Revolver.45
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A .32 ACP generate about 200 joules. A .38 special about 400 joules. Does this mean that being shot two times by a .32 ACP is as bad as being shot one time by a .38 special?
Is two .32 ACP as powerful as one .38 special?
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Dunross
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Two hits from a 32acp one can control is much better than a miss from a 38 one misses with.
Plainly the 38 is the more powerful round, but in my wife's case twelve rounds of 32acp in a gun she can control is better than five rounds of 38 in a two-inch snubby she never enjoyed shooting. She knows nothing of joules. I don't think the bad guy she may one day find it necessary to shoot will know anything of them either.
Plainly the 38 is the more powerful round, but in my wife's case twelve rounds of 32acp in a gun she can control is better than five rounds of 38 in a two-inch snubby she never enjoyed shooting. She knows nothing of joules. I don't think the bad guy she may one day find it necessary to shoot will know anything of them either.
WestKentucky
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I would think it to be a factor of penetration and point of impact. A hole in a heart or lung from either pretty well ruins the bad guys day, and the bigger the hole the worse the injury is, however controlled rapid fire putting 2 holes into major organs seems like it would be as good or better, especially if different organs got damaged.
There’s a story I read some time back, and I’m not sure if it’s true or not, but an American soldier in Vietnam took a hit in the side that pencilled it’s way through his heart. He hiked out injured after the battle and survived. Doubtful that he could have done so with multiple hits. Point is that hitting the right spot is important, but even that’s not always enough. Given the choice between 32 caliber and 36 caliber I would tend to say that 2 32s would be more effective if all shots connected, because a well placed hit is not always an effective hit.
found the news story. Was Korea, not Vietnam.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/story?id=117084&page=1
There’s a story I read some time back, and I’m not sure if it’s true or not, but an American soldier in Vietnam took a hit in the side that pencilled it’s way through his heart. He hiked out injured after the battle and survived. Doubtful that he could have done so with multiple hits. Point is that hitting the right spot is important, but even that’s not always enough. Given the choice between 32 caliber and 36 caliber I would tend to say that 2 32s would be more effective if all shots connected, because a well placed hit is not always an effective hit.
found the news story. Was Korea, not Vietnam.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/story?id=117084&page=1
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the D.O.D. blew at least $300,000,000 and 40 years on questions like this. They didn't really come up with anything. Theres too much dependency on variables... but realistically a 38 produces fewer variables. If this is not a strictly theoretical question, don't forget to consider .32 usually have capacity comparable to .38, and the rimlock issue. .38 also costs about 1/2 as much. Read up on the AN-94 to see how far people take this though.
I could answer this for only $3,000,000 ... any takers ?
I'm going to use KE and loads that penetrate at least 12'' plus consistently expand.
Did not expect to find 32 acp capable of that ^, but ... surprise, surprise.
https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/pocket-pistol-caliber-gel-test-results/
32 acp 4'' barrel Fiocchi 60 gr. XTP 13.5'' / .39 (1,096 fps = 160# KE) <---- I'm surprised by that too, more KE than anticipated.
https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/
38 Special 4'' barrel Remington Golden Saber 125 +P 12.5'' / .59 (989 fps = 272# KE)
Based on those two specimens, assuming equal shot placement (disclaimer), two 32 acp would damage more tissue than one 38 special.
That said, I do not consider 32 acp or 38 special as preferred calibers for me, 9mm minimum, 357Sig/40/10mm/45 are preferred (carried).
Did not expect to find 32 acp capable of that ^, but ... surprise, surprise.
https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/pocket-pistol-caliber-gel-test-results/
32 acp 4'' barrel Fiocchi 60 gr. XTP 13.5'' / .39 (1,096 fps = 160# KE) <---- I'm surprised by that too, more KE than anticipated.
https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/
38 Special 4'' barrel Remington Golden Saber 125 +P 12.5'' / .59 (989 fps = 272# KE)
Based on those two specimens, assuming equal shot placement (disclaimer), two 32 acp would damage more tissue than one 38 special.
That said, I do not consider 32 acp or 38 special as preferred calibers for me, 9mm minimum, 357Sig/40/10mm/45 are preferred (carried).
Can you be sure the second round will hit the center of the hole the first round made? Remember, that first hole is going to be moving, not at the same place in space as when it was created, and also not at the same angle.
748
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You could load a 38 with two 000 buck shot or a 110gr bullet and a 000 buck shot.
FL-NC
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Fake math.
Riomouse911
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If one .32 slug hits the creep in the family joules I’ll say that’s ‘plenty pawhrful stuff 
.
As the guys said, it’s shot placement, penetration and bullet performance that have a much greater impact on a given rounds’ effectiveness than pure energy figures show.
Stay safe.
