WestKentucky
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On the thread topic question....Coming from a guy who carries a 6" 44 mag concealed...nope.
Is a 10mm too much for self defense?
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Two year old thread brought back to life.Good pictures there. As for the 6" barrels, I chose those because they're available for all of them, I could have chosen a 4", but while I know of 4" .40's I don't know of any 4" 10mm's, but close (G29 vs G23), or maybe 4.5" vs 4.6", etc. Most 10mm guys to buy the 6" barrel since it's velocity they're after, that's why I chose the 6". Common? Yes in terms of availability, not so much in terms of being a top choice for everyday carry.
When I loaded for the 10mm, I was able to break 1400 fps from a 6+" barrel (180gr), but I was using loads that were over book, but I'm sure it can get pretty close depending on powder. Longshot would get me around 1265-ish from the G20, I can't find all of the data I had for the 6", but could see where high 1300's would be possible.
As for the Gold Dots, I didn't say the 155gr and 165gr were shallow compared to say a 125gr .355gr 357 Sig, but "shallowER" (I said MORE shallow...maybe not a good grammar choice) than the 180gr Gold Dot. Your results are exactly what I would expect, more penetration with the .355" Gold Dot and .357" JHP compared to the lower sectional density 155gr .400". The true shallow cavity Gold Dots do hold up better for sure, I simply should have said that the shallower the cavity, it seems the better it holds up compared to deeper cavities.
Finally settled on carrying DT's 125gr TAC-XP in a Fusion built 1911 Commander, light recoil with very fast split times works well when living the country life. wrdwrght
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Hardcast and polygonal rifling are not generally a combination that produces accuracy (check out Hickok45's proof).
If memory serves, Buffalo Bore produces the only hardcast that can go where you point it out of Glock's barrel.
For accuracy and choice, you can drop in a 10mm barrel with traditional rifling. I've dropped in a KKM Precision in .40 in my Glock 20 for cheaper range outings and will soon get their 10mm for whatever hardcast.
Yeah old thread, since then I've gotten back into the 10mm sort of, not out of necessity but rather just because. I've got a Gen4 29 and 20, just ran some 180gr XTP's with 3N38 through the 5" KKM and was getting just shy of 1400 fps (although I still consider 1400 fps too fast for any 180gr JHP) and 225gr hardcasts just short of 1250 fps.
But I've also gotten into the .41 Magnum too, so I'm not sure I'll keep the 10mm around as I still don't think it's that much better than a .40, but I'm not going to totally disagree with anyone who feels otherwise, we all have our opinions!
That said, I've got some 180gr and 155gr factory Hornady XTP's and they do well. I want to think the 180's were hovering around 11175-200 from the 20 and the 155's were just north of 1300 fps, both what I consider to be top notch self defense loads for the 10mm.
But I've also gotten into the .41 Magnum too, so I'm not sure I'll keep the 10mm around as I still don't think it's that much better than a .40, but I'm not going to totally disagree with anyone who feels otherwise, we all have our opinions!
That said, I've got some 180gr and 155gr factory Hornady XTP's and they do well. I want to think the 180's were hovering around 11175-200 from the 20 and the 155's were just north of 1300 fps, both what I consider to be top notch self defense loads for the 10mm.
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There are two notable disadvantages. Slow draw and slower follow up shots if ammo loaded to full potential is used with no practical gain over what .40S&W or .45ACP can deliver in easier to tote package. Another problem is there are only two suitable guns in this caliber for CCW: G29 and black short-barreled alloy-framed S&W revolver. Compare G29 to .45 XDs or S&W CS and you will quickly understand.
jerkface11
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Only two guns suitable for concealed carry? The witness compact comes to mind. Not to mention various 1911's.
Deaf Smith
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I, a long time ago, had a Glock 29, 10 mm. Course I traded it off years ago.
One day I'll get a slim frame 29 to replace it.
Yes I have .44s, .45s, .357s, 9mms, etc, and any of them will do to ride the river with, but I still miss that little howitzer.
An as for if the 10 mm is 'to much' for SD, heck, a 12 gauge is not 'to much' so why would a 10 mm be excessive? As for handguns to CCW, as long as you can control the gun one handed, pick the most powerful one you can get.
Deaf
One day I'll get a slim frame 29 to replace it.
Yes I have .44s, .45s, .357s, 9mms, etc, and any of them will do to ride the river with, but I still miss that little howitzer.
An as for if the 10 mm is 'to much' for SD, heck, a 12 gauge is not 'to much' so why would a 10 mm be excessive? As for handguns to CCW, as long as you can control the gun one handed, pick the most powerful one you can get.
