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Is the A2 Ar-15 obsolete?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by 7Star, Jun 6, 2009.

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  1. 7Star

    7Star Member

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    With the trend to the M-4 and flat tops... is the A2 fixed carry handle just waiting to become obsolete? Specifically, is there a benefit to the fixed A2 set-up or the carry handle sites in general over a flip up site or metal site other option??
     
  2. raskolnikov_22

    raskolnikov_22 Member

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    I used to read that the carry handle reinforced the upper, making the A2 stronger than the A4, though the A4 is definitely strong enough.
     
  3. RP88

    RP88 Member

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    the one benefit is that you usually don't have to pay extra for it, whereas detachable A2/A4 handles cost like 80-120 bucks.

    But yes, with the rise of optics, fixed handles are going to starting being seen less and less.
     
  4. slzy

    slzy Member

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    i am not sure it was ever a carrying handle. you can of course carry it that way,but it is awkward.

    if the ar-10 had cocked like a ar180,i don't think we would ever have seen a carrying handle version.
     
  5. P.B.Walsh

    P.B.Walsh Member

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    Mabey, I can see how that's true, because you can mount an A2 carry handle on a flatop, even a match rifle (irons only), if the A2 upper messes up, then well, you're screwed, with an A3 or A4, you can just pop another carry handle on. So they might be obsolete, I do, however, like the classic look without all the stuff on it.
     
  6. taliv

    taliv Moderator

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    it's obsolete
     
  7. 7Star

    7Star Member

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    .... but is the A2 style rear site on the handle, removable or fixed, better than the flip up or other iron sites? ..i am not sure I understand the purpose in the first place. I do know I like the it in application.. but it is all I have used.
     
  8. jpwilly

    jpwilly Member

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    It's obsolete. It has become a mounting platform for much better sighting systems.
     
  9. raskolnikov_22

    raskolnikov_22 Member

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    I believe it's purpose was as a carry handle, a feature also found on the FAL.
     
  10. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    For most military purposes the M16A2 or AR-15A2 works just fine within the range limits of the standard issue 5.56mm cartridge. More velocity and a longer sight radius.
    For that matter the old M16A1 was not so bad out to 300 meters. It was lighter and the basic A1 sight could not be knocked off or broken as easily as the A2 sight.


    The design of the sight rear sight mount was carried over from the orginal AR-10. The sight mount (carry handle), like the front sight was elevated in order to line up with the shooters eyes when a proper cheeck weld was being used on the fixed stock. The part that appears to be a handle actually was protecting the charging lever of the original AR-10. That charging lever looked like a trigger that extended upward from the bolt carrier. So the lever guard /sight mount appeared to look like a carrying handle. Since the charging lever was in the way, it was not easy to use as a carry handle.
    That design was carried over to the M16, although the M-16 used a different charging handle and not the upper trigger looking thing. It was eventually modified to protect the original sight on both sides and create a handle type gizmo.

    Although any Sgt worth a s*#@ would drop you for 50 push-ups if he saw you carrying your rifle around like a flipping purse.

    When you get into small game and target shooting then a nice flattop with a scope (not an amipoint) is the way to go.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2009
  11. 7Star

    7Star Member

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    because target aquisition for short range is that much better with optics.... What type of rear metal site do you use with optics and is it as good as the A2 style rear site?
     
  12. RP88

    RP88 Member

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    with flat-tops, you can put a flip-up A2 back-up sight on your rifle that can also co-witness with an optic's reticle. And, if you wish not to co-witness with iron sights, you can just keep the rear sight flipped down and only use it in case your optic breaks.

    So really, the base A2 fixed sight is obsolete because it limits you from the conventional things available today that greatly improve field of vision, acquisition, and accuracy in general.

    With a flat-top, you can seriously put whatever you want/need on it, so that is why the A2 fixed sight is going bye-bye as they keep cranking out the flat-tops.
     
  13. nalioth

    nalioth Member

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    No more obsolete than it's operator.
     
  14. 7Star

    7Star Member

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    Personally, I really enjoy the A2 setup. However, I would appreciate the opprotunity to use some newer optics.... however, I do not know if I would be satisfied with the flip up... I'll have to try and get a hands on trial sometime
     
  15. Onmilo

    Onmilo Member

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    The A2 isn't obsolete, It's Retro!:D
     
  16. ccsniper

    ccsniper member

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    I hope not, its the only thing about full length rifles I like. If I were ever to buy an AR it would be a full length one with carrying handle. What ever happened to those century AR's?
     
  17. P.B.Walsh

    P.B.Walsh Member

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    Well, I *might* get a 20" AR15 in the A3 configuation, and I'm just gonna add one.
     
  18. Joe Demko

    Joe Demko Member

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    I sold off a Colt flat top a few years back. I like to shoot with the iron sights and detachable stuff has a way of working itself loose.
     
  19. taliv

    taliv Moderator

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    i'd take the "old M16A1" or the newer M4 over the A2 any day for any purpose except NRA HP competitions.
     
  20. KTALGSTO

    KTALGSTO Member

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    ive been more about the iron sights on A2
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2009
  21. Horsemany

    Horsemany Member

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    Carry handle? Not to a soldier. I remember guys running around the barracks for a looooong time because they accidentally picked up their M-16 by they sights. "It's not a lunch pale" was the DS's expression of choice.

    Some manufacturers actually call it a carry handle in the manual I'm told but I'll never call it that.
     
  22. Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow

    Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow member

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    Drill instructors notwithstanding, there's nothing at all wrong with using it as a carry handle if that's what feels comfortable to ya - not like it's gonna throw off your sights or something. Having said that, yes it's obsolete because with a flattop, you can still have it A2 style with a carry handle rear sight, but also have the versatility to change.
     
  23. PA Freedom

    PA Freedom Member

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    It still can kill good as ever. Some don't need or want optics. It's not obsolete.
     
  24. KTALGSTO

    KTALGSTO Member

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    the whole thing about the removeable carry handle is it isnt permantly fixed anymore so that makes it not as reliable..i would just buy me a acog for my carry handle if i had to have optics.. Or get a flat top upper and have more of a variety of optics. i duno about the handle makin it any stronger though it seems like it might be true?
     
  25. Dan Crocker

    Dan Crocker Member

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    I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this excellent rifle and its time-proven iron sights. It's still extremely lethal, reliable, and accurate. Anyone think that the M1 Garand or the M14 is obsolete? M1903 even?
     
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