It seems there's No Love for 45 Auto in the Woods???

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DocRock said:
You start with the "hardball only " fallacy.
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Where? Your wrong, and your blustering shows that because even you say that I mentioned other bullets. Other bullets means not hardball. Furthermore I explicitly asked you to explain your position and said to not fall off into the 1911 worship pit but you still haven’t done it, even after blatant invitation to do so. After repeated attacks against me rather than posting a position to argue a point, your still just fussing. Im not going to argue with a troll anymore. Tell us what you like about the cartridge or quit posting attacks against somebody with a different opinion than you have.
 
With the right bullet, it will certainly get the job done. The problem is typically not the cartridge but the service autos that you usually find chambered for it. A well built and accurate 1911 that does under 2"@25yds would be my preference. Nose shape is limited and the meplat is typically going to be smaller than a comparable .45Colt bullet but it's enough to be effective.


WestKentucky said:
The one deer I saw killed with a .45 was hit at about 20 yards or so and ran a long way eventually drowning in its own blood from internal bleeding. There wasn’t much trouble finding him though with the hacking cough and massive blood trail from his mouth trailing down his neck. It was not pretty. Nobody was happy about the long drawn out process.
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So what's the problem? No handgun is going to work as quickly as a rifle. The lower the velocity, the longer the blood trail. But it works and it works with boring regularity. So if you need to knock deer down where they stand, use a .300Mag.
 
CraigC said:
With the right bullet, it will certainly get the job done. The problem is typically not the cartridge but the service autos that you usually find chambered for it. A well built and accurate 1911 that does under 2"@25yds would be my preference. Nose shape is limited and the meplat is typically going to be smaller than a comparable .45Colt bullet but it's enough to be effective.



So what's the problem? No handgun is going to work as quickly as a rifle. The lower the velocity, the longer the blood trail. But it works and it works with boring regularity. So if you need to knock deer down where they stand, use a .300Mag.
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Comparing handgun rounds, there are much better. There are also far worse. For game smaller than deer it is perfectly fine. But for deer or larger .45acp with nearly any configuration of bullet just doesn’t get the penetration and expansion needed for a clean and quick kill. If it’s not reliably clean and quick then it’s not a hunting round for that animal. Marginally acceptable rounds lead to long tracking jobs and lost animals.

As you said, the problem isnt the ammo or the cartridge normally, it’s the gun that is the limiting factor. Most 45s are built to take pressures intended for 1911s because 1911s are what was around as the 45acp developed. In a stronger action with better protection against the gun beating itself apart, hot 45s are capable and would be a better choice. Much like 9mm, many older designs can’t handle the hotter rounds, and older bullets were not adequate. Modern guns have had some evolutionary steps forward and now are capable of taking hotter rounds, and bullets are far better. Hopefully the same will happen with .45 over time, and it is happening but at a slower rate, probably because interest in the .45 has decreased as concealed carry has advanced and become more popular. The guns people find interesting now are smaller and thinner, can’t get very thin with a .45 just by its nature.
 
I should have specified WOODS CRITTER DEFENSE as armoredfarmer pointed out. That is the correct wordage for the discussion.

I am also only considering it for a head/neck shot placement up close and personal. And if you don't hit that location, hopefully your near miss will break front shoulders.

I'm not considering it as anything else. This is a draw and defend type discussion.

Which would be prefered or does it matter??
200gr @ 1100fps (540 ft/lb)
230 @ 950fps (461 ft/lb)

Now in thinking maybe I should have ordered 200's instead of 230's looking at the energy....

But lots of guys say heavy bullet......
And I read somewhere the military demanded the 230 for 45 vs the lighter original choice....I'm nit sure of any truth or reason to if it was the RIGHT choice.
 
98s1lightning said:
I should have specified WOODS CRITTER DEFENSE as armoredfarmer pointed out. That is the correct wordage for the discussion.

I am also only considering it for a head/neck shot placement up close and personal. And if you don't hit that location, hopefully your near miss will break front shoulders.

I'm not considering it as anything else. This is a draw and defend type discussion.

Which would be prefered or does it matter??
200gr @ 1100fps (540 ft/lb)
230 @ 950fps (461 ft/lb)

Now in thinking maybe I should have ordered 200's instead of 230's looking at the energy....

