Loaded Magazines?

[Buzznrose]

I’m a Larry Vickers fan. Good info here:

https://www.vickerstactical.com/magazines.html

 

[jmr40]

I've seen enough evidence to make me download by 1 or 2 rounds with MOST magazines. But otherwise most of the magazines I own stay loaded all the time. I fill em back up after shooting them and I've never had a problem.

I think it is less critical with the old school magazines like 7 round 1911 magazines where you can easily load the last round. But some newer magazines where you really have to work to get the last couple of rounds in may overstress the springs. On those I store spares down by 1 or 2. Basically I stop on the last round that goes in easily.

 

[buddyd157]

I've seen enough evidence to make me download by 1 or 2 rounds with MOST magazines. But otherwise most of the magazines I own stay loaded all the time. I fill em back up after shooting them and I've never had a problem.

I think it is less critical with the old school magazines like 7 round 1911 magazines where you can easily load the last round. But some newer magazines where you really have to work to get the last couple of rounds in may overstress the springs. On those I store spares down by 1 or 2. Basically I stop on the last round that goes in easily.

i know, at the range just this morning, i have a Maglula (universal fit) and it does get difficult getting in the last 2 cartridges for the 16 total.

 

[peeplwtchr]

ok, i did use the search feature, i could not find what i was looking for. (maybe i worded it wrong?)

in any event, with my glock i got 3 mags, with the cz, i will be getting 2, and i already bought an extra one.

here is the question:
if i loaded up one mag for each gun, and kept them in my closet, is there any sort of time limit they can be kept loaded, before the spring(s) either weaken or give out?

reason for keeping these in the closet, is for added safety, but still quick to reach, and pop into either gun. if any of this makes any sense.

thanks to all in advance

buddyd

I keep all my pistol mags loaded all the time, as the guns wont shoot without them. If you shoot often (And you should if possible), you theoretically could notice failing mag springs, and can replace them inexpensively. I have not experinced this though. All my mags are loaded at least one round less than capacity. This isn't to save springs, it's to ensure that the mags function like they should, disregarding the Marketing department's goals.

 

[bluejeans]

I’m just agreeing with what’s already been said.. the only issues I’ve had with leaving magazines loaded is the shellcase getting corroded to the point it wouldn’t chamber... never had an issue with the springs.

I do download my mags by a round or two mostly for the sake of tactical reloads (a full mag can be a real bear to seat against a closed bolt/slide)

 

[Deus Machina]

This is why I like good AK magazines.
They're usually designed with plenty of tolerance to prevent overstressing the spring, more often than not have a spring overbuilt anyway, and you really can't have problems seating a full mag under a closed bolt when the while magazine is a lever.
None of this says that they won't wear out, just that they're designed--and usually built--to forgive anything but serious use.

 

[Ignition Override]

No idea.

Just in case ISIS-wannabes ever decide to attack our area by Memphis (or an extremely unlikely WROL were to happen) my eight loaded AK mags — Hungarian 20-rd. Tankers — are loaded with 17 or 18 rds. each.

Sig former police/federal agent guns:
The magazines which came with both of my P6 were probably kept fully loaded by both the German “FBI” (Bundes..’Kriminal..) and regular police who carried my guns...

...and they work fine.

 

[DoubleMag]

''my "intention" is to not load them up full, like maybe 12 cartridges rather than the full 16.''

Whatever your round total you finally land on, I would suggest NEVER loading past that .Last thing you need in a self defense/SD situation is not remembering how many you started with. Enough things will blurr as it is.

''and the mag(s) i choose, most likely now both the CZ and Glock, will of course have hollow points. as i WAS told by my instructor, it's highly recommended over round points.''

Well I was told...
In relation to mag failure, FMJ feeds just fine, truncated tips feed just fine...ALL modern factory ammo SHOULD feed just fine. You will have to shoot n' find out. Some HPs may not expand at all or minimal (big oops for SD).
But between all modern factory cartridges, my $$ would be on the least failure to feed on...FMJ with round tip config for the win.
In relation to self defense any will work although a slight edge to HP.

OK and back to mag failure due to #s of stored rounds etc. The primary failure of a semi-auto pistol to go 'bang' is a 1st guess...MAG FAILURE. Which could be as simple as not seated fully before the firing session.

I would added suggest to # mark your magazines, 1, 2, 3 or A, B, C.

And overall 2 final points, your internal pistol springs i.e. recoil spring will fail b4 the mag springs IMHO and point 2, as others have shouted, WELCOME!!

