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Is IMR 4350 fast enough for M-1 Garand?

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by Ignition Override, May 14, 2013.

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  1. Ignition Override

    Ignition Override Member

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    A local guy has two bottles for sale with the brown labels.

    To be clear, I only reload .303 and .308 but in the future will Someday reload for my M-1.
    No data is published for this powder regarding .303/.308 using 150 grain bullets in my Lee charts. Maybe it would fill the cases.

    If 4350 is not suitable for the Garand, can it be safely used for .303 or .308?
    If so, I would not know where data is published for minimum grain loads.
     
  2. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    IMR-4350 is not too fast.

    It is slower then typical powders used in the Garand such as IMR-4895, IMR-4064, BL-C2, and others.

    It is not listed in the Hornady #6 manual for any bullet weight for use in the M1 Garand.

    It is slow enough, it could cause high gas port pressure and a bent operating rod.

    It can be safely used in the other calibers in bolt-action rifles.

    However, it is too slow burning to be an optimal powder choice with most bullet weights in .303 or .308.

    However if it is cheap enough, it will launch bullets down range.

    rc
     
  3. Ignition Override

    Ignition Override Member

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    Thanks rc.

    I suspect that even if reloading figures are found for .303 or .308, the powder loads could require compressed bullets, which many reloaders seem to avoid.
     
  4. gamestalker

    gamestalker member

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    I've never heard of a powder charge causing compressed bullets?
    As for IMR-4350 being too fast, no, it's actually a fairly slow burning powder in it's cartridge class. I use it for 30-06, .270 win, 25-06, .243 win, 6mm Rem, .280 rem., 7mm RM, and I'm sure I probably missed a few. But IMR-4350 has been a very popular powder, for a large number of high power cartridges, for a very long time. But as RC said, it may not be the best choice for your application.

    GS
     
  5. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    I use almost nothing other than H4350 for bolt action 30-06 ammo but 4350 in the smaller 308 case or the low pressure 303 British is probably not a good idea. It's just too slow a powder for those applications IMO. Hodgdon doesn't even provide load data for 4350 in the .308 Win and when that happens there's usually a very good reason. (sorry)

    All the manuals I have don't list data for the .308 with 4350 and in the 303 British only with the heaviest bullets. (174gr)
     
  6. Ignition Override

    Ignition Override Member

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    Thanks for the info.

    Anybody else near Memphis can look on Armslist TN and buy 2 lbs. of 4350 for approx. $50 if still available.
     
  7. USSR

    USSR Member

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    IMR4350 or any of the other 4350 burn rate powders are too slow for the M1 Garand's gas system, unless you use an adjustable gas plug such as the Schuster.

    Don
     
  8. MtnCreek

    MtnCreek Member

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    I've played w/ R17 and 208gr bullets in .308 recently. H4350 is similar. I assume IMR4350 is similar, but never used it. Best results were w/ the bullet loaded very long. I'm not sure if it was the reduced jump to rifling or the increased case capacity. With a ~150gr bullet in .308, 4895 is my favorite.
     
  9. BBDartCA

    BBDartCA Member

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    +1 Too slow, could cause op rod damage.

    But, its one of the most accurate powders I've used for 30-06 with 165 to 180gr bullets.
     
  10. TonyT

    TonyT Member

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    IM-4350 will work well in 303 and 308 Win especially with the heavier bullet eights. It is not suitable for the M-1 Garand.
     
  11. stubbicatt

    stubbicatt Member

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    I would stick with IMR 4895.

    Good luck.
     
  12. ottsixx

    ottsixx Member

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    IMR 4350 is a wonderful powder for the 30-06
     
  13. jmr40

    jmr40 Member

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    True, but not in a Garand. Probably not the best choice in any semi-auto.

    It along with H-4350 is my go to powder in my 30-06 bolt rifles.
     
  14. rodinal220

    rodinal220 Member

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    IMR 4895 or 4064.
     
  15. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    Short and sweet. I agree IMR4895, H4895, IMR4064, along with AA2495 (Accurate Arms 4895 equivalent), AA2520 (Accurate's Ball Powder equivalent for 4895) are all great powders in the M1 Garand. IMR4895 (Improved Military Powder) was developed to load the 30-06 cartridge for the M1.

    IMR4895, H4895 and AA2495 are ALMOST interchangeable and they act almost identically. All three have slightly different data and the data is not interchangeable. I wonder why Accurate didn't name it AA4895, but they didn't. According to the Hodgdon charts IMR4895 is slightly faster than H4895 which is slightly faster than AA2495. The Accurate charts show the exact opposite, that's how close all 3 are. If you stick with any of those powders you will produce accurate 30-06 ammo which is perfectly safe to shoot in the M1 without using a variable gas plug.

    As a side note, I have found IMR4064 to be most accurate in my .308 Win ammo, but that might just be in my loads and rifles.
     
  16. MtnCreek

    MtnCreek Member

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    IME, H4895 is faster than IMR4895.
     
  17. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    I think that's more dependent on which cartridge you're loading, how heavy the bullet is and what pressures you're generating.
     
  18. rodregier

    rodregier Member

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    Hornady's current reloading manuals have "service rifle" loads for the M1, M14 (M1A) and I think AR15 too.
     
  19. lgbloader

    lgbloader Member

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    I like 4350 and it works great in bolt action 30-06 rifles. I don't think I would be grabbing for a can of it for my M1 Garand, though.
    RC said it best.

    LGB
     
  20. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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  21. Ignition Override

    Ignition Override Member

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    Thanks for the feedback, and
    243winxb, for the link.
     
  22. MAG-63

    MAG-63 Member

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    I use IMR 4895 for the M1, (where it works beautifully) and IMR 4350 when loading 30-40 Krag and my other 30-caliber bolt-action rifles.
     
  23. Ignition Override

    Ignition Override Member

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    The bullets are 174 grain match.
    A friend (who moved to FL) still has contacts on his old military rifle team and gets them for free, now and then.
     
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