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Just tell me it will be OK!

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by arthurcw, Apr 30, 2006.

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  1. arthurcw

    arthurcw Member

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    Ok ladies and gents, I need some counceling. I’m rather new to the use of Handguns as defensive tools. I’ve handled long guns and hand guns for years but mostly as recreation. Never really gave them much REAL thought for defense. Was never Anti Gun, just ... well... young and stupid. So With marriage and real possessions and Katrina and Rita, I got real serious about having, learning, and using a defensive hand gun. I know. I’m a little late to the party but I’m here now... where’s the buffet?

    Enter my Kahr MK9. I fell in love with her. She was perfect. She fit my hand. The sight picture was a thing of beauty. But, *sniff* I... I. It’s so hard to say this. She failed me today at the range. Her extractor just flat broke. It looks like an old die cast toy that you finally bent enough that it has shattered.

    I used to love carrying her everywhere. She would be on my hip everywhere I went. But now *chokes back tears*, as I write my letters to customer service, I just look at her... sitting there. A useless paper weight. My confidence is shot. How can I ever trust her again?????

    In all seriousness. I was MAD when it happened. I had all this nifty ammo and I had to shoot my wife’s G19. But then, later, it began to hit me. HOLY $#|^! What if that had been a serious SHTF situation?

    Sooooo, my question is; How do you cope with this blow to your psyche and confidence? I know there are the obvious responses of ; Get it fixed, get it back to the range, shoot her ‘til you are confident. But is there anything else y’all do to get your lobes around trusting a gun again?

    BTW, I think I was just taught a valuable lesson about the need for a backup gun.
     
  2. Don't Tread On Me

    Don't Tread On Me Member

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    No offense, but Kahr is garbage. I've had one myself.

    Supposedly, their quality was top-notch early on, but in the last 5-6 years, they've been pretty bad.

    They are the kings of concealability. Perfect size, perfect controls. Kahr has the look of pure quality, but underneath, where it counts - it is NOT.

    I had a slide stop shatter on me. For a nearly $700 gun, the Kahr is a let down. They shouldn't be using so many MIM junk parts on load-bearing stress areas on a gun of that price. No excuse for that. As far as I'm concerned, I could care less what warranty you have, if the gun BREAKS when you need it, no warranty will save you. They absolutely should not be priced where they are. They are in the Sig range of pricing, but with no where near the quality.


    My confidence in Kahr was permanently shattered. I wil be looking forward to the (thinner than a Kahr) Kel-tec 9mm coming up. While it doesn't inspire confidence in the way it looks or feels, the one that I've had works flawlessly. And at least when you gamble with Keltec, you aren't going to get beat out of a few hundred dollars if it doesn't work out. The way Kahr's been going these days, I think the odds of getting a lemon with a Kahr are just as much as with a Keltec.


    OH, and arthurcw, I can't tell you it will just be ok. Whatever broke on the Kahr broke because it was a lame part. The replacement will be a lame part also. Too much MIM junk parts for my tastes.
     
  3. 30-06 lover

    30-06 lover Member

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    It will be okay.
     
  4. rangerruck

    rangerruck Member

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    a keltec p11 can help you find the love again.
     
  5. Hawkmoon

    Hawkmoon Member

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    Fix the Kahr, relegate it to back-up status, and buy a compact 1911 as your primary carry pistol. If you are not comfortable with carrying a single-action pistol cocked and locked, get a Para-Ordnance LDA series pistol.
     
  6. The-Fly

    The-Fly Member

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    thats why i carry a glock 26. Yes its a bit heavy and bulky compared to a keltec or a kahr, but no one will sanely argue the reliability of a properly maintained glock. Besides, 11+1 rnds of 9mm on tap is nice to have :evil:
     
  7. CajunBass

    CajunBass Member

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    I have yet to see anything made by the hand of man, that can't break. I've even seen a steel trailer ball break.

    Get your gun fixed, (that's why there are gunsmiths) and get on with life.
     
  8. Don't Tread On Me

    Don't Tread On Me Member

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    Cajun is correct, everything breaks. But the frequency of which something will break within a particular type or group is the issue.


    Steel breaks less than MIM. You can quantify the strength of one material over another, and that has a direct impact on the percentage of failures, or the life expectancy of the part. I've seen first hand how pot-metal AR parts bend, wear, and break with low round counts vs. properly made, hard steel, heat treated parts running on and on with no visible wear at all.


