothing to scoff at.
Besides if you run out of ammo what would you rather beat the battered and bloody intruder with a little .22, a microscopic deringer or a big honkin' piece of .44 caliber steel and wood. Once again for the Thwackum stick I still go with the .44.
I am sure the .22 would kill the intruder with enough shots but I just do not trust it to induce enough trama to stop the threat quickly enough, not to mention it just doesn't have the scary look of a big bore revolver and sometimes the mental aspect of getting shot by what is perceived as a very deadly gun can incapacite as well.
All that being said 6 shots of .44 is nothing to scoff at.
Besides if you run out of ammo what would you rather beat the battered and bloody intruder with a little .22, a microscopic deringer or a big honkin' piece of .44 caliber steel and wood. Once again for the Thwackum stick I still go with the .44.
Quote:
"If it came down to it, I'd rather defend my home with an unloaded 12ga. pump than any .22 Long Rifle firearm.
No sound in the world says "GO AWAY" like the chack-chack of a pump gun being cycled."
Good plan.
I'll tell you what, you get an unloaded pump shotgun and I will take a .22 and we will see who wins the gun fight.
I can't beleive you wrote that! I think you have watched too many movies.
"If it came down to it, I'd rather defend my home with an unloaded 12ga. pump than any .22 Long Rifle firearm.
No sound in the world says "GO AWAY" like the chack-chack of a pump gun being cycled."
Good plan.
I'll tell you what, you get an unloaded pump shotgun and I will take a .22 and we will see who wins the gun fight.
I can't beleive you wrote that!
I think you have watched too many movies.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
Given that I've had tons of practice with all manner of .22 pistols, and absolutely none with the cap 'n' ball revo's, I'd have to go with the .22.
Fire 10+1 rounds, reload, repeat as necessary.
Fire 10+1 rounds, reload, repeat as necessary.
Ala Dan
Member in memoriam
Ruger MK-II KMK-512! As its very affordable and requires
very little up-keep.
Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member
very little up-keep.
Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member
RON in PA
Member
For serious social work a well maintained cap and ball is the way to go. Ask Wild Bill Hickcock.
CTgunteacher
Member
I'd go with the .44 revolver, as well. The vast majority of HD situations will be settled with a few shots, regardless of the outcome. The .44 revolver is also more intimidating (to the home invader) in a gunpoint situation than a .22 or a little derringer, though obviously you can't count on just scaring 'em.
Yes, these revolvers will belch flame and smoke. But people managed to get by using them throughout the 1800s, in "shootouts" that took place in saloons, homes, stores, etc. I think I'd manage, too. I do shoot these guns with some frequency as a consequence of my employment, so I am pretty familiar with them.
I recall Jeff Cooper mentioning that he'd rather have a cap-n-ball .44 than a Beretta 92. I'm not at all enthusiastic about the Beretta, but I wouldn't go quite that far!
Mike
Yes, these revolvers will belch flame and smoke. But people managed to get by using them throughout the 1800s, in "shootouts" that took place in saloons, homes, stores, etc. I think I'd manage, too. I do shoot these guns with some frequency as a consequence of my employment, so I am pretty familiar with them.
I recall Jeff Cooper mentioning that he'd rather have a cap-n-ball .44 than a Beretta 92. I'm not at all enthusiastic about the Beretta, but I wouldn't go quite that far!
Mike
Dave Markowitz
Member
No question -- the .44 cap and ball revolver. My choice in that type of firearm would be my Ruger Old Army, or possibly my Uberti Second Model Dragoon.
The Dragoon can take a load of 50 grains of 3Fg powder underneath a round ball. That is some serious power for a handgun. And if the 6 shots don't do in the BG, the fumes will!
The Dragoon can take a load of 50 grains of 3Fg powder underneath a round ball. That is some serious power for a handgun. And if the 6 shots don't do in the BG, the fumes will!
Shootin' Buddy
Member
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forty-four for shore
if that sentence doesn't make sense to you, say it outloud fast.
if that sentence doesn't make sense to you, say it outloud fast.
I'd like to see some of you guys who chose the cap&ball .44 try to reload one of them in a hurry. Even with a spare cylinder, it's going to take a lot longer than reloading any modern firearm.
If you're 100%, Absolutely, ironclad certain that you'll only need 5 or 6 shots the .44 is a better choice--no question.
If there's ANY chance you might need to reload, the .22 semi auto is so much better of a choice that it's no competition.
If you're 100%, Absolutely, ironclad certain that you'll only need 5 or 6 shots the .44 is a better choice--no question.
If there's ANY chance you might need to reload, the .22 semi auto is so much better of a choice that it's no competition.
TallPine
Member
"the forty-four spoke and it said 'lead and smoke' - seventeen inches of flame"
Marty Robbins "Mr. Shorty"
"oh he might have went on livin' but he made one fatal slip: when he tried to match the ranger with the big iron on his hip"
Marty Robbins "Big Iron"
Anyone guess what I would choose ...?
Marty Robbins "Mr. Shorty"
"oh he might have went on livin' but he made one fatal slip: when he tried to match the ranger with the big iron on his hip"
Marty Robbins "Big Iron"
Anyone guess what I would choose ...?
Radagast
Member
Ruger. I don'rt like the grip angle, but mine is deadly accurate, reliable and with the bull barrel makes a damned good club when the magazine runs dry.
Radagast
Radagast
--.22 Pros--
- Accurate
- Reliable
- 10 shot magazine
- Quick reload via new mag
- Usually good sights
- Can remain in a "loaded" condition for years if necessary.
