ZenMasterJG
Member
Thats a GREAT analogy! mind if i steal it for my profile? (assuming the mods dont yell at you, of course)
Ireland. PLEASE READ.
- Thread starter sense
- Start date
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Thats a GREAT analogy! mind if i steal it for my profile? (assuming the mods dont yell at you, of course)
Ouch.
Not a clever thing to say. Not going to get you far around here, add in the 'communism is noble' thing and you've lost most of the target audience. Me included.
Honestly don't think sense had any malicious intentions here, just someone stumbling along the internet feeling the need to put their twopenneth in. Not that this is always a bad thing, but research does help sense, it really does.
Play nice everyone.
rhubarb
Member
Let me see. 4 million people. 6 in 1 million chance of someone breaking into your home. Even if each of y'all live in your own houses, that means that you have only 24 break-ins in what, a year? Geez, you're right, you don't need no guns. Antis and their statistics.
Antis and their statistics.
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Zundfolge
Member
There's the shining light on this whole discussion.
Many of us (Americans and pro-gun folk) seem to think that when we're debating this issue with anti-gun folk, Brits, Europeans et al, that they have the same goal of creating and maintaining a free society, and that they define a free society the same way we do.
Clearly in a free society gun control makes no sense, but in a police state (which is what people like sense want, because they believe the lie that they will be "safer") gun control just makes sense.
We're not debating guns, we're debating the definition of liberty.
The problem is the antis think in doublespeak they believe that slavery=freedom because they believe that a police state=security ... and that security=freedom
lunaslide
member
Here is what it really boils down to. If the people cannot be trusted, how can the government?
It is, isn't it? But so is ignorance. On the other hand, wisdom and experience are wonderful things and they come with age. If I discount someone's argument, it is because it doesn't make sense or is otherwise falacious or based on bad infomation. It is not because of their age. So I'll give you some advice I got when I was younger which proves useful at all ages:
Speak little and think before you do, listen a lot and think about what others say, and pay attention to what people do even more than what they say.
dasmi
Member
Wrong. The Government never be given so much power. People should be armed to balance the scale of power. Sorry you don't feel this well, but this is how it is, and has always been, in America. Welcome the THR. If you're ever in Southern California, I'll take you shooting.
KriegHund
Member
Wow, good way to take the high road here guys. I see....very few facts (about 3 posts worth) and bashing someone because their age...more bashing...jokes...and counter agruments based on opinions...
Huh. Real high road quality.
Sense, you sound like me 2 years ago. I thought communism was a great idea. I thought that i would never *actually* need a gun. I thought, well heck, if a robbers gonna rob my house i can just grab my sword and hide around the corner.
Until he shoots my brother and my parents. Until he steals everything. Until he never comes around that corner.
If i had had a gun? I couldve waited around that corner with a gun, or i could have grabbed that gun and done my best to protect my family.
Its more of a "Samuel colt made all men equal" Thing.
0.0800644811599597089458736609687403
Huh. Real high road quality.
Sense, you sound like me 2 years ago. I thought communism was a great idea. I thought that i would never *actually* need a gun. I thought, well heck, if a robbers gonna rob my house i can just grab my sword and hide around the corner.
Until he shoots my brother and my parents. Until he steals everything. Until he never comes around that corner.
If i had had a gun? I couldve waited around that corner with a gun, or i could have grabbed that gun and done my best to protect my family.
Its more of a "Samuel colt made all men equal" Thing.
0.0800644811599597089458736609687403
This thread only needs a few more things:
-Which gun for bear?
-9mm vs. .45ACP
-Hi-Points
-Why 1911s stink
-AK vs. AR
Honestly, for me it comes down to the fact that I am a free human being and as long as I do not harm someone else's right to life or property, I feel no pressure to cease whichever actions I choose. I do not care how others abuse their rights as it has no bearing on my freedom.
Do NOT confuse this attitude with apathy, it is the exact opposite since I follow a certain moral/ethical code and I also believe that it is important to care for your fellow man whether it be by being involved in charity, being a good friend, being a good son to your parents, etc.
An example of the difference in my attitude and yours is that you think that people misuse guns, therefore we must take the guns away. My attitude is that people misuse guns because that is their choice, therefore I must educate people I know to not make those poor choices. P.J. O' Rourke has an excellent quote on this:
"Everyone wants to save the world; no one wants to help mom do the dishes."
-Which gun for bear?
-9mm vs. .45ACP
-Hi-Points
-Why 1911s stink
-AK vs. AR
Honestly, for me it comes down to the fact that I am a free human being and as long as I do not harm someone else's right to life or property, I feel no pressure to cease whichever actions I choose. I do not care how others abuse their rights as it has no bearing on my freedom.
