highorder
Member
That swayed my vote, especially for HD. (Bullet selection is a factor too)
Lever Action Rifle Poll
- Thread starter jwalker497
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That swayed my vote, especially for HD. (Bullet selection is a factor too)
Tallinar
Member
Not sure about either of these claims. .30-30 has a flatter trajectory beyond distances of 100 yds, but that doesn't constitute as "more accurate."
As for being more versatile, the .44 mag can be easily loaded anywhere from pipsqueek cowboy loads to wild 300 grain bullets nearing 2,000 fps (Buffalo Bore makes a +P 340 gr LRN at around 1,500 fps). I can't imagine asking for or needing anything more versatile.
CraigC
Sixgun Nut
I have to agree. I have two .44 leverguns, three .30-30's and several others in .32-20, .38-40, .45Colt, .405WCF and a couple rimfires. My most accurate is a .44 that piles the 270gr Gold Dot into 0.80"@100yds if I do my part. Only the .405 matches its accuracy.
As far as versatility, the .30-30 is a wonderful deer and hog rifle and could easily be pressed into elk duty if need be. The .44Mag can be loaded with cast bullets up to 355gr and be used to take anything that walks planet earth.
Maverick223
Member
I very much disagree with that, sure it can take most game, but large/dangerous game with such a cartridge would be suicide. I wouldn't even consider the .444Marlin (amongst others) for such a dangerous task.
Tallinar
Member
Replace "planet earth" with "the North American continent" and I think it fits well.
Maverick223
Member
That AND replace .44Mag. with .444Marlin and you might have something. Otherwise, I would hate to spook a big bear with that little .44 Magnum.
CraigC
Sixgun Nut
Too late folks, this ain't the `80's and y'all need to get up to date. Every head of game on the planet has been taken with the .44Mag. Maybe I have the link to Ross Seyfried's Cape buffalo hunt, done with a five-shot Abilene .45Colt. The .475 is a better choice. This is not a stunt but something done every year by folks who know what they're about but I reckon it's asking a little too much for a bunch of rifle shooters to know anything about handgun hunting.
http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/article.cfm?tocid=321&magid=24
http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/article.cfm?tocid=321&magid=24
Gryffydd
Member
Apparently some people are missing that bolded part.
For what YOU have stated as the uses for this rifle, I'd go with the .44 Magnum. If you were planning on hunting, I *might* recommend the .30-30, though within 100 yards you'd be well suited with either one.
If you're willing to look beyond the two choices you posted, I'd second this one. The .357 out of a rifle is an amazing round. MUCH cheaper to shoot (or reload for) as well.
Harley Rider 55
Member
.45 Colt
Gryffydd
Member
Yeah...and Jack O'Connor thought the .270 was good for Grizzlies. And the .30-30 has been used to kill lots of polar bears. For that matter, big bears have been killed with .22LRs. None of that makes doing so a good idea.
go with the .44 if your not hunting every year, find a used rossi for $350 and have fun. The 94 30-30 was my first rifle, took it everywhere, I've even fished with it! shooting carp from a high bank above the Blue Earth river, Asian fellow was trying to club em' I showed him an easier method. I now own .357 .44 and a nice older 30-30. The 92 is better in the smaller cartridges, so think rossi for this choice.
I truly love my 1894SS .44mag. Great range plinker, I load .44mag brass with .44 special loads for this. Good carrying rifle-light and handy. Great deer rifle in the thick woods I hunt in-<100yd shots.
Smooth as silk, accurate to 100 or so.
For HD, it's not the one I use. I have a S&W 5906 in the nightstand, Mossberg Mariner in the corner by it, and Colt Combat Commander that follows me around during the day.
If the zombies start wandering the streets my Mini 30 is ready to dispatch them.
When I lived in NY, my lib neighbor asked me if I had my guns loaded-I asked him if he kept batteries in his flashlights.
Smooth as silk, accurate to 100 or so.
For HD, it's not the one I use. I have a S&W 5906 in the nightstand, Mossberg Mariner in the corner by it, and Colt Combat Commander that follows me around during the day.
If the zombies start wandering the streets my Mini 30 is ready to dispatch them.
When I lived in NY, my lib neighbor asked me if I had my guns loaded-I asked him if he kept batteries in his flashlights.
Definitely not a good idea against the "biggest animals on earth", however I heard that a 44 Mag rifle with with full house 300+ gr. is not exactly pipsqueak against a big bear....on top of that consider the platform, quick handling and fast follow up shots.
Cosmoline
Member
I would have said .44 in light of that a few years back, but with Trail Boss and cast bullets you can reload the .30-30 for the same price if not cheaper. If you're using full power rifle powder the .30-30 will get more expensive over the long haul.
Neither one is going to have much cheap factory ammo these days.
jwalker497 said:
You don't know much about these two CARTRIDGES and yet you've narrowed your choice to these two? Are you open to other suggestions or recommendations? It would appear that you don't reload and don't own a .44 Magnum revolver and you have no intention of using the rifle for hunting. So, for fun and home defense the obvious choice would be a .357 Magnum since the .44 Magnum would offer zero benefits in 99.9% of HD situations and it's more expensive to feed ... about 50% more expensive if you compare typical .38 Spl/.357 Mag to .44 Spl/.44 Mag ammunition. The .30-30 Win is about 100% more expensive to shoot compared to the .357 Magnum!! Obviously these numbers are general but they're fairly typical of current ammunition prices. I don't know why you'd even consider the .30-30 Win if you aren't a hunter. And if you are a hunter, there are many better choices than the .30-30 Win. So how much shooting do you plan on doing and how important is ammunition cost to you?