    MIM and other methods are not done as improvements, they are done as a cost savings measure. They offer no structural strength or wear improvement over an all steel part. They are cheaper to make. Unfortunately, the cost savings aren't passed on to you as is obvious with the price of the pistol. Steel costs more to buy, more to machine, and more to finish. I don't mind some parts made with cheaper materials, so long as they aren't critical parts - like a slide stop or whatever else. The few steel parts that are used are usually not treated at all or roughly machined.


    Pistols like the CZ cost less money, and have lots of steel. They can do it with real materials, and for less. That means the MIM monkeys (there are more than just Kahr) are just stealing your money.
     
  9. arthurcw

    arthurcw Member

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    thanks

    Thanks guys.

    Especially CajunBass; Yes I know it, but I needed to hear it.
    My wife is well meaning and sweet, but I needed to hear it from a pro.

    BTW: The MRS. said, "Sweetie, its a gun, not a wife... if IT p*sses you off, you can get another one." I do love her.
     
  10. xd9fan

    xd9fan Member

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    an XD will give you love no matter what you give her back. She will never fail you.
     
  11. GroovedG19

    GroovedG19 Member

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    You've said it yourself that you finished shooting with your wife's "G19".Doesn't that tell you something?:D
     
  12. arthurcw

    arthurcw Member

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    Got nothing against Glocks except for the fact I can't shoot them very well. They don't fit my had AT ALL. I find myself having to contort my paws, wrist, and forearms to get them to fire any where near the x ring. Great gun! But it’s really of no use to me.

    Sadly, I have freakishly small hands for a man (don't worry, everything else is up to code), so very few defensive caliber auto-loaders really give me a good fit. Some single stack (Compact) 1911's sorta work depending on the trigger. Very little else does... well, I did paw a Rohrbaugh at the last gun show, but I was not impressed with the gun, although it DID fit my hand. I could see it as a BUG ( a very pricey BUG). But still only a bug because of its sights.

    The P-11 also (Sorta) fits my hand, but only just. Maybe after they work the bugs out of the PF-9, I'll look at that one.

    Aside from that, I'd have to step to some of the J-frame wheelies to get a good solid grip. But I'm holding off on surrendering the idea of an auto-loader.

    I have considered getting a used G26 and letting someone do a grip resizing and see if it helps.

    I would LOVE a mainstream gun. I really would. But the Kahr was just the best fit. Period. I guess I’ll get her fixed and give her another chance. I did have 1100 rounds though it, so we’ll see.

    I will probably start looking for a BUG though. There are many .380’s on down that fit my hands quite well. And while I’m not ready to surrender my hopes of a true defensive caliber auto-loader yet, I’d have no issue with a pocket BUG in .380
     
  13. jimbo

    jimbo Member

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    Have you tried a Sig P239. They have pretty small grips for a 9mm. Sig P225 is almost as good. If you cant' hold either of those 2 guns, then you really do need to step down to a .280 or smaller. Maybe a Sig P230...
     
  14. CajunBass

    CajunBass Member

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    Boy have I got YOU fooled. :D

    I've just been around long enough to not let things like that get me in a frazzle. I bought a brand new truck one time that blew the engine the first day I had it. Stuff really does happen.

    I had a Kel-Tec, P-11 that I really liked. You said it sort of fit your hand. Did you have a pinky finger magazine extension on it? That helps a lot.

    I say I used to have a Kel-Tec. Nothing at all wrong with the gun after 1000 rounds. I just happened to see another gun I wanted more so I traded it.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2006
  15. Crosscut

    Crosscut Member

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    The upshot of this whole discussion is to have as many backup's as you can afford and care for. That way when one breaks, just slide another one in position until you get your favorite back. It's kind of like dating, you always need a back up just in case you wear out your welcome.
     
  16. Working Man

    Working Man Member

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    :scrutiny:

    Or perhaps a .380. I love my Walther PPK/S, very tight, real steel feel, a little
    small for my hands but I'm working on how I hold it.
     
  17. SHOOT1SAM

    SHOOT1SAM Member

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    I've paid $1000 or more, for 3 different guns now. The 1st one was my Kimber Ultra Elite, and the extractor broke on it with less than 300 rounds through it. Got the extractor replaced & it's been 100% ever since.

    I had an all-steel Para-Ordnance P-14 & after countless rounds through it, the slide stop broke and I watched the slide go slip slidin' away toward the target-I'd like to tell you that it was a 10-ring hit, but....

    As CajunBass stated, anything can break; even an XD-9.

