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Knife Sharpening

Discussion in 'Non-Firearm Weapons' started by bragood, Jul 30, 2008.

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  1. bragood

    bragood Member

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    Ok Im in need of a lot of help! I read the Sharpening FAQ and I still have a few questions. I can now develope a bur on one side of the blade! Now what? I really got lost with the billion links to here and there. Can someone help me please? I am trying to sharpen a Kabar.
     
  2. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    PM the tourist. he can fix you up right quick.


    and i cant resist: in soviet russia, KA-BAR sharpen you!!!
     
  3. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Member

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    Ok, you have a burr all along one side of the blade.

    Now turn the blade over and repeat.

    When you have a burr all along the other side, then remove the burr with alternating strokes, one on one side of the blade, one on the other. You don't need a lot of pressure at this point, you're just taking off the burr and it's really flimsy.

    Be sure to keep the angle the same as it was when you ground the burr up on both sides.

    Once the burr is gone--it should only take a few strokes--then you can either quit or go to a finer stone to polish the edge. If all you have is the coarse stone then you can improve the edge a bit by continuing for a few more alternating strokes with increasingly light pressure.

    Same deal applies with the finer grit stone. Alternating strokes, not much pressure, and try to stay close to the same angle that you used to grind the burr up. You can increase the angle a bit for this step, but just a very little. If you get too much angle on the blade then you get to start again. It's irritating but it's good practice. ;)
     
  4. CWL

    CWL Member

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    If you don't have a collection of stones or strops, use a large piece of cardboard to strop your knife. That should take the burr off.
     
  5. The Tourist

    The Tourist member

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    Okay. Finally. Something I know.

    No matter what you have heard, you do need a firm grip. but each action must be accomplished with a certain amount of "feel."

    I approach it in this manner. I like a working surface about as high as your standard kitchen counter. I like everything to be "square." The more work and preparation you do on the front end eliminates any problems you'll have later on.

    Your grip, as stated, should be firm, but not anything you could describe as a death-grip. Remember, we're after results here, not some childish bragging rights.

    With decided pressure, mostly with the thumb, bear down and work to the left. Reverse, and use equal pressure to the right. Apply repeated actions until your rhythm becomes smoother, and you feel a fluid sensation of the surfaces releasing.

    Now, this is critical! At this point you might have the desire to rush! Patience! Any wrong or hurried 'snap' can ruin the concentric motion you have established. Any mistake can shave off minute amounts of cork.

    And that's how you open a bottle of Patron.





    Oh, and working up a burr on a knife---well, what John says works about as good as anything...
     
  6. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    you must think im a barbarian. yank cork out with teeth, take deep swig.
     
  7. The Tourist

    The Tourist member

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    Well, KC, if we're going to introduce a newb to the wonderful world of tinkers, we must do first things first. And to me that's enjoying Patron, "obtaining" gas money for your Harley with a little three-card-Monte, and then towards the latter part of the day trying to figure out how to get money from a client with a wet rock.

    You can take that wet rock and bash the client over the head, but this negates a lot of repeat business. I suggest dragging the mark's, er, I mean, customer's fine cutlery on a rare, samurai quarried, hand selected abrasive with the clearest of filtered spring water.

    Oh, and to be a good tinker, you have to know how to tell a good story...
     
  8. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    HAHAHAHA!!!!! story telling is indeed the most important part.


    remember, im not a liar, im a yarn spinner.
     
  9. sm

    sm member

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    Humm...

    I prefer to do a cowboy lean up against the kitchen cabinet. I am ambidextrous, meaning I can use either foot to lean with.

    I also prefer to have the work come to me, instead of going to the work. Meaning I have the work close to body and it varies in height depending on what I am doing with the work, if I am listening to old Delta Blues, Rock-n-Roll, or Country.
    Of late, I find Alan Jackson's Good Time an excellent accompaniment to work.

    I don't drink, even when I did, I never had a Korbel Brut cork explode across the room, bounce off a light fixture and hit the fat lady in a dress that looked like two pigs fighting in a blanket.

    I can still open a bottle of Champagne and not pop the cork, or spew the champagne, and I have that oh so smooth way pouring champagne for a lady, with bubbles so-so and doing that wrist thang.

    Re: Burrs.

    Yeah, what John said .
     
  10. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Member

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    The wife just came back from Mexico. I'm in the process of developing an addiction for Olmeca anejo... That'll be a real problem in 6 or 7 months when I finish this bottle--yeah, I know, I'm hittin' it pretty hard!
     
  11. The Tourist

    The Tourist member

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    Let's see, late in the evening, and we have KC, sm, and John. Coupled to this group of suspects we have a thread that provides absolutely no useable information on knives except the caveat to, "Yeah, John..."

    Thankfully, this forum does not delve into watch repair or heart surgery, but I digress.
     
  12. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    we do that too. aint much help, but we try! at least we know how to open patron!

    and my first knife sharpening kit had a nifty vice and rod system. you put the back of the knife in the vice, and screwed a rod onto the stone you wanted. they came in rough, medium, and fine. take the rod and place thru numberd holes in vice. this way, you knew exactly what angle you used EVERY time. and it worked well.
     