But lots of guys say heavy bullet......
And I read somewhere the military demanded the 230 for 45 vs the lighter original choice....I'm nit sure of any truth or reason to if it was the RIGHT choice.
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98s1lightning said:
I would like to have some of these but they are expensive for my budget

https://cuttingedgebullets.com/45-200gr-handgun-solid
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For your disclosed purposes, launching these babies at 1300 fps may be worth considering, cheap? No, but also a serious projectile.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1018301095?pid=224819
 
98s1lightning said:
It's a topic beaten to death but I think it's an interesting topic. I'm prepared to be roasted by all the haters.

Please share if you've got some real world 45acp experience with non expanding "flat" nose bullets for use as backup in the woods. Hog hunters may apply here.

I find it interesting that many consider a 45 colt suitable for the woods with off the shelf loads @ SAAMI specs like for use in a SAA but then say leave the 45 auto at home....

I have been messing with some Hornady HAP 230gr and have them moving at 950fps from my compact autoloader that is quick to deploy and holds 9 rounds.

I have a 357 that has 1.5x the energy but fact is, the 45 will more likely be on me since it can double from woods to go into town concealed. The 357 is more inconvenient to pack, I don't use this as a concealed.

Lastly an average shooter can probably get the 9 rounds on target from a 45 auto in the same time as 2 or 3 from a 357 or 44 mag.

I know a lot of answers will be negative or "get a 10mm"

I'm mostly curious, is there many old schoolers out there that don't buy into the new fads and internet talk and get good service from a 45acp as backup in the woods and proof to back it?

Let the comments fly! So many people stuck at home it should be a busy discussion......
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I wouldn't have anything against carrying a 1911 with my 200 swc load.
I've shot a hog with a 165 tcfp using a 40. The bullet punched through the top of the shoulder angling down tearing up the lungs. I had less than ideal results shooting them head on.
I figure a 200 swc would be 5 caliber larger with similar penetration.
I'm starting to see the large diameter low velocity side of life.
Kind of like aging. You can't just wade in creating mayhem. So you be a little slower and more precise.
 
DocRock said:
I often carry an RIA 1911 45ACP in the woods, 8 grs HS-6 and 230 grs Berry plated. Were I concerned with Brown bears, I'd be carrying a rifle.
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If I were concerned about brown bear, I'd find a slow hunting partner;)
I would feel under gunned with a rifle.
A 200 lb wild pig charging you is scary. A bear is way beyond scary.
 
98s1lightning said:
I'm up near Bangor. The only place I use 9mm in Maine is trips to town stores etc.
9mm would never intentionally come in the woods with me.
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I live in tha southern part. (York county). I would not be afraid in using a 9mm. It has killed a few deer for me and the black bears would rather run then fight. And if they did fight, a 9mm to the head would stop it.
 
I often carry a 45 acp at our place because I have developed shot rounds that function and it has enough oomph to kill. That said, I have killed more pigs with a .22 and 9mm.(trapped), not a doubt in my mind a 45 acp would also.
 
John Joseph said:
You've got to hunt for your spent brass with the 1911. Not so with a .45 Colt or magnum revolver.:thumbup:
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If I needed to use an autoloader in an emergency situation, lost brass would be the farthest thing from my mind. A spare mag would be quicker also. That said, I usually have something that has a circular "clip" and a bore beginning with a 4.
 
entropy said:
Some states have laws that prevent one from carrying a handgun with cartridges less than a certain length. MN's minimum used to be 1.285 case length, the exact length of the .357 Magnum. (I haven't lived there for 26 years-maybe it's changed.) Some states have minimum barrel length requirements. WI is one of them. 5.5" is the minimum barrel length. So one could have snubnosed .357 and be legal in MN, but not WI. (I used to carry my Python snub as a backup in MN.) Conversely, one could have a 6" barreled .25 ACP and be legal in WI, but not in MN. States having laws that impair carrying of .45 ACP's could have some effect on the amount of "Love for .45 ACP in the Woods''.
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Illinois has a maximum length for bottleneck shells. Also forbids semi-autos for deer. But our governor says we're progressive.
 
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