.As the guys said, it’s shot placement, penetration and bullet performance that have a much greater impact on a given rounds’ effectiveness than pure energy figures show.
Stay safe.
In no way. They are two separate impacts and the energy isn't additive. Placement and penetration as well as energy are components of the complex relationship of "as bad as".
WheelGunMan
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Revolver,
I would say no. I believe Massad AYOOB said it does not work that way. On the other hand, depending on what .38 Special ammo you use, it may not matter. If you are using a top performing load like the +P Gold Dot, Golden Sabre or FEDERAL HST, the one shot may be all you need. On the other hand, if you are using .38 Wadcutters which are usually loaded to a low velocity, the 130 full metal jacket (AIR FORCE) load or the old 158 lead round nose, aka: THE WIDOW MAKER, then a well placed .32ACP hollow point or even a fmj round may be just as effective or even more so since the .32ACP is usually a very easy to shoot round.
I carried a WALTHER PPK in 7.65m.m., known in the U.S. as the .32ACP for personal defense and preferred it to a 5 shot .38 Special. I never considered it a, "BRICK THOUGH GLASS", but I found it much easier to shoot accurately than my my old S&W model 38 snubnose.
If it had been a choice between a .32ACP and a 4 inch barreled .38 Special loaded with one of the above premium loads, then the .38 Special would have been my choice, but you cannot pocket carry a 4 inch, 6 shot .38 Special in my experience.
Jim
I would say no. I believe Massad AYOOB said it does not work that way. On the other hand, depending on what .38 Special ammo you use, it may not matter. If you are using a top performing load like the +P Gold Dot, Golden Sabre or FEDERAL HST, the one shot may be all you need. On the other hand, if you are using .38 Wadcutters which are usually loaded to a low velocity, the 130 full metal jacket (AIR FORCE) load or the old 158 lead round nose, aka: THE WIDOW MAKER, then a well placed .32ACP hollow point or even a fmj round may be just as effective or even more so since the .32ACP is usually a very easy to shoot round.
I carried a WALTHER PPK in 7.65m.m., known in the U.S. as the .32ACP for personal defense and preferred it to a 5 shot .38 Special. I never considered it a, "BRICK THOUGH GLASS", but I found it much easier to shoot accurately than my my old S&W model 38 snubnose.
If it had been a choice between a .32ACP and a 4 inch barreled .38 Special loaded with one of the above premium loads, then the .38 Special would have been my choice, but you cannot pocket carry a 4 inch, 6 shot .38 Special in my experience.
Jim
If it did, it would be unfortunate for the defender.
TTv2
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Agree 100%. I never liked a snub .38, although I do like the Rock Island snubbie 6 shot I have, I prefer a snub in .32 and if Rock Island made a .32 snub, I would have bought that instead.
Where I see .38 being best is when it's shot in a 4 inch barrel and loaded a bit above +P SAAMI pressures. Not full power .357 Mag levels, but somewhere between 22k and 25k PSI.
Pudge
Member
Interesting, I have a mold that throws 75 grain wad cutters in .358. I can stack two in a .38 Special brass, and they hit about 1" apart. Each one of those .38's is a double tap with a .32 (or maybe a .380)?
jmorris
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No. However, it also doesn’t mean getting shot one time with a 38 special is better than being shot twice with a .32 ACP.
There’s not really any way to make a valid comparison.
If given the choice I’d prefer to be shot once with .38 Special versus twice with .32 but only because I don’t want to get shot twice...
Which self defense .38 Special is limited to 1 round? Wouldn’t 2 shots of .38 Special be just as easy and quick as 2 shots of .32 ACP?
If given the choice I’d prefer to be shot once with .38 Special versus twice with .32 but only because I don’t want to get shot twice...
Which self defense .38 Special is limited to 1 round? Wouldn’t 2 shots of .38 Special be just as easy and quick as 2 shots of .32 ACP?
tactikel
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IMHO with handgun rounds penetration and placement is paramount . There often is no correlation between "power" and stopping ability.
The trauma center I work at had a patient brought in with what the surgeon estimated to be a small caliber (.22 lr or .25 acp) wound 3" above the knee, bisected the femoral artery he bled out and was dead before he got to the OR.
Last month we had a patient " Mr Lucky" who was shot 13 times! He told the Paramedics "his stomach hurts" he lived!
I suggest shooting the highest capacity pistol with premium defense rounds you can accurately shoot.
The trauma center I work at had a patient brought in with what the surgeon estimated to be a small caliber (.22 lr or .25 acp) wound 3" above the knee, bisected the femoral artery he bled out and was dead before he got to the OR.
Last month we had a patient " Mr Lucky" who was shot 13 times! He told the Paramedics "his stomach hurts" he lived!