Do NOT confuse this attitude with apathy, it is the exact opposite since I follow a certain moral/ethical code and I also believe that it is important to care for your fellow man whether it be by being involved in charity, being a good friend, being a good son to your parents, etc.
An example of the difference in my attitude and yours is that you think that people misuse guns, therefore we must take the guns away. My attitude is that people misuse guns because that is their choice, therefore I must educate people I know to not make those poor choices. P.J. O' Rourke has an excellent quote on this:
"Everyone wants to save the world; no one wants to help mom do the dishes."
nico
Member
you expect everyone to take every troll seriously? Lighten up. A little troll poking never hurt anybody.
dasmi
Member
Don't forget "GLOCKS SUCK!"
Cosmoline
Member
You don't know your own history. Or perhaps you were taught a PC version of events
Type "Easter Rising" and "Irish Revolution" into google for a little down-and-dirty education. Your freedom was secured by men with rifles--nothing less.
jefnvk
Member
Feel free to use it wherever you want, just give me the credit.
As for the age, it does make a difference. It is generally understood that in your early teens, you have the ideas for world peace. However, you can't grasp what is fundamentally wrong with thoe concepts. And of course, there is usually that whole 'no one can change my mind, I am right, you are wrong' mentality.
JJpdxpinkpistols
Member
genie stuffing in EI vs USA
First off: I am sure spelling errors are due to her native tongue being Gaeilge.
Now:
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ei.html#People
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/us.html#People
EI Pupulation: 4,015,676
US Population: 295,734,134
EI Square KM: 70,280 sq km
US Square KM: 9,631,418 sq km
EI GDP as expressed through purchasing power parity - $126.4 billion (2004 est.)
US GDP as expressed through purchasing power parity - $11.75 trillion (2004 est.)
and finally my FAVE measure of the health and vitality of any nation (and yes, EI passes this test):
number of radio broadcast stations:
EI: AM 9, FM 106, shortwave 0 (1998)
US: AM 4,854, FM 8,950, shortwave 18 (2004)
AS you can see, we aren't just "bigger"...we are freakin' huge! this isn't the difference between medium and large sodas at the theater. This is the difference between a thimble and a 20 liter drum. We have 73.6 TIMES your population, and we can fit 137 or your countryside into ours.
This is not to say that bigger is better...it isn't. But what would work on an island the size of one our smallish states couldn't possibly work on a country of our size.
Leaving out our peculiar attitudes as Americans...the numbers just don't pencil out. Not by a longshot. Heck, we have more guns than you have people: According to USA Today, we have 250 MILLION guns here. That comes to 62.25 guns for every man, woman and child in EI.
Genie Stuffing for fun and profit, anyone? If 60% of households in Ireland *had* guns at the time of disarmament (and I am not sure that is the case). that would make...uhh...1 million guns? 1 million vs 250 million. Stuffing 250 million genies into a bottle would be quite impossible.
First off: I am sure spelling errors are due to her native tongue being Gaeilge.
Now:
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ei.html#People
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/us.html#People
EI Pupulation: 4,015,676
US Population: 295,734,134
EI Square KM: 70,280 sq km
US Square KM: 9,631,418 sq km
EI GDP as expressed through purchasing power parity - $126.4 billion (2004 est.)
US GDP as expressed through purchasing power parity - $11.75 trillion (2004 est.)
and finally my FAVE measure of the health and vitality of any nation (and yes, EI passes this test):
number of radio broadcast stations:
EI: AM 9, FM 106, shortwave 0 (1998)
US: AM 4,854, FM 8,950, shortwave 18 (2004)
AS you can see, we aren't just "bigger"...we are freakin' huge! this isn't the difference between medium and large sodas at the theater. This is the difference between a thimble and a 20 liter drum. We have 73.6 TIMES your population, and we can fit 137 or your countryside into ours.
This is not to say that bigger is better...it isn't. But what would work on an island the size of one our smallish states couldn't possibly work on a country of our size.
Leaving out our peculiar attitudes as Americans...the numbers just don't pencil out. Not by a longshot. Heck, we have more guns than you have people: According to USA Today, we have 250 MILLION guns here. That comes to 62.25 guns for every man, woman and child in EI.
Genie Stuffing for fun and profit, anyone? If 60% of households in Ireland *had* guns at the time of disarmament (and I am not sure that is the case). that would make...uhh...1 million guns? 1 million vs 250 million. Stuffing 250 million genies into a bottle would be quite impossible.
nico
Member
Yeah, but she hasn't caught anything.
I, on the other hand (and everyone else on the boat), caught my limit of rock fish and a few dozen croaker and spot this past Saturday.
