I'm in Singapore right now..

[Gabe]

Having been to Singapore a few times myself, I don't agree the locals think they are oppressed. It's a country with different values and circumstances. They are mostly happy with what they got and are not interested in how we think they should live. Several times strangers I talked to on the street ended our converstation with "welcome to Singapore". Pretty friendly and proud of themselves if you ask me.

Keep in mind Singapore is a city-state. Not a big place with countryside, wilderness, diverse regions. I find all city dwellers to act somewhat like automatons. If the United States consisted of solely the city of Washington D.C. I think your impression of the country wouldn't be too high either. Singaporeans didn't strike me as unhappy. They were a lot happier than most city dwellers I've seen. Vast majority of Singaporeans I talked to liked their system, major complaint was the place was too small.

Singapore is a very prosperous city-state. They like things clean and orderly. As for their laws, if you're not in the habit of breaking them, don't worry about it. Singaporeans are most uptight with drug laws. If you get caught with a joint, you just might get a bullet in the head. I was mostly paranoid about someone slipping something into my luggage.

There were quite a few things I was impressed with Singapore:

1. Compassionate Conservatism that actually works. No welfare problem there, only workfare. No lazy homeless bums whinning about lack of handouts.

2. Charity works. Much of the humane institutions are charity, not government driven. Singaporeans are very giving, and you could see a lot of school kids about raising money.

3. Education. Sinaporeans are well educated, even the poor. Kids take school very seriously, you just don't see the teen-pregnancy, drug use, dropout problems like here.

4. Lack of corruption. Most Asian countries are riddled with government corruption. The Singaporean government is very by the book. We have a lot to learn from them in this regard.

5. Military service. Singapore has a pretty good military using universal conscription modeled on the Swiss. I find this gives a great deal of comadery to the citizentry. Perhaps this also explains the heavily regulation based society.

6. Religious tolerance. You literally see churches, mosques, Buddhist temples right next to eachother. These religions are respectful with one another, and you don't have abnoxious evangelists pushing religion either.

There are minuses of course. The government is elitist and seem to think that unless you have a PhD in political science or economics you got no business debating public issues. The average Joe doesn't ever seem to talk about serious issues. The TV airwaves is all about shopping and eating.

I think it's quite interesting Singapore has taken such a different route and that it works for them. I won't want my country like that but different strokes for different folks.

 

[Gabe]

Twoblink,

While you are there ask around for a crab resturant on the waterfront. I forget the name but its well known. Their crab is AMAZING, especially their Peper Pot Crab. Huge monster crabs full of spicy, perfectly cooked meat.

My advice is to bring a lot of your own napkins.

 

[Gabe]

Unfortuantely Singapore forbid gun ownership. But due to their universal conscription they have rather interesting attitude towards guns.

I was watching a children's TV show. The Mr. Rogers like host was talking about school work and so on when he suddently started talking about military insignia and handsignal recognition. Then he brings out an M-16, saying "and now children, this is a weapon that needs no introduction as I'm sure you are familiar with it already."

Completely floored me.

 

[twoblink]

http://web.singnet.com.sg/~gunclub/

There's another link, but I can't find it. There's shooting clubs, but mostly skeet and trap..

Singaporeans are not happy.. not really.. they are not sad, that's regulated...

There is propoganda everywhere.. There are anti-smoking signs on the streets; I mean literally painted on the streets themselves.

As far as it being a clean place; well... 50% of the world's trashcan is in Singapore... There is one every 5 steps; so if you litter; that means you were too lazy to take 3 steps forward or 2 steps back..

compassionate conservatism?? There is a "rush hour tax" and like everything else; government programs keep increasing and increasing; their taxes just kicked up another 2%... They enjoyed a relatively free economy before the heavy hand of tyranny; and so a lot of the goodness of capitalism carried over; but a lot of it didn't.

I was in Little India where one of the guys who noted my "nice camera" told me I'd better be careful; the past few weeks (with the chinese new year approaching) there has been quite a bit of theft in little india; and so even with thefts being a death penalty charge; death has not been as great of a deterant as the government had hoped... And the problem they are having is; if death isn't a deterant, then there isn't anything much harsher then that..

the problem is: it's STILL government charity regardless how you look at it.. The government hires private companies who hire bums to dig a hole, and then fill it back up again... While you don't see bums on the streets (not true, I took quite a few pics of bums on the streets asking for handouts, photoproof!!) I can tell you; there are cameras EVERYWHERE... and there are government reminders of how to behave..

You don't have to think for yourself, the government will do that for you...

 

[twoblink]

This is twoblink's penpal posting.
Hey Gabe, thanks for the compliments. Just thought I would address some of the stuff that you had posted.
Being a Singaporean myself, I've to admit that I DO feel oppressed to a certain extent. It's really big bro's watching your every move. Not that I'm complaining about the living standard here or what the country's gotta offer (Singapore is one of the safest countries to live in, our police's tagline being low crime does'nt mean no crime explains the crime rate pretty much; the most recent kidnap case took place 3-4 years ago and that's the first in the past 30 years or so. go figure!) but I can't help to actually wish for more breathing space most of the time.
Everything's so well-planned for you, it's almost insane. I don't know of any other Government who would actually come up with a dozen or more campaigns for anything and everything. Just to list some of the examples, 1) The courtesy campaign- to educate Singaporeans about politeness and how to be courteous (This being terribly absurd because if courtesy can be simply taught and implemented through classes and campaigns, I surely would not have met so many rude fellow Singaporeans myself). 2) The speak english campaign- to encourage people to speak english. 3) The speak mandarin campaign- an irony. It was set up after the huge success gained from the speak english campaign. Because people were speaking so much english that they have forgotten or had become incapable to speak mandarin. 4) The give birth now so you can enjoy tax rebates campaign- need i say more?