  13. sm

    sm member

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    If I sew the button on the coat while they wait, they will expect my services to be no charge.
    Instead I take the coat, send them next door without a garment, to get a cup of coffee, in this weather of cold and blowing snow , this way I can charge 25 cents for my services.
    - Mentor


    In most of life's tending to repairs, one has to form a burr on one side, then form a burr on the other then finish out.
    The preparation and clean up, often takes more time than the actual repair itself.

    Life is interesting this way...

    *smile*
     
  14. The Tourist

    The Tourist member

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    For those of you with school age children at home, we'd like to remind you that members of THR have a unique sense of humor and in no way wish to imply that the high art of tinkership would ever succumb to debauchery in securing a client's business.

    Oh, and these random items were just laying around my kitchen...

    Patron.jpg
     
  15. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    ...whats the Razel for?...
     
  16. The Tourist

    The Tourist member

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    ...I'm a tinker...

    It's a knife related thread...
     
  17. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    i thought it was for the "customer" who didn't pay.....
     
  18. sm

    sm member

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    Some steels are more prone to have a burr that does not seem to want to be alleviated.
    Hence the term "wire edge". The edge feels sharp, it might even "hang" on a plastic pencil, toothpick, or wooden match stick.

    The first time the edge actually does "work" , meaning "cutting" that wire edge will roll and that edge is worthless, being so "dull".

    It depends on the steel, the heat treat, and how acute the edge is.
    By "acute" I am referring to how small a angle and most of us refer to the total angle.
    i.e 8* each side means 16* inclusive, which is considered "Acute" for most knives folks are familiar with .

    Stropping should remove the burr.
    Another suggestion is to raise ever so slightly the knife and raise the angle to get that "wire edge" to let go".


    Think about some metals, maybe a crushed soda can and bending it back and forth to break it in half.
    Some cans seem to "break" more clean, others feel more "clingy" and don't want to "let go".


    It just takes time, and experience doing this sharpening to get "the feel".
    Hence the reason I often suggest carbon , tool steel blades to new folks so they can get the principles down a bit easier.
    These correct basics transition to other steels.

    I also suggest folks stay with a new steel for a bit, to learn it.
    Meaning having a bunch of different steels can drive one nuts, and while they did fine on 1095 for instance, and then transitioned to 440C, just fine, I do not recommend hopping around to all sorts of other steels, in the beginning.

    The brain remembers what makes it feel good.
    One can lose confidence, self esteem and lose what feel they had, by trying too many different steel in the beginning.

    You will get there, just do not beat yourself up. If the knife is not getting sharp, a burr is not behaving, a wire edge keeps happening.
    Put the knife down and come back later.
    Sometimes "it ain't happening". Fine, take a break, eat, do something else and come back later when you are refreshed , or in a better mood, or have more time.

    I, we, none of us want folks to get frustrated, and we for sure do want someone messing up a nice knife.

    Hey, if you are whiz bang on 1095 and 440C, but SV30, or D2 drives you nuts, fine. Send the knife to The Tourist, or let someone locale to you do the knife.

    You will get there, and accept the fact, you will better on some steels, heat treats and geometry than others.
    It just takes time and doing is all.


    It is common for new folks to raise more burr, from tang to tip in learning, and learning a new steel.
    Fine.
    You are learning and instilling for you, that steel.
    As time goes by, you will be able to raise a more fine burr and accomplish the same results.

    Do what you need to instill the correct basic fundamentals for you.


    You own the knife, it does not own you. You can put it down and walk off if need.
     
  19. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    eh? ya lost me there.

    i got the georgia part.

    but WHAT is tumped?

    you mean, dumped?
     
  20. The Tourist

    The Tourist member

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    Shhh...! It's taken me many months of careful web spinning to make this ancient art seem like a respectable business.

    Did I ever tell you the story about the Byzantine elder riding his horse around the city's walls...
     
  21. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    i dont think sooo....

    and i found this for you, Tourist

    knife.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2008
  22. The Tourist

    The Tourist member

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    ...a city elder was out riding one of his prize stallions one morning, when he noticed a foreign appearing traveler seated by the entry gates. This wanderer did not seem to have a means of support, but he was not begging. The elder sought to depose him.

    "Sir, you there!" the elder commanded, "Who exactly are you!"

    The traveler grinned, and responded, "My liege, I am an explorer. I bring wonders and spices from foreign lands. I am a freeman, but of bond for a price. I am a minstel, a balladeer. I bring news and tidings from afar. I am a mercenary, but correctly a leader of men, and a follower of women..."

    "Say no more," snapped the elder, "you're a fricken knife sharpener..."
     
  23. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Member

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    Lansky method.

    I prefer sharpening by hand. I don't know exactly what angle I use, but I have a much greater sense of accomplishment when I'm done.

    I find that gunsmithing (such as my meager talents & tools allow) and knife-sharpening are as enjoyable as shooting and cutting. Sometimes moreso.

    Oh, as far as Patron opening, what The Tourist said.

    And as far as "tumped", what sm said. But I should add that a glass should never be tumped while it has Patron in it. Very poor form.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2008
  24. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    BAD choice of words.
     
  25. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Member

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    I defer to your more developed sense of decorum... :D
     
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