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Lions and Elephants back in Kansas?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by carebear, Aug 17, 2005.

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  1. carebear

    carebear Member

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    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8983461/

    I'd back this in a minute as long as it didn't involve active government coercion.

    What a rush to roam in an area where you aren't automatically the top of the food chain.

    I love the last paragraph.

    Dang skippy! Finally a real, honest to G-d REASON to pack heavy hardware on a "simple camping trip".
     
  2. Preacherman

    Preacherman Member

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    I'd rather put the lions in a few crime-ridden inner-city areas I know... :evil:
     
  3. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

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    Exactly, Preacherman. If only we could "Jurassic Park" the short-face bear or the saber-tooth tiger or the cave bear and giant sloth. I would love to unleash them on D.C. or New York City! :D

    We could save the planet AND renew our freedoms!
     
  4. carebear

    carebear Member

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    Lions wouldn't stand a chance in the inner city.. You think a sub-culture that kills people to steal their shoes and jackets is gonna let something with a big ol' mane walk around unmolested?

    The poor thing would be up on blocks and naked in seconds. :evil:
     
  5. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

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    Meow?

    I think this just shows how the East Coast "environmental" movement thinks of us. The "Great Plains" is just one vast desert of wilderness where one can dump a lion and not worry about human life or another's property.

    Notice how they always make proposals for OTHERS but not themselves or where they live. :rolleyes:
     
  6. Vern Humphrey

    Vern Humphrey Member

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    Right -- that's why there are beaver dams on every stream in the area where I hunt elk. ;)

    As for
    I hope they realize that my precautions ride in a leather holster!

    On second thought, let's create the first of these environmental parks in California. Let the legislature explain to people that the lions won't eat you if you take "precautions" -- but don't carry one of those nasty 'ol guns. :p
     
  7. carebear

    carebear Member

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    In their defense, they did say "private property" and "abandoned farmland" more than a few times.

    And, really, cougars, wolves, bears, bison, horses, antelope and deerses roam freely even now, if in varying numbers. As long as populations are managed to not exceed the grazing (especially the elephants) as the sport hunters in Africa used to be used and you are allowed, as now, to defend life and property from the predators, where's the downside?

    (he says from thousands of miles away :D )

    (where he does however live amidst megafauna and predators in his own backyard and in-city recreation sights)
     
  8. Vern Humphrey

    Vern Humphrey Member

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    There's a fellow near Quitman, Arkansas, (not far from where I live) who has a big cat sanctuary. He keeps them caged, though.

    A year or so ago, someone came by trying to unload five full-grown African lions. The man didn't have any empty cages, so he turned them away. A few miles down the road, they apparently opened the tailgate and let them out, then drove off. :what:

    Until the Sheriff's posse located and shot them all, there weren't many toddlers playing outside around Quitman, I can tell you.
     
  9. 00-Guy

    00-Guy Member

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    El Tejon writes:

    Exactly, Preacherman. If only we could "Jurassic Park" the short-face bear or the saber-tooth tiger or the cave bear and giant sloth. I would love to unleash them on D.C. or New York City!

    Alas ET, the Giant Sloth is unleased in DC, ....... the US Congress. <insert rimshot here>

    paul....
    In a very red county stuck in a blue state!
     
  10. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

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    Frankly, I think it would make far more sense to raze about half of New Jersey and put the critters there.

    You'll note I've abstained from relieving myself of any snide remarks about the members of Homo sapiens who reside in New Jersey.
     
  11. Vern Humphrey

    Vern Humphrey Member

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    Ya wanna get charged with cruelty to animals? :D
     
  12. Elkslayer

    Elkslayer Member

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    "And, really, cougars, wolves, bears, bison, horses, antelope and deerses roam freely even now, if in varying numbers."

    Just to set the record straight, horses are not indigenous to the USA.

    Horses are feral animals just like wild feral pigs, cats or dogs. Wild horses enjoy strong support and liking by most Americans, they do compete with and displace native game species.
     
  13. Werewolf

    Werewolf Member

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    Kansas winters can be really harsh. Lions and Elephants both roam tropical environs be they forested or grasslands. Could either of the aforementioned creatures survive a Kansas winter without the aid of man?
     
  14. carebear

    carebear Member

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    Weren't there wild horses (or horse contemporaries) here prior to the Pliestocene extinctions?

    That's the species range they are talking about reintroducing.