I could go on with more ridiculous stuff but I shan't. Anyhow, I've known of so many disgruntled people who can't wait to leave and I've got so many friends who refused to come back home after completing their education overseas, they stay in the country where they attended college, find a job and settled down there. Life could'nt be better for them in their own words. So why ain't all this prosperity and stability enough for the younger generation? It's really because Singapore is too stifling place to stay in. I for one, can't wait to leave here.
Singapore is a good place to stay in if you don't mind being ever so regulated. Other than that, I can't think of anything else besides its political/finanical stability and the great variety of food.

With regards to Singapore's supposedly successful education system, I've got alot to spill. Not too long ago, there was a film made locally about the education system and it was a box office success, reason being, people were able to relate to the movie so much. The education system is not that great afterall. Too pressurising. Many of our ministers graduated from colleges overseas, if it's that great, why were they overseas anyway? SHRUG.

Nonetheless, there are more that I could write but because I'm tired and I'm getting incoherent, so I guess, til then.


P/S: Read more about the movie here http://www.funkygrad.com/estyle/displayarticle.php?artID=152&subcat=popcorn

 

[dleong]

Just to list some of the examples, 1) The courtesy campaign- to educate Singaporeans about politeness and how to be courteous (This being terribly absurd because if courtesy can be simply taught and implemented through classes and campaigns, I surely would not have met so many rude fellow Singaporeans myself). 2) The speak english campaign- to encourage people to speak english. 3) The speak mandarin campaign- an irony. It was set up after the huge success gained from the speak english campaign. Because people were speaking so much english that they have forgotten or had become incapable to speak mandarin. 4) The give birth now so you can enjoy tax rebates campaign- need i say more?

It is sad and pathetic that the government has to spend tax dollars to implement a campaign to tell its citizens to be courteous. This, more than anything else, speaks volumes about the inherent paucity of social graces amongst Singaporeans.

Among the more ludicrous campaigns of the past: the "Use Your Hands" campaigns from (if I recall correctly) the late seventies, which purported to encourage Singaporeans to be more willing to engage in manual labour.

The education system is not that great afterall. Too pressurising.

Singapore's education system relies almost totally on rote memorization. This is great for spewing out facts and figures, but almost completely cripples any ability on the part of the student to be creative. Ever wondered why this alleged "superior" education system has not produced any world-class practitioners of the fine arts?

Singapore society is a meritocracy that puts a premium on academic achievement, hence the pressure felt by students to excel in school, where the price of underperformance and/or failure can be high: students who succumb to the pressure often develop physiological and/or psychological problems. Or they may seek the ultimate release: a neighbourhood friend who lived across the street was a straight-'A' student all through his primary, secondary and junior college years. He entered the National University of Singapore in the early nineties to study Computer Science, where he got his first-ever 'B' grade in his life. The day after his examination results were announced, he took a lift to the top floor of a block of HDB flats in Redhill, and jumped.

Anyhow, I've known of so many disgruntled people who can't wait to leave and I've got so many friends who refused to come back home after completing their education overseas, they stay in the country where they attended college, find a job and settled down there. Life could'nt be better for them in their own words.

That would essentially describe my situation. When I left Singapore to study in the US, I had every intention of returning. After all, I had been programmed by the Singapore government to believe that Singapore was Paradise on Earth....

Well, it has been well over a decade since my leaving that prison, and I am still here, having taken up permanent residency.

DL

 

[JGReed]

I spent six months in Singapore back in 1995. It was a great place to visit. I was a bit chubby back then so the heat was brutal, but it was the cleanest city I've ever been to and violent crime is almost non-existant. Being just a temporary visitor, all the oppressive regulations just made it a nice place to stay. Other than expensive beer and the lack of Copenhagen (a habit I've since kicked) there was nothing I missed since I don't urinate outside, smuggle drugs, or spraypaint cars. Don't know about all the comments about Singaporeans being unhappy. I was the only expat working at our plant in Jurong and the folks I worked with didn't seem unhappy. Quite the opposite. They seemed pretty proud of their society and their way of life. And if you compare their standard of living to the countries around them, I can see how some would like it.

Living there permanently would have driven me insane of course. I really don't like being told what to do, and that's a way of life in Singapore. The media is gov't censored, they tax goods and services to a level Americans simply wouldn't believe (DL - what do they call the permit you need for a car? Can't remember), they don't consider things like freedom of speech a right, etc etc. So I'd never relocate there permanently. But I'd go back for a visit in a heartbeat.

 

[twoblink]

Singapore is what Sarah Brady wants to turn America into..

 

[STPRMON1]

Singapore Police

I read in recent magazine that Singapore Police have placed an order for 10,000 Taurus Model 85's with 3" barrels,Crimson Trace
grips and Safariland holsters. Using them to replace their worn out Smith and Wesson revolvers.

 

[twoblink]

In talking with a Singaporean on the airplane, they said that the police at the airport use to carry only pistols, and now quite a few carry (what looks to be) M16's from what he is describing to me (plastic looking EVIL black gun) and so for all the talk about no guns, they are using guns to send a strong message to people visiting their country...