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Loading 45/70, Lee FCD Denting Cases

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by scubadown, Nov 28, 2010.

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  1. scubadown

    scubadown Member

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    I am loading 45/70 and the Lee Factory Crimp Die seems to be putting light vertical dents around the Starline brass cases. Is this typical for the FCD?
     
  2. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Yes, No, Maybe.

    Some of the rifle caliber FCD's use a collet to squeeze the crimp ring.
    The slits in the collet may leave tiny vertical "dents".

    I would have thought though the 45-70 FCD would have been a different type with a carbide post sizer insert like other straight-wall handgun calibers.

    But I don't know.

    rc
     
  3. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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  4. scubadown

    scubadown Member

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    My light dents are longitudinal not circumferential.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2010
  5. MrOldLude

    MrOldLude Member

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    From what I'm seeing, I can't say it's normal, but I wouldn't be too concerned with the effects.
     
  6. scubadown

    scubadown Member

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    I think what I have concluded is that I had the FCD adjusted too much, causing the collets to bottom out and then flex in, causing the dents. Backing off the FCD seems to reduce the denting.
     
  7. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    That is likely what is happening from the look of the dents.
     
  8. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Well, that doesn't look like the result of a collet style FCD crimp anyway.

    Looks more like the solid carbide insert roll crimp one, as used on other straight wall calibers.

    rc
     
  9. 68wj

    68wj Member

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    Are the dents the same for every case? If so, have you checked the inside of the collet for any debris or even surface inconsistancies? A small bump in the metal could be pressing the dent into the case as it crimps. I am only guessing at this point though as I have never seen this issue.
     
  10. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    I am 99% sure there is no collet in the .45-70 FCD, and that it works like their other FCD's for straight walled calibers.
     
  11. scubadown

    scubadown Member

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    No it is a Lee FCD. It has four collects that come together as the cartridge is pressed up into it.
     
  12. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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    I have no need of a Lee FCD- You could ask lee.

    Its a Rifle typeAs my link in post #3 showed. Lee instructions > Factory crimp die adjustment

    The amount of crimp applied will be consistent if your press has mechanical stops built into the lever linkage, and you lower the lever to the stop every time. Start with the Factory Crimp die turned into the press until it stops against the shell holder with the ram raised all the way. Lower the ram, and turn the die in one full turn. Now try crimping a case, making sure that you raise the ram (lower the lever) all the way to the stop. You will feel slight resistance at the top of the stroke, as the crimp collet is forced up into the die body.

    If the crimp is not firm enough, turn the die in another 1/4 turn and try again. If you turn the die in to the point where the four slits in the collet are closed when the ram is raised all the way, you have reached the limit.

    If your press doesn't* have a " mechanical stop" built into it, then what? :confused:
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  13. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Sure looks like a typical roll crimp in the pic. I am remoting in though, and pics are not real clear. Hmm. Anyway, I still think you are right, it needs to be adjusted lighter.
     
  14. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Yep!

    I went to Lee website and checked.
    And it is listed in the FCD collet die section, not the carbide "size'r till it cries uncle" section.

    The 45-70 FCD sure enough has a collet in the parts list too.

    rc
     
  15. m0par

    m0par Member

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    Stupid question, but are you sure they weren't dented before using the FCD?

    The pics look quite similar to what I've seen when I've over-lubed during sizing.
     
  16. GaryL

    GaryL Member

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    Sure that's not the Lee FCCD? (Factory Crimp & Cut to Length Die)

    :D
     
  17. MCMXI

    MCMXI Member

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    I use a Lee FCD to put a nice roll crimp on my .45-70 loads and I don't have any issues with the cases buckling. I don't have any photos of my reloads available right now but I have a bunch of reloads made up at home so if a photo would be useful I can take a few. I really like the Lee FCD for putting a nice roll crimp on .45 Colt, .454 Casull and .45-70 loads but HATE it for .357 Mag. I'm reverting to using the RCBS seater/roll crimp dies to roll crimp .357 Mag and .44 Mag.
     
  18. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Now I am really confused. How does a Lee collet style crimper roll crimp. The one I have (7.62X39) simply presses in 90 degrees on the case mouth like all the other ones I have seen. How is the .45-70 one different?
     
  19. MCMXI

    MCMXI Member

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    I use it for 405gr JSP bullets and for 405gr OT lead bullets. It works a little differently on both bullets as you can imagine. With the jacketed bullet, it acts as you mention by squeezing the case mouth into the cannelure leaving that typical ring. For lead bullets with a deeper cannelure, when adjusted properly, it rolls the case mouth into the cannelure and does a very nice job. I use the same die for .45 Colt and .454 Casull with very good results. I need to take some photos but here are some .45 Colt loads that were lightly roll crimped with a Lee FCD.

    [​IMG]
     
  20. MCMXI

    MCMXI Member

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    OK ... here's a photo of some .45-70 loads that I assembled using the Lee FCD to crimp. I won't put up much of a protest to anyone who says that the roll crimp isn't as nicely radiused as you might typically see but it is a roll crimp of sorts. To the OP, you can see that the cases aren't buckled. Also, the bullet could be seated a few thousandths deeper ... oops. Anyway, carry on!

    [​IMG]
     
  21. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    I would love to see the collet. Does it have a tapered or rounded spot inside vs flat (parallel) like the bottle necked rifle collet FCD's I have seen? How does the .45-70 FCD work for .45 Colt and .454? Photos please.......:)
     
  22. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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    Last edited: Nov 30, 2010
  23. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    I was thinking the same thing. Maybe he has both though.
     
  24. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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    He has me confused also.
     
  25. scubadown

    scubadown Member

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    Yeah mine definitely does not roll crimp. It evenly presses 360 degrees around the case. I think my problem is I went from 405 gr jacketed bullets to 300 gr lead and I had the FCD set too far down.

    It is not from lube as the light dents are evenly spaced around the casing.
     
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