Byron Quick
Moderator In Memoriam
sense,
I have sucessfully defended myself against what would have been either death or massive brain damage with a handgun. I did not have to shoot my assailant. When he realized that I had evaded his first attack and was drawing a pistol...he dropped his weapon. He was armed with a three foot hickory sledge hammer handle. I believe that such are available where you live in stores that sell such. If not, do trees such as oaks grow there? If so, then someone can arm themselves as my assailant was armed. Tell you what, get someone to attack armed with a three foot sledge hammer handle wrapped in foam rubber and tape. If a knife is so easy to defend against then surely this foam and tape wrapped piece of hardwood will be even more easily defended against. Word of advice: Wear a helmet, goggles, and use a protective mouth piece during this defensive experiment. Tell your 'opponent' to go all out and hit you as much as he or she can.
I would have been dead or sustained massive brain damage without a firearm being immediately available. Why do you want me to be dead or in a permanent vegetative state? To my knowledge I have not harmed you in any way. Your hostility is not logical.
Oh, the typing thing. Two words of advice: 1)Compose your post in MS Word or Notepad and then use spell check. 2) Once you post here then read your post and use the edit function.
One more point. I own over fifty firearms. Some of them have been in my family for one hundred years. I've been watching them closely for years and years. None of them have escaped the safe during that time. None have been involved in any crime of any type. They have only been involved in the legal activities of target shooting, hunting, and self defense. Your premise is that I should not be allowed to have them, right?
Castro's Cuba. Please
Please do research on Cuba's political prisoners under Castro. And how they have been treated. Same goes with Ho Chi Minh's paradise. There's a reason that thousands of Vietnamese 'boat people' fled the worker's paradise. Communism's goals as stated sound noble. Only one practical problem with that goal: it totally ignores human psychology and motivation. Good system for intelligent ants or bees though. The fact of the matter is that communism is a perfect breeding ground for megalomaniacs. Communists have killed more of their own citizens than private individuals with guns have ever come close to doing. Do the math. Add up the columns: Column 1: Number of people killed by private murderers with guns and then Column 2: Number of people killed by communist murderers with guns and other things. Some nobility, lady!
I have sucessfully defended myself against what would have been either death or massive brain damage with a handgun. I did not have to shoot my assailant. When he realized that I had evaded his first attack and was drawing a pistol...he dropped his weapon. He was armed with a three foot hickory sledge hammer handle. I believe that such are available where you live in stores that sell such. If not, do trees such as oaks grow there? If so, then someone can arm themselves as my assailant was armed. Tell you what, get someone to attack armed with a three foot sledge hammer handle wrapped in foam rubber and tape. If a knife is so easy to defend against then surely this foam and tape wrapped piece of hardwood will be even more easily defended against. Word of advice: Wear a helmet, goggles, and use a protective mouth piece during this defensive experiment. Tell your 'opponent' to go all out and hit you as much as he or she can.
I would have been dead or sustained massive brain damage without a firearm being immediately available. Why do you want me to be dead or in a permanent vegetative state? To my knowledge I have not harmed you in any way. Your hostility is not logical.
Oh, the typing thing. Two words of advice: 1)Compose your post in MS Word or Notepad and then use spell check. 2) Once you post here then read your post and use the edit function.
One more point. I own over fifty firearms. Some of them have been in my family for one hundred years. I've been watching them closely for years and years. None of them have escaped the safe during that time. None have been involved in any crime of any type. They have only been involved in the legal activities of target shooting, hunting, and self defense. Your premise is that I should not be allowed to have them, right?
Castro's Cuba. Please
Please do research on Cuba's political prisoners under Castro. And how they have been treated. Same goes with Ho Chi Minh's paradise. There's a reason that thousands of Vietnamese 'boat people' fled the worker's paradise. Communism's goals as stated sound noble. Only one practical problem with that goal: it totally ignores human psychology and motivation. Good system for intelligent ants or bees though. The fact of the matter is that communism is a perfect breeding ground for megalomaniacs. Communists have killed more of their own citizens than private individuals with guns have ever come close to doing. Do the math. Add up the columns: Column 1: Number of people killed by private murderers with guns and then Column 2: Number of people killed by communist murderers with guns and other things. Some nobility, lady! CletusFudd
Member
- Joined
- Oct 15, 2003
- Messages
- 70
Knives easy to defend against
"knives are much easier to defend against then guns. and a person wielding a knife is al lot less likely to use it."
You've never seen someone attacked with a knife have you?
"knives are much easier to defend against then guns. and a person wielding a knife is al lot less likely to use it."
You've never seen someone attacked with a knife have you?
KriegHund
Member
Heck, ive been trained in knife techniques and the best i can do is do a (ironic) knife hand block to just block their attempts at stabbing you. Even managed to grab their hand once, and if we werent sparring i woulda broken their arm. The running away.
Guess what happens! I end up with a lotta chalk on my forearms and hand...that would equate to a lot of cuts.
So...maybe...if im really lucky...i can break their arm. A 10% chance maybe.
Orrrrr i can pull out a makarov and neither of us gets hurt.