    Sam
     
  18. Kurt_M

    Kurt_M Member

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    Your experience with Kahr is close to my own. Nothing broke on my P9, but after ~400 rounds the slide still failed to fully close every 20th round or so. Plus it never fit my hand quite right anyway, so now the local Gander Mountain has it sitting in their case. I'd suggest looking hard at the SIG P239 as well, my brother has one that is very reliable and accurate. Being a single stack 9mm it's very thin. Try to get your hands on a 1911 with a short trigger, thin grips and a flat mainspring housing as well. I've seen people with very small hands shoot them well with a little practice, the great thing about the 1911 is that it's very easy to change out parts to fit it to your hand. Good luck.
     
  19. Lou629

    Lou629 member

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    Just for the heck of it...

    You might want to consider the BHP in 9mm. It may be a bit big for your hands, but picking one up and holding it @ your local gunshop shouldn't cost you anything but a few minutes of your time. If it turns out that it fits, you haven't lost anything, and if you buy one for yourself you can probably rest easy for the rest of your days. I've got one that's going on 16 years old now, and never a problem. I paid about $450 for the thing back in 1990. If some of the posts i see here are correct about the $700 price tag for the Kahr, you paid damned near as much for that as the HP is currently going for these days, so the price shouldn't be an issue. Check out the BHP.
     
  20. Model520Fan

    Model520Fan Member

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    I once had a 2.5" Diamondback. VERY nice gun. Firing pin broke. I replaced it. It broke again. I read everything I could find, certainly including Kuhnhausen. I examined that gun six ways from Sunday. I couldn't find out why the firing pin broke. I bought a new hammer (kept my bobbed hammer and replaced the firing pin again) and installed it. I then sold that Diamondback and I have never been sorry I sold it. It was a nice thing to play with in front of targets, but I couldn't seriously call it a gun, as in defensive tool.

    BTW, that hammer is now in my Agent (drop-in), and I've never had a bit of trouble from it. I still have no idea why that DB broke two firing pins.

    I'm not a big fan of carrying just one gun, but when I do, it is certainly a revolver.
     
  21. scbair

    scbair Member

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    The mention of the BHP gives me an excuse to ask a question that's been on my mind for a few months (since I bought one!).

    I know a number of 1911 manufacturers are using MIM for a number of components (some applications are questionable, at best...).

    Question: Are the current/recent BHPs using MIM for extractors, slide locks, etc???

    Oh, back on topic: CajunBass is correct that even the finest machine can break. I feel a vintage S&W or Ruger revolver (I'm old enough to like pinned & recessed, and the old "Six" lineup) is about as close to 100% reliability as one can find. But, Murphy the Lawmaker cannot be discounted!

    My solution: Buy quality, test for reliability, maintain & inspect regularly ...
    and CARRY A BACKUP! :D

    Sort of like the old joke about the mathematician caught trying to carry a bomb onto an airplane. When taken into custody and questioned, he stated his "bomb" was actually nonfunctional, and he had packed it to increase the level of safety on his flight. The TSA questioned this, and the mathematician assured them he had researched the matter thoroughly. The chances of his boarding a plane with a bomb on board was calculated at 1 in one million; the chances of his boarding a plane with TWO bombs on board were only one in ten billion, so . . . :eek:
     
  22. jerkface11

    jerkface11 Member

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  23. erh

    erh Member

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    arthurcw - It will be OK; do yourself a favor though (IMHO) you need an all metal Kahr. I went through 3 plastic ones w/ "0" luck, but now have:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Grips; my own creations. This k9 Elite '03 that I won't ever give up.
    "Junk"; I strongly disagree..!

    Eric Howland
    Savannah, GA.
     
  24. mattk

    mattk Member

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    I dont think BHP's have a single MIM piece.
    I dont think Kahrs are junk. This stuff happens.
    I have seen more XD's with broken extractors than I have Kahrs.

    Yes it will be ok. If you want to use it as an excuse to buy another gun,
    then it won't be okay. Go buy a new gun RIGHT NOW!!!
     
  25. arthurcw

    arthurcw Member

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    erh: My Kahr is an all metal MK9 elite 2K. Heavy little buger, but nice. I have some friends with PM's but I like the metal ones.

    BTW: How did you make the grips?


    mattk:
    um... YOU ARE RIGHT! Man, It's only out of concern that I am going to the gun store. It's not greed. GIM'ME GIM'ME GIM'ME!
     
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