 

[Obturation]

Ugh... The spring debate for the 10 millionth time.
MY springs get considerably weaker from extended compression, zero question about it. For some reason this effect doesn't happen to some people or they don't notice. I have absolute proof this is the case, I'd be interested if someone has proof they don't weaken under extended compression. I guess if there's still tension there it's still good as new to some folks. This horse is beat to death...

 

[FFGColorado]

My rules..all magazines loaded all the time..even in the safe. G26-5, G17-4, G42-5..AND my other 'rule' shoot often, to 'exercise' those things..
Why? Cuz it's fun to shoot and you find out of a magazine DOES have a problem.

 

[Jim Rau]

My rules..all magazines loaded all the time..even in the safe. G26-5, G17-4, G42-5..AND my other 'rule' shoot often, to 'exercise' those things..
Why? Cuz it's fun to shoot and you find out of a magazine DOES have a problem.

And in CO that is just 10 rounds, right!!!

 

[Deus Machina]

I would added suggest to # mark your magazines, 1, 2, 3 or A, B, C.

This is also a good suggestion.
If I have any magazines that aren't obviously different, they get numbered on the floorplate, body, and inside the follower.
First, if they manage to get dirty, this keeps everything together. Don't usually want to mix up pieces from different manufacturers or designs. Second, if and when I have any problems, I make a note of which magazine I was using. If it happens only or mostly with that magazine, I know which one to inspect.

 

[danez71]

The question of "fatigue limits" and "creep strain" (which apparently is only a factor at 4X the melting point (Degrees Kelvin) of a given metal) is discussed in detail here

It's .4x not 4x. It's A factor but unarguably it's not the only factor.




I've posted data on TFL and THR from spring manufacturers and I believe a 3rd party test house. (Also, one of the mods at TFL did a controled test over i think 2 year period)

That data showed spring degradation at ambient temperature during stagnant compression over time.


At ambient type human liveable temps, how far a spring is compressed into that particular alloys elastic limit for its given diameter, and then for how long and how many times are the major factors.


This is where the myth is mistaken.

If, for hypothetical example, a spring is compressed to 70% of its elastic limit 1 time over 150 years (as an exaggerated 1911 example) it may be fine. Compress the same spring 95% 100 times and it might beyond its useful life in a month.


The fact that a particular spring was left loaded for 150 years and another tangently related spring was used a lot and lasted 1 yr proves only that people are gullible to spoon fed 1/2 truths.


In KISS terms,,,,
The idea that its only cycles that wears springs is proven a myth just by the fact that it if it were true, we would be seeing recoil springs wear out at least 10 x faster than mag springs assuming only 1, 10 round mag per gun.

 

[Trunk Monkey]

The idea that its only cycles that wears springs is proven a myth just by the fact that it if it were true, we would be seeing recoil springs wear out at least 10 x faster than mag springs assuming only 1, 10 round mag per gun.

I am not arguing I'm asking a question here.

Recoil springs and magazine springs are under different loads and do different jobs so wouldn't that be a hard comparison to make or is that just a general example.

Also this guy appears to be planning to leave the magazines loaded over time instead of unloading and loading them

 

[Trunk Monkey]

And in CO that is just 10 rounds, right!!!

Wrong

 

[Obturation]

I did my own test of sorts, Mossberg 500 cruiser- loaded and set aside for 10 years. It was taken out a time or two but maybe 50 shells fired in the 10 years, just sat in the corner waiting for a bump in the night. Went to unload and the mag spring was so weak it couldn't poop out the last shells, had to use gravity, seems clear cut. Another clear example, I use 9 rd mags for my g30. Hercules would be hard pressed to get the 9th round in when new , put 8 in and set it aside, couple months later #9 goes right in. No loading and unloading, no firing or cycling at all. Seems to be common sense that this is how it works but some goofy guys need to try to convince everyone otherwise. Just because a spring is weaker doesn't mean it's too weak to work, may work fine even at half the power it once had. That I don't know, I'm not an engineer.

 

[Pat Riot]

I have darn seen fisticuffs over this subject and witnessed many online dust ups. Some people get a little touchy over their “spring theories”.

With today’s spring technology, springs from a quality source, will last a long time. All springs weaken over time when worked. By “worked” I mean compressed and relaxed over time.

Without verbally kicking anyone in the shins over their spring practices or their theories I will just say; Here is what I do:

I have at least 12 magazines for each magazine fed gun, be it a handgun or long gun. If the gun is to be for carry or home protection I select 6 magazines and mark 3 as “one set” and 3 as the “other set”. (Example - for Glock mags I mark the bottom plate Mag insert button with a silver or gold Sharpie)
Magazines marked silver get loaded together and stay together with the gun for a month or so and then I unload them and load the gold mags for a month or so. I rotate them.

