is Czech 7.62x25 safe for cz-52

[jonnyc]

"comes on links for the belt-fed CZ52"

Not sure if this is a joke, but if you mean the ammo that is loaded onto stripper-clips, yes, just take them off and load them into your pistol. It is ammo intended for both SMG and pistol use.

 

[Blofeld]

I read about the Bulgarian stuff elsewhere, funny headstamp and wrapped in an awful pink paper, and it would blow your 52 apart instantly. It came in odd numbered bundles and was strictly for sub guns.

I read this after a range trip where I put several hundred through my 52 with no incident. It was dirty, it is corrosive, but I still use it with no ill effect.

 

[wnycollector]

Truth be told, my polish tok prefers the bulgarian stuff! SUPER accurate and zero ftf's!

 

[JR47]

That's a wonderful chronological ordering of "experimental overloads". Is it important to the life-expectancy of the CZ52? ONLY if you use overloaded ammunition. While it's nice to know that the Tokarov will survive deliberate abuse, it's meaningless.

In March, 2000, a letter "debunking" the "myth" that Czech ammo was loaded hotter was submitted. How nice. Was the Czech ammunition tested from the original specifications, or export ammunition? We know that the CZ52 was replaced in military usage in the 1960s. Ammunition manufactured afterwards could quite possibly have been loaded to the Soviet standard.

In 1970, the Army did testing on the ammunition that it had obtained. It lists 42k c.u.p. as the discovered standard pressure. The Russian version was loaded lighter, for whatever reason. Again, so what? In 2000, had the Russians uploaded their ammo for the PPS guns, as the TT33 was obsolete?

Velocity isn't attained ONLY via pressure. However, the Russians, themselves, in the 1960s published a warning on the use of Czech Ball in 7.62x25 in their Tokarov pistols. Evidently, they felt it necessary, but the TT-33 was a substitute standard by then, having been replaced by the Makarov.

All I can find in this entire missive is that you will destroy a CZ52 barrel at OVERLOADED pressures below that which will rupture a TT-33 barrel. Why are we overloading the ammunition in the first place, and how does this concern the user who fires commercially available ammo, or even uses the latest re-loading manuals?

The Title is Czech 7.62x25 safe for CZ-52. I find nothing in the information presented that would question the safety of the CZ-52, or it's user, unless deliberately over-pressure ammunition was used. If that happens, it's the person who uses it's fault.

I will say, however, that the research presented is no doubt true, as far as it goes. It's been done in a scientific manner, and is arguably the best presentation that I've ever seen.

FYI, my ability to speak on Czech records for the CZ52 was provided by the military attache' at the Czech Embassy in D.C. in 1992. Through contacts in the government, I was allowed to interview him on this subject. He had researched it purposefully prior to the meeting.

 

[eatont9999]

I guess it works the same as the belt fed 1911!!

 

[mgregg85]

The CZ is a good pistol, not terribly strong as it is reputed to be, but accurate.

I have heard warnings to stay away from the stripper clip ammo as that was supposedly intended for SMGs and not pistols.

 

[atblis]

Is it important to the life-expectancy of the CZ52? ONLY if you use overloaded ammunition.

Why are we overloading the ammunition in the first place, and how does this concern the user who fires commercially available ammo, or even uses the latest re-loading manuals?

Hmmm. You do realize that proof testing is an industry accepted process, Right?

 

[Teapot]

Owning the CZ-52 should not make one argue its' strength in the face of evidence. Hey, the Czechs didn't even trust their own pistol.

 

[JR47]

Actually, the Czech's used the pistol for at least a decade in primary service. It was then relegated to secondary service for at least another two decades. The Czech forces had to conform to the Soviet standard, one reason why the VZ58 rifle was first converted to 7.62x39, then replaced entirely.

The CZ52 was replaced by the CZ50, originally designed for the police. That was later upgraded to the CZ70. Handguns for Soviet Block forces weren't for offensive use.

 

[nalioth]

one reason why the VZ58 rifle was first converted to 7.62x39, then replaced entirely.

Wait, what?

The Vz58 has been in continuous service with the Czechs since it's introduction. It has never been replaced by the Czechs and can be seen today arming Czech soldiers on peacekeeping duty.

 

[HorseSoldier]

I think he may have been thinking of the vz.52 (rifle, not pistol), which started out in the Czech 7.62 intermediate round, then was converted to 7.62x39. (And then was replaced by the vz.58, though not for Warsaw Pact commonality, but because the 58 is a better assault rifle design than the 52.)

 

[JR47]

I apologize, I was thinking of the earlier rifle, but my fingers got ahead of my thinking.