--.22 Cons--
- low relative power factor,,fatal to be sure but poor stopping even w/multiple hits. My half-fast guesstimate is 3 shots min/ 5 to 10 shots max per "target" YMMV but before you decide take a look at the energy figures.
- Small caliber means exacting placement of shots,,,"head shot" doesn't cut it,,,think in terms of occular or nasal cavity (people wonder why I shoot at pennies as targets,,,well,,there you have it,,a penny is about the size of the eyeball or the nostrils.)
--Derringer pro(s)-
- Large caliber
--Derringer cons--
- Too many to list,,,,just shoot one and you'll figure them out PDQ.
--Cap and Ball Pros--
- Excellent stopping power. Pretty much on the same power level as the .45acp.
- Mulitiple shots. (If the smoke is in your way, you're likley to be dead anyhow,,,,move to cover, move to cover, move to cover,,don't just stand there. Even at that, the smoke isn't quite as bad as is made out.)
- Smoke. Yes, it can obscure YOUR movements as you,,,move to cover, move to cover etc.
- Accpetable accuracy at HD ranges.
- COM shots are possible due to caliber/power level.
-- Cap and Ball Cons --
- Smoke. Yeah, it does smoke more than the others,,, and it can obscure the target.
- Prone to jamming from bits of the percussion cap falling into the works. Mine did that quite a bit.
- Prone to misfires from the grease used to seal the chamber mouths seeping into to chambers. Criso works fine at the range and in the field. It melts pretty easy into a liquid if you keep the thing too close to your body. Using round balls and a felt pad can eliminate the need to grease the chamber mouths, but you pay for it with a less effective bullet.(sumptin 'bout no free lunch)
- Slow to reload.
- Limited time for remaining loaded. BP and it's substitutes are hydroscopic. They'll pull moisture out of the air given half a chance. Keeping a cap and ball revolver loaded and ready to go is pretty much a short term affair....personally I don't think I'd keep them that way for more than a week.
(Last but not least)
- Price. A good quality BP revolver, like the Ruger is expensive. Ruger lists them for ~$500.00. The Italian made ones aren't made for long term use/abuse. *and yes, I own 2 of the Italian ones.
- Safety--- BP is nasty stuff. No, let me rephrase that,,,BP is REALLY nasty stuff. Most users of modern firearms and ammunition don't really understand how dangerous BP can be. The common ammunition/smokeless powder practices I see and read about both on-line and in the real world would be extremely iffy using BP.
Bottom line,,,I'd pick the .22 overall. As always, YMMV.
- Accurate
- Reliable
- 10 shot magazine
- Quick reload via new mag
- Usually good sights
- Can remain in a "loaded" condition for years if necessary.
--.22 Cons--
- low relative power factor,,fatal to be sure but poor stopping even w/multiple hits. My half-fast guesstimate is 3 shots min/ 5 to 10 shots max per "target" YMMV but before you decide take a look at the energy figures.
- Small caliber means exacting placement of shots,,,"head shot" doesn't cut it,,,think in terms of occular or nasal cavity (people wonder why I shoot at pennies as targets,,,well,,there you have it,,a penny is about the size of the eyeball or the nostrils.)
--Derringer pro(s)-
- Large caliber
--Derringer cons--
- Too many to list,,,,just shoot one and you'll figure them out PDQ.
--Cap and Ball Pros--
- Excellent stopping power. Pretty much on the same power level as the .45acp.
- Mulitiple shots. (If the smoke is in your way, you're likley to be dead anyhow,,,,move to cover, move to cover, move to cover,,don't just stand there. Even at that, the smoke isn't quite as bad as is made out.)
- Smoke. Yes, it can obscure YOUR movements as you,,,move to cover, move to cover etc.
- Accpetable accuracy at HD ranges.
- COM shots are possible due to caliber/power level.
-- Cap and Ball Cons --
- Smoke. Yeah, it does smoke more than the others,,, and it can obscure the target.
- Prone to jamming from bits of the percussion cap falling into the works. Mine did that quite a bit.
- Prone to misfires from the grease used to seal the chamber mouths seeping into to chambers. Criso works fine at the range and in the field. It melts pretty easy into a liquid if you keep the thing too close to your body. Using round balls and a felt pad can eliminate the need to grease the chamber mouths, but you pay for it with a less effective bullet.(sumptin 'bout no free lunch)
- Slow to reload.
- Limited time for remaining loaded. BP and it's substitutes are hydroscopic. They'll pull moisture out of the air given half a chance. Keeping a cap and ball revolver loaded and ready to go is pretty much a short term affair....personally I don't think I'd keep them that way for more than a week.
(Last but not least)
- Price. A good quality BP revolver, like the Ruger is expensive. Ruger lists them for ~$500.00. The Italian made ones aren't made for long term use/abuse. *and yes, I own 2 of the Italian ones.
- Safety--- BP is nasty stuff. No, let me rephrase that,,,BP is REALLY nasty stuff. Most users of modern firearms and ammunition don't really understand how dangerous BP can be. The common ammunition/smokeless powder practices I see and read about both on-line and in the real world would be extremely iffy using BP.
Bottom line,,,I'd pick the .22 overall. As always, YMMV.
HadEmAll
Member
Can't imagine being in that situation.
HadEmAll
Member
Can't imagine being in that situation.
Longbow
Member
I'll pick the .22. Easier to shoot, so the probability of hitting the BG is greater. I heard that people who are shot makes an attitude adjustment in a hurry! I'll also try to aim at the head, that way he/she would really know they had taken a shot.
Scott13
Member
I would choose the 22 MK 2 . It's more accurate than the derringer . And if you know how to place them i don't think any attacker would keep coming , after 3 or 4 shots .
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