Personally, I think your poll should have included the .357 Magnum, .44 Magnum and .45 Colt and possibly .454 Casull ... and I'd still vote for the .357 Magnum (in your case). In your situation, the .44 Magnum would offer no measurable benefit over the .357 Magnum. They're both fun to shoot, both have more than enough performance for HD (.38 and .44 Specials would be more than enough from 18" to 20" barrels), both are available from Marlin in stainless steel or blued, both can be upgraded, both are excellent rifles but the .357 Magnum will cost you less in terms of ammunition. In a perfect world, we'd all have both ... that's my plan anyway.
As for lever action rifles, I have three Marlin '95's chambered in .45-70 Govt (XLR, Guide Gun and SBL) and two '94's chambered in .45 Colt and .357 Magnum (CB and CSS). I'll be adding a .44 Magnum shortly. Since I reload for every chambering that I shoot (except 7.62x39 and .22LR) availability and cost of ammunition is not a factor for me ... not yet anyway. In addition, I have revolvers chambered in .357 Magnum, .44 Magnum, .45 Colt, .45 ACP and .454 Casull so I like to match rifles with revolvers.
Good luck with your decision (and I voted for .44 Magnum since you don't have a .357 Magnum option).
CraigC
Sixgun Nut
This is not 50yr old speculation like Daniel Wesson wanting to go after bear with his trusty .357. We are not blazing new trails, this is all been well-proven and enough folks have done it that it should no longer be considered a stunt. The fact that you are ignorant of it does not make it untrue. Simple fact.
Nope, I know I don't have the nerve, not with a handgun. Though I understand that just because I don't have the nerve, doesn't mean t hat holds true for everybody. As many as I own and as much shooting as I do with them, I'm MUCH better with a rifle.
I reckon Seyfried just imagined that those big slugs penetrated several feet of Cape buffalo.
I didn't recommend anyone do it, didn't imply that just any knucklehead with a .44 could do it, didn't even imply that I could do it. Simply that the cartridge is capable if properly loaded. If you don't believe me, you're ignorant of the facts. What exactly do you think those 330's, 340's and 355's are for???
No where in my response did I claim that the .30-30 is more accurate due in part to it's trajectory. You may have an exceptionally accurate .44 magnum carbine however overall the .30-30 is more accurate. If one would like to refute this fact follow the postal match being conducted over at Marlin Owners. Unless one sends their 44mag rifle to someone such as Dave Clay to have their factory barel (1/38" twist) replaced with a quicker twist barrel 355gr bullets are out of the question. The action will also have to be modified so as to allow for the greater OAL of the cartridge due to the heavier bullet.
Also it would do you well to fully read what BB has to say about their .44 mag 340gr +P+ loading. This is straight from their web site. If you read below it clearly states modified Marlin rifles. With the factory barrel about the heaviest you can go is 320gr and of course it will be rifle dependent how accurate it is. With the economy the way it is right now I couldn't afford to spend more money after having spent the money for the purchase of the rifle just to shoot expensive botuiqe ammo. For most situations a 240gr - 270gr bullet is more than enough.
The OP also mentioned using this rifles for HD. A .30-30 using the afore mentioned Rem Managed Recoil ammo will have less recoil than any over the counter .44mag ammunition. It will not penetrate nearly as much as the .44 magnum either if there is a miss.
The OP did not mention taking game all over the planet nor did I. However I did mention that he would be better off with a .30-30 were he to decide to take up hunting in the future. And the reason for that statement is the improved trajectory and better performance past 100yd the .30-30 offers. Yes there are better cartridges to hunt with than the .30-30. However when it comes to hunting areas that have dense forests and broken terrain where shots can be <200 the .30-30 performs quite well. The doe I shot at 150yds with my .30-30 2 years ago was just as dead as the one I hit a few years earlier at 130yd with my 7mm magnum. The .30-30 is also capable of taking game larger than deer such as elk and moose. Again if anyone wishes to refute this fact then scroll through the scrapbook pages on the Hornady web site.
As far as mild loads go there is cowboy ammo that is made for the .30-30 too. IIRC the stated vel is around 1200fps for Ultra max ammunition.
http://www.hornady.com/team-hornady/scrapbook/maine-moose-amos-w
http://www.hornady.com/team-hornady/scrapbook/first-elk-hunt-michael-w
http://www.hornady.com/team-hornady/scrapbook/leverevolution-elk-larry
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Gryffydd
Member
Yup, and properly loaded, a .22LR can kill a Grizzly (and has).
Badlander
Member
If you live with big bears get the 45-70 want to hunt deer get the 30-30 want to plink get A pistol caliber or A .22.
oldfool
Member
play nice now, boys
OP didn't ask about hunting Grizz or bull elephant
of the two choices, I vote 44mag
(but cannot resist again mentioning 357 as a choice that might ought be included)
only reason I own only 5 lever actions is... skinny wallet
OP didn't ask about hunting Grizz or bull elephant
of the two choices, I vote 44mag
(but cannot resist again mentioning 357 as a choice that might ought be included)
only reason I own only 5 lever actions is... skinny wallet
Badlander
Member
What exactly is A properly loaded .22 LR?
Enough.
If someone sees something differently than you, state the facts, give references if available, and let it go.
"If you don't believe me, you're ignorant" is just plain foolish. "These are the facts, as given by experts X, Y, and Z" is something else.
If someone sees something differently than you, state the facts, give references if available, and let it go.
"If you don't believe me, you're ignorant" is just plain foolish. "These are the facts, as given by experts X, Y, and Z" is something else.
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