The 6 or more mags that are not in rotation are used at the range. I am a firm believer in having lots of mags so 12 is my minimum per gun.

If I find a spring weakening on a defense gun I replace the set of all 3 mags with new and the original 3 mags become range mags.

Yes, it sounds like overkill, perhaps, but that is my process.

I am happy to say that I have never worn out a Glock magazine spring but I have worn out the magazine body and had the lips expand. In that instance I mark the entire magazine as “bad” with a Sharpie and it becomes a target at a future outdoor range session.

You see, Murphy is a son-of-a-b....
If I have an unmarked faulty magazine it WILL somehow get mixed in with my good mags and cause me issues. I remove that possibility. I destroy and replace. I don’t keep crap mags for drills or practice. If I encounter someone that does and they have a need for the same mags as my crap ones I will give them the bad mags with the promise they won’t intermingle their mags with mine if we shoot together.

This brings up another point. If you shoot with other folks keeping your mags separate from other’s mags is important. I used to have a couple shooting buddies that weren’t as particular with magazine care as I am. A couple of times I ended up with a couple of their crappy mags.

A magazine can be the weakest link in the operation of a mag fed gun. If you buy quality mags you should get quality springs in those mags and they should be reliable.
Budget mags = budget springs = future problems. Mis dos centavos.

Welcome to the High Road.

 

[buddyd157]

''my "intention" is to not load them up full, like maybe 12 cartridges rather than the full 16.''

Whatever your round total you finally land on, I would suggest NEVER loading past that .Last thing you need in a self defense/SD situation is not remembering how many you started with. Enough things will blurr as it is.

''and the mag(s) i choose, most likely now both the CZ and Glock, will of course have hollow points. as i WAS told by my instructor, it's highly recommended over round points.''

Well I was told...
In relation to mag failure, FMJ feeds just fine, truncated tips feed just fine...ALL modern factory ammo SHOULD feed just fine. You will have to shoot n' find out. Some HPs may not expand at all or minimal (big oops for SD).
But between all modern factory cartridges, my $$ would be on the least failure to feed on...FMJ with round tip config for the win.
In relation to self defense any will work although a slight edge to HP.

OK and back to mag failure due to #s of stored rounds etc. The primary failure of a semi-auto pistol to go 'bang' is a 1st guess...MAG FAILURE. Which could be as simple as not seated fully before the firing session.

I would added suggest to # mark your magazines, 1, 2, 3 or A, B, C.

And overall 2 final points, your internal pistol springs i.e. recoil spring will fail b4 the mag springs IMHO and point 2, as others have shouted, WELCOME!!

the thing is this, as the instructor had said, using a hollow point will certainly take down the intruder, and (if i recall what he said) the bullet will slow down and not go say into the next room, wall, etc, where someone (like family) can be hunkered down.

as in the situation of a rounded bullet, it'll go thru the intruder, walls, doors, etc, causing lots more damage?

i hope i explained it as i remembered it.

 

[Riomouse911]

I have darn seen fisticuffs over this subject and witnessed many online dust ups. Some people get a little touchy over their “spring theories”.

With today’s spring technology, springs from a quality source, will last a long time. All springs weaken over time when worked. By “worked” I mean compressed and relaxed over time.

Without verbally kicking anyone in the shins over their spring practices or their theories I will just say; Here is what I do:

I have at least 12 magazines for each magazine fed gun, be it a handgun or long gun. If the gun is to be for carry or home protection I select 6 magazines and mark 3 as “one set” and 3 as the “other set”. (Example - for Glock mags I mark the bottom plate Mag insert button with a silver or gold Sharpie)
Magazines marked silver get loaded together and stay together with the gun for a month or so and then I unload them and load the gold mags for a month or so. I rotate them.

The 6 or more mags that are not in rotation are used at the range. I am a firm believer in having lots of mags so 12 is my minimum per gun.

If I find a spring weakening on a defense gun I replace the set of all 3 mags with new and the original 3 mags become range mags.

Yes, it sounds like overkill, perhaps, but that is my process.

I am happy to say that I have never worn out a Glock magazine spring but I have worn out the magazine body and had the lips expand. In that instance I mark the entire magazine as “bad” with a Sharpie and it becomes a target at a future outdoor range session.

You see, Murphy is a son-of-a-b....
If I have an unmarked faulty magazine it WILL somehow get mixed in with my good mags and cause me issues. I remove that possibility. I destroy and replace. I don’t keep crap mags for drills or practice. If I encounter someone that does and they have a need for the same mags as my crap ones I will give them the bad mags with the promise they won’t intermingle their mags with mine if we shoot together.