Guess what happens! I end up with a lotta chalk on my forearms and hand...that would equate to a lot of cuts.
So...maybe...if im really lucky...i can break their arm. A 10% chance maybe.
Orrrrr i can pull out a makarov and neither of us gets hurt.
P95Carry
Moderator Emeritus
sense - consider this. If a government does not or cannot trust its people - then why should the people trust government.!? Trust is a two way deal.
You may yourself consider people cannot be trusted but - folks even there in Eire are ''trusted'' to drive cars - tho of course some kill themselves, or others. Same here - there are things called rights and the U.S. thank heaven has still way more rights than most other places - it is all to do with liberty, freedom and self-determination.
Appropos your typing, spelling, grammar and ageism elements ........ sad to say, however young or old you are - there is this thing called ''credibility''. Your poor typing, construction and general presentation does sadly reflect against your subject matter - like it or not. Everyone makes errors - typo's usually but - if presentation is too bad then as you may have seen - a measure of ridicule creeps in - it goes with the territory!
2nd Amendment
member
Yeah, well, I'm now ashamed to be Irish...
Zundfolge
Member
can't believe I missed that one.
You've got it backward.
1st rule of a knife fight; you WILL get cut
According to the FBI, people who rob with knives or bludgeons are significantly more likely to strike first and then take your stuff off your unconscious or dead body then someone with a gun. A larger percentage of those who rob with a gun use the gun as a bluff. People who rob with knives and bludgeons are NOT as likely to be bluffing.
If you know what you're doing, taking a gun away from someone is much easier then taking a knife away from an attacker (see that 1st rule of a knife fight) ... if you don't know what you're doing your chance of taking a knife away from an attacker is SIGNIFICANTLY less then taking a gun away from an attacker.
and I can't believe I didn't respond to this one:
Again, bass-ackward.
In the US, according to the FBI there are approx 800,000 crimes committed each year with firearms. Since the early 1990s there have been something like 14 studies done and the general results are that between 1.5 and 2.5 million times a year citizens use firearms in self defense (and the vast majority of the time the weapon isn't even discharged ... let alone killing any badguys).
Do the math that's between 1.875 to 3.125 self defensive uses of firearms for every single crime committed.
Its a simple cost/benefit analysis with the benefit greatly outweighing the cost.
The simple and verifiable fact is that a well armed populace is going to have less crime overall then a disarmed one.
But then again maybe you Irish are different ... maybe y'all can't be trusted with guns (although I doubt that's true).
I don't know whats worse ... the occasional troll we get around here or the gaggle of THR'rs who cry "TROLL" every time some mass media programed sheep comes 'round here asking the same silly questions and not listening to the answers ... some of them are trolls ... some of them are people looking to be educated and that is what THR is here for (well, that and the occasional Zombie Ninja Bear Self Defense discussion).sense, if you're hear to learn then good for you ... welcome aboard and enjoy the road to enlightenment
If you're actually a troll ... go here and ask yourself if that's really what you want to waste your time being.
campergeek
Member
Now there's a definition of utopia if I ever saw one!
Owen
Moderator Emeritus
sense,
Can you be trusted? Do you often go on murderous rampages?
If you don't, why do you insult all of us by presuming that we do?
Why are you so much better than the average person, that your insight allows you to dictate, sight unseen, to people you have never met, what is best for them?
Most of the people here honestly believe that the average Joe, er, Seamus, is perfectly decent and trustworthy. The reasoning is: I am trustworthy, I am like other people, therefore, other people are trustworthy.
Simple, no?
If individuals are so untrustworthy, why would you trust the government, which is composed entirely of individuals?
The stated INTENT of Communism is noble. The execution of communism is not. If a system depends on good leaders to thrive, then the system is flawed.
Oh, and read a few history books about the Easter Uprising in 1916 through 1921 or so. It won't hurt much, I promise.
Can you be trusted? Do you often go on murderous rampages?
If you don't, why do you insult all of us by presuming that we do?
Why are you so much better than the average person, that your insight allows you to dictate, sight unseen, to people you have never met, what is best for them?
Most of the people here honestly believe that the average Joe, er, Seamus, is perfectly decent and trustworthy. The reasoning is: I am trustworthy, I am like other people, therefore, other people are trustworthy.
Simple, no?
If individuals are so untrustworthy, why would you trust the government, which is composed entirely of individuals?
The stated INTENT of Communism is noble. The execution of communism is not. If a system depends on good leaders to thrive, then the system is flawed.
Oh, and read a few history books about the Easter Uprising in 1916 through 1921 or so. It won't hurt much, I promise.
gc70
Member
Five pages of troll food!
And quit ragging on Ireland; it's a beautiful country - with lots of sheep. 'Nuf said.
And quit ragging on Ireland; it's a beautiful country - with lots of sheep. 'Nuf said.
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