I suggest shooting the highest capacity pistol with premium defense rounds you can accurately shoot.
tubeshooter
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I feel that this is a little like asking "Which is deadlier? Being in one car accident at 55 mph or 2 car accidents at 35 mph?".
Each accident is a traumatic event unto itself.
The second accident won't do any favors to you, obviously...
As many are saying - almost impossible to make a valid and meaningful comparison.
Each accident is a traumatic event unto itself.
The second accident won't do any favors to you, obviously...
As many are saying - almost impossible to make a valid and meaningful comparison.
Average Joe
Member
Being shot by anything is bad, is this a trick question ?
I think there is credence in "multiple wound channels " theory.
Think of the federal 410 revolver rounds fired by a governor /judge.
Essentially 4 36 cal balls with 12-15 inches of penetration in ballistic gel / per trigger pull. You can't precisely aim them but within ten yards or so they group about the size of my hand from my governor.
Each ball round going it's own way may be more incapacitating then a single trigger pull of a larger caliber. YMMV.
Looking for street instances of premium 410 revolver cases doesn't turn up much, but I heard anecdotal cases of its use in Florida being successful.
I bring it up because I've read each buckshot projectile is roughly equivalent to a round of 32 acp fmj. Are 4 rounds COM from mildly loaded 32 acp likely to incapacitate?
Idunno, I'd say yes but it just depends. We all hear the cases of a criminal taking 6 rounds of premium 357 mag jhp or tons of 45 acp HP without affect. Too many variables.
I think each metal object traveling hundreds of feet per second going through your body stands a chance to stop you.
If I knew trouble was coming and only had a pistol, I think I'd opt for a major power caliber I shot the best with and loaded with the best most tested ammo I could get.
I think 4 32 acps per shot is also good to keep handy, quickly deployed, you still need practice and marksmanship but it can throw a lot of well aimed lead on target quickly and maybe give you some more options.
So.. Probably 2 hits are better than one.
We all work within our physical limitations.
If age or injury means you max out at 32 act, just practice quickly hitting COM, work up to hitting a 4 inch circle at ten yards as quickly as possible. The round served police in Europe for many years. It has the penetration necessary if placed somewhere vital.
If you can place two to the chest one to the head in a couple of seconds that IMO is formidable.
I like the 38 in a j frame and recommend hornady critical defense lite if recoil is be issue.
From even the airweight revolvers these rounds don't really kick. 90 grain jhp that will usually expand to .45-.5 or more and meet 12 inches of penetration in ballistics gel.
Definitely better than the 130 gr fmj, 158 gr lrn. The wadcutters punch above their weight class imo, cut a deep channel, flatten out. But the hornady 110 gr or 90 gr low recoil trump the wadcutter.
Think of the federal 410 revolver rounds fired by a governor /judge.
Essentially 4 36 cal balls with 12-15 inches of penetration in ballistic gel / per trigger pull. You can't precisely aim them but within ten yards or so they group about the size of my hand from my governor.
Each ball round going it's own way may be more incapacitating then a single trigger pull of a larger caliber. YMMV.
Looking for street instances of premium 410 revolver cases doesn't turn up much, but I heard anecdotal cases of its use in Florida being successful.
I bring it up because I've read each buckshot projectile is roughly equivalent to a round of 32 acp fmj. Are 4 rounds COM from mildly loaded 32 acp likely to incapacitate?
Idunno, I'd say yes but it just depends. We all hear the cases of a criminal taking 6 rounds of premium 357 mag jhp or tons of 45 acp HP without affect. Too many variables.
I think each metal object traveling hundreds of feet per second going through your body stands a chance to stop you.
If I knew trouble was coming and only had a pistol, I think I'd opt for a major power caliber I shot the best with and loaded with the best most tested ammo I could get.
I think 4 32 acps per shot is also good to keep handy, quickly deployed, you still need practice and marksmanship but it can throw a lot of well aimed lead on target quickly and maybe give you some more options.
So.. Probably 2 hits are better than one.
We all work within our physical limitations.
If age or injury means you max out at 32 act, just practice quickly hitting COM, work up to hitting a 4 inch circle at ten yards as quickly as possible. The round served police in Europe for many years. It has the penetration necessary if placed somewhere vital.
If you can place two to the chest one to the head in a couple of seconds that IMO is formidable.
I like the 38 in a j frame and recommend hornady critical defense lite if recoil is be issue.
From even the airweight revolvers these rounds don't really kick. 90 grain jhp that will usually expand to .45-.5 or more and meet 12 inches of penetration in ballistics gel.
Definitely better than the 130 gr fmj, 158 gr lrn. The wadcutters punch above their weight class imo, cut a deep channel, flatten out. But the hornady 110 gr or 90 gr low recoil trump the wadcutter.
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