This brings up another point. If you shoot with other folks keeping your mags separate from other’s mags is important. I used to have a couple shooting buddies that weren’t as particular with magazine care as I am. A couple of times I ended up with a couple of their crappy mags.

A magazine can be the weakest link in the operation of a mag fed gun. If you buy quality mags you should get quality springs in those mags and they should be reliable.
Budget mags = budget springs = future problems. Mis dos centavos.

Welcome to the High Road.

Well put, Pat.

I, too mark my Glock mags with not only my initials but starting with magazine #2, an orange paint dot (1,2,3 etc. My “#1” mag is blank). This helps ID them as individual mags in case one craps out and also keeps my mags with me after a range session with others.



I bought 12 Wolff extra power springs for my set of a dozen Glock 17/34 mags. So far 100% reliable.

Stay safe.

 

[CapnMac]

Well, welcome to our patch of craziness. We tend to be friendly rather than flaming.

My simple answer for you, is go get more magazines of each type (I will recommend OEM rather than least-expensive). Then pick a time frame, and jst swap them out.

I have a personal bias towards shooting the full ones empty and reloading the new ones with fresh ammo. This is not the cheapest way. It's the way I find most fun, though []

Mind, I'm just one dude, and I really have only been at this since 1985, there are older and more experienced voices here to listen to.

 

[danez71]

I am not arguing I'm asking a question here.

Recoil springs and magazine springs are under different loads and do different jobs so wouldn't that be a hard comparison to make or is that just a general example.

Also this guy appears to be planning to leave the magazines loaded over time instead of unloading and loading them

It's a general example but not too far off. Robough recommended changing their recoil spring every 250 rounds.... after initially saying 500. It's a very compact design that gets squished a lot. Store it with the slide locked back and see the life cycles shorten.

If it only got squished a little, say 5% as an extreme example, that spring could a million cycles.


One of the links I've posted is a mfgr that was for a (pretty sure, it's been a while) 10 rnd mag for the Shield.

They actually stated that it could be left loaded for like 7 or 10 yrs when the mags had only been out for a year or 2 so it's not like they were trying to get people to buy new springs.

Also, while doing so, they also went out of their way to confirm that loaded mags won't last forever.


So they screwed themselves on replacment spring sales and they lost sales because they didn't claim they last forever... they could have just stayed silent and let the internet myth be their quality statement but they told the truth instead.



This was a good thread we had from a cpl years ago.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...1-magazine-loaded.816320/page-3#post-10492635

 

[FFGColorado]

And in CO that is just 10 rounds, right!!!

Nope..15R and only if bought after July1, 2013..all my mags bought before that...

Effective July 1, 2013, Colorado requires background checks for all firearm sales at the buyer's expense.Magazines that are capable of accepting more than 15 rounds or are designed to be readily convertible to accept more than 15 rounds cannot be sold or transferred within state limits..

 

[buddyd157]

Well, welcome to our patch of craziness. We tend to be friendly rather than flaming.

My simple answer for you, is go get more magazines of each type (I will recommend OEM rather than least-expensive). Then pick a time frame, and jst swap them out.

I have a personal bias towards shooting the full ones empty and reloading the new ones with fresh ammo. This is not the cheapest way. It's the way I find most fun, though []

Mind, I'm just one dude, and I really have only been at this since 1985, there are older and more experienced voices here to listen to.

yes, and thank you.

when i was ordering my CZ 75 B, i also bought one extra magazine, made by, MEC-GAR?, and this one was made in Italy. the gun store said they make excellent OEM quality parts?

anyway, it was $26.00.

reading the wording on the front of the package, it says, "over 100 million OEM firearms magazines made since 1965"

so if there is any truth in advertising, i shall see.

you heard of this company before??

the Mec-Gar website wants $35.09....over the price of $26.00 from the gun shop

 

[rust collector]

Mec-Gar mags have a good reputation. They are OEM for many brands, and they have been at it long enough to prove that they produce a good mag.

Manufacturer's suggest retail price (MSRP) is akin to the opening bid request at an auction. Few are sold at that price, but it gives you the feeling that you are getting a good deal when you buy for a bit less.

 

[Trunk Monkey]

yes, and thank you.

when i was ordering my CZ 75 B, i also bought one extra magazine, made by, MEC-GAR?, and this one was made in Italy. the gun store said they make excellent OEM quality parts?

anyway, it was $26.00.

reading the wording on the front of the package, it says, "over 100 million OEM firearms magazines made since 1965"

so if there is any truth in advertising, i shall see.

you heard of this company before??

the Mec-Gar website wants $35.09....over the price of $26.00 from the gun shop

MecGar has one of the best reputations in the industry. When I owned a CZ I wouldn't buy anything else.