    At any rate, my point was reintroducing (used to be) native megafauna (or their closest analogues) is merely a change in kind, not in practice.
     
  15. Vern Humphrey

    Vern Humphrey Member

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    Hannibal crossed the Alps with African elephants, and Claudius used African elephants in his conquest of Britain. Lions were once found all over Europe when it was colder than it is today.

    But I'd put 'em in California, first -- lots of good liberals for the lions to eat and the elephants to stomp. :p
     
  16. carebear

    carebear Member

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    Acclimation Vern? :evil:

    Also, if they lose a little fear of man by devouring quivering unarmed libs then it'll make it more exciting later on.
     
  17. Vern Humphrey

    Vern Humphrey Member

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    Two very good reasons for starting them in California. Once they're acclimated, we can stock more reserves in Massachusetts, New Jersey, and so on. :p
     
  18. Colt46

    Colt46 Member

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    I lay awake at night dreaming of this

    Imagine being forced to protect myself from rampaging elephants with an Atlatl! That would be quite the kick in the pants.
     
  19. carebear

    carebear Member

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    What are those spiney plants Lawdog talks about? Could you make a boma out of them?
     
  20. Andrew Rothman

    Andrew Rothman Member

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    They want to reintroduce African lions and African or Indian elephants to North America?

    That's about as logical as gun "buybacks." You can't buy back what you never owned, and you can't reintroduce something that was never there.

    This is the closest they come:
    First, I am dubious of the theory-stated-as-fact under the guise of "Studies have shown...."

    Anyway, 10,000 years ago, humans were, ecologically speaking, just another kind of animal. I mean, it's not like it was pollution or machine guns or overdevelopment of natural habitat that did in the poor beasties.

    If they ate up or just killed all of those species, well, that's called "succession," and it's...well...natural.

    The story does not make it clear at all whether these "parks" would be open or enclosed.
     
  21. newfalguy101

    newfalguy101 Member

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    Sounds an awful lot like junk science to me.

    The elk eating the willows was responsible for the drastic decline in beaver numbers????

    And I dont suppose the rabid over trapping of said animal had anything to do with them going way?? I also didnt realize that willow trees DEPENDED on beaver dams to survive :rolleyes:

    And who, do you suppose, is going to PAY to feed and care for these critters??

    all in all a bad day looking to happen :rolleyes:

    just my opinion of course
     
  22. carebear

    carebear Member

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    Matt,

    We're reintroducing wolves from the West to replace the massacred red wolves right? Coyotes are growing larger in New England and beginning to act in packs to fill the niche left by those same wolves. Mountain bison being transplanted to the plains to replace the plains herds?

    This kind of species transfer is hardly uncommon. (elephants/mammoths are another story of course)

    The differences in genetically between African lions and the lions of Europe and Southwest Asia were mostly aesthetic. Camels are camels. So it is hardly a huge jump to figure America's megafauna would today more or less resemble Africa's if they had survived. And I think the point is a massive recreation of an idea, a world of big cool animals to perhaps be killed by. i'm not going to quibble with an extra toe. ;)

    If they can get enough contiguous open land together and can figure out how to manage populations there's no reason to do much fencing. Natural (and hunter enforced) aversion should keep the animals away from people and their crops.

    I don't know. It's a dream big, cool idea kind of project that I could get behind. Leave it to the egg heads to make it work. I just want to be Capstick without the malaria.
     
  23. carebear

    carebear Member

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    newfalguy,

    Who "cares and feeds" for the animals on the Serengeti.

    They aren't talking about a zoo. Animals will eat what they eat in the wild, get sick and die just like mother nature intended.

    Think BIGGER.
     
  24. newfalguy101

    newfalguy101 Member

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    Carebear

    The AFRICAN GOV pays to care for those critters with monies they get from hunters.

    Also, last I heard there wasnt snow covering the ground in Africa for a part of the year, so what do they eat then?? Or do you suggest that they just "tuff it out" till spring??

    I get the immpression that they are NOT talking about huntable numbers in the article.

    I also get the distinct immpression from the article that the people looking to do this are at the LEAST against hunting if not out-right anti-hunting.


    And if you think that there is anything that will keep Sambo out of a wheat field or a cornfield, methinks you are dead wrong.
     
  25. Andrew Rothman

    Andrew Rothman Member

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    :rolleyes: Sure, that's workin' real well for the mountain lions.
     
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