Deaf
The G29 with Federal 180gr Hydra-Shock ammo is very good self defense combo because that round is loaded to .40S&W velocity levels and has same stopping power as .45Auto with 185gr bullets.
gun_with_a_view
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In considering large predator attacks, namely bear in North America, there is not going to a lot of time to get off multiple rounds before the animal in on you, if your shooting did not stop it. I'd feel better off packing one of the larger caliber revolvers on the market due to their ultimate dependability as opposed to a semi-auto. Forced to carry a semi-auto for large animals, one might opt for 357 SIG in hardball over the .40 and 10mm. Positive round feeding with the tapered case, reportedly excellent accuracy and I would think very good penetration.
Deaf Smith
Member
.357 Sig? Nah... 9x25 Dillon.
It's a 10mm necked own to 9mm. And yes the Glock 29 could have a barrel in that.
Lone Wolf makes the barrel and ...
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...&mid=89023C77C97FA0974B6F89023C77C97FA0974B6F
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...&mid=CDA2351B4E611E4E558ACDA2351B4E611E4E558A
Now that has some penetration!
BTW, I use the Glock 32 and 31 in .357 Sig. I do think very highly of it.
Deaf
atblis
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How much different is 357 SIG loaded to 10mm length?
Deaf Smith
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About 200 fps, same weight bullet and same barrel length.
Deaf
Deaf
Zaydok Allen
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It depends on where you will be carrying said 10mm. In general though, I think it's a good choice.
... Which is EXACTLY the reason for NOT getting a 10mm pistol, whether the G20, G29 or some other.If you're only going to load it with .40-level ammo, skip the 10mm cartridge altogether and just get a .40 pistol, like a G23. Then you can enjoy "low-end" 10mm stopping power inside a 9mm-size gun. Otherwise, you're wasting money. Besides toting around a gun built off the larger 10mm/.45-frame, you're paying for downloaded performance out of more expensive brass.
Leave the 10mm cartridge for those who can actually appreciate the energy of real 10mm loads.
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AKMtnRunner
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Have to agree. Overpowering the bullet's design is the thing to worry about. Pushing a HP too fast could more than cancel out any advantages with high velocity. But, there are some good tough bullets like XTP's, perhaps Barnes TAC-XP's that test well in gelatin. And the XTP's are well known for holding up well at very high 10mm 6" inch barrel velocities on deer, pigs, and black bear; albeit with often complete pass through. Another good option is using hard cast lead if deep penetration if the goal.
To me, the 10mm is best applied on game or animal defense. But then again, we all know a handgun is underpowered when it comes to stopping two legged attackers, hence the "shoot til stop moving" training, so I see no problem with more power if bullet performance is equal, and the carrying and handling the bigger weapons are irrelevant to the shooter. There are plenty of reasons why a 9/40/45 may work better, practically, on human attackers
To me, the 10mm is best applied on game or animal defense. But then again, we all know a handgun is underpowered when it comes to stopping two legged attackers, hence the "shoot til stop moving" training, so I see no problem with more power if bullet performance is equal, and the carrying and handling the bigger weapons are irrelevant to the shooter. There are plenty of reasons why a 9/40/45 may work better, practically, on human attackers
Which is why I carry a G30..................
This really isn't that difficult of a subject, there's a lot of 10mm bullet performance data available if one is willing to do a Google search.
In theory, the Barnes TAC-XP bullet design doesn't have an upper impact velocity limit. Gunblast tested the 125gr TAC-XP bullet from Double Tap at 1580fps MV.
http://www.doubletapammo.net/index.php?route=product/product&path=127_158&product_id=662
I don't need to dress up like GI Joe to carry a 1911/10mm or G20SF, I can easily conceal a 1911 without resulting to strapping on a thigh holster and <.20 sec split times are very doable with this Double Tap ammunition.
In theory, the Barnes TAC-XP bullet design doesn't have an upper impact velocity limit. Gunblast tested the 125gr TAC-XP bullet from Double Tap at 1580fps MV.
http://www.doubletapammo.net/index.php?route=product/product&path=127_158&product_id=662
I don't need to dress up like GI Joe to carry a 1911/10mm or G20SF, I can easily conceal a 1911 without resulting to strapping on a thigh holster and <.20 sec split times are very doable with this Double Tap ammunition.
rodinal220
Member
I have a added a G20 to my list of back country guns. I normally would use a Ruger BH of some kind in 45 Colt with a heavy bullet. The Glock is great as its very reliable and can take a beating. 10mm is a nice cartridge and I have seen what it can do on large critters with proper shot placement and good bullets.
dakota1911
Member
Higher ammo costs and higher blast noise. This is like indoors with no ear protection.
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