GotGlock
Member
As stated, im looking for a reliable SHTF, all around rifle. Perferably in a "common" caliber, like .223 or .308, etc. I was looking at the ruger mini 30, any suggestions? LEts keep it under $900 and relaible. Thanks
Looking for a reliable SHTF rifle, have no clue what to look for
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pauli
Member
first, you should probably work out what you think you'll need it to do, and how you think you'll be using it.
Remington788
Member
Avoid the mini-30 if it is going to be your only rifle because only the 5 round mags are reliable. (I own one for fun, but it is not the rifle I would grab in a SHTF event) For $900 you have a lot of choices and if you want a .308 look into the JLD PTR-91. The current going price is around $750.
That is probably the best answer possible. Once you know what tasks you'll need to accomplish, go to a shop and find something that will do those tasks and that you find pleasing. There is no perfect answer to what makes a SHTF rifle, much as there is no answer to the perfect sidearm. I'm sure there are those of the mindset that glocks are plastic POS....However it works for you. Always go with what is right for YOU...you'll be happier in the end.
Dionysusigma
Member
Well, your given specs and preferred rifle, something doesn't quite mesh. It's like asking for an SUV that's got 90 miles to the gallon and a top speed of 350 mph.
For your specs, though, I might recommend one of the following:
Kel-Tec SU-16C or CA: $450.00 They fold in half (!) for storage, and can still be fired like that. They take standard AR-15 mags and .223/5.56, which are easy to find and inexpensive. I've seen torture tests done to them that impressed me, and the gas-piston design reduces fouling and (IMO) increases reliability.
Home-built 16" bbl AR-15: $600.00-900.00 Parts are quite easy to find, as are ammo and mags. 40+ years of constant use and design refinements have brought forth a reliable, flexible system that is plenty durable. Customize to your heart's content. 16" barrel plus a telescoping stock results in a compact overall package that adjusts to differing statures/styles of clothing/available space.
SAR-1/WASR-10 or Maadi: $350.00 AK-47 design, lauded by most as the most reliable system ever invented. Large clearances allow for the thing to be packed with mud, sand, muddy sand, water, etc. and still pound away. 7.62x39 and AK mags are a tiny bit more difficult to find, but cost the same as .223/5.56 and AR mags. Larger bullet (IMO) works better at closer distances, though not as inherently accurate.
Other "High-End" AK: $600.00-900.00 Whether it be from Vector Arms, Arsenal, RobArm (VEPR), or Krebs, a higher-end AK will be even more accurate and sturdy than a standard Romanian or Egyptian AK. Other calibers include .223, 5.45x39, and .308, although mags are somewhat difficult to find. Parts are mostly interchangeable, but 5.45 can be quite difficult to find.
Just my two-hundredths of a Euro.
For your specs, though, I might recommend one of the following:
Kel-Tec SU-16C or CA: $450.00 They fold in half (!) for storage, and can still be fired like that. They take standard AR-15 mags and .223/5.56, which are easy to find and inexpensive. I've seen torture tests done to them that impressed me, and the gas-piston design reduces fouling and (IMO) increases reliability.
Home-built 16" bbl AR-15: $600.00-900.00 Parts are quite easy to find, as are ammo and mags. 40+ years of constant use and design refinements have brought forth a reliable, flexible system that is plenty durable. Customize to your heart's content. 16" barrel plus a telescoping stock results in a compact overall package that adjusts to differing statures/styles of clothing/available space.
SAR-1/WASR-10 or Maadi: $350.00 AK-47 design, lauded by most as the most reliable system ever invented. Large clearances allow for the thing to be packed with mud, sand, muddy sand, water, etc. and still pound away. 7.62x39 and AK mags are a tiny bit more difficult to find, but cost the same as .223/5.56 and AR mags. Larger bullet (IMO) works better at closer distances, though not as inherently accurate.
Other "High-End" AK: $600.00-900.00 Whether it be from Vector Arms, Arsenal, RobArm (VEPR), or Krebs, a higher-end AK will be even more accurate and sturdy than a standard Romanian or Egyptian AK. Other calibers include .223, 5.45x39, and .308, although mags are somewhat difficult to find. Parts are mostly interchangeable, but 5.45 can be quite difficult to find.
Just my two-hundredths of a Euro.
armoredman
Member
Rugged semi auto main battle rifle?
1 Expensive - DSA FAL or Springfield M1A, though problems have occurred with the M1As.
2 Not so expensive - various AR15s, AK clones
3 Cheap and reliable - SKS.
1 Expensive - DSA FAL or Springfield M1A, though problems have occurred with the M1As.
2 Not so expensive - various AR15s, AK clones
3 Cheap and reliable - SKS.
mountain_cowboy
Member
FAL: up and down the price scale, they're usually all reliable, though not the best accuracy. Cheap mags. Excellent cartridge that can be found as cheap surplus. Lots of accessories if you want to add them, but perfectly fine bone stock.
No_Brakes23
Member
If you are thinking about the Mini-30, you might as well get an AK.
My vote would be for the high end AK.
Good accuracy inside 300 meters.
Extremely reliable design.
Mass quantities of cheap reliable ammo. (7.62x39)
The AR-15 is a very capable platform, as well, but I think the AK edges it out in terms of reliability and having less of a learning curve.
Whatever you get, make sure you get a good zero on it, so you know where it shoots. Make sure you know how to use it, and how to clean it. Put lots and lots of ammo through it.
Don't overlook a Garand or an SKS, while their capacities are limited, they are capable inexpensive rifles chambered in ubiquitous calibers.
Good luck.
My vote would be for the high end AK.
Good accuracy inside 300 meters.
Extremely reliable design.
Mass quantities of cheap reliable ammo. (7.62x39)
The AR-15 is a very capable platform, as well, but I think the AK edges it out in terms of reliability and having less of a learning curve.
Whatever you get, make sure you get a good zero on it, so you know where it shoots. Make sure you know how to use it, and how to clean it. Put lots and lots of ammo through it.
Don't overlook a Garand or an SKS, while their capacities are limited, they are capable inexpensive rifles chambered in ubiquitous calibers.
Good luck.
Bartholomew Roberts
Member
I'd definitely pass on the Mini-30. It won't hold up to a heavy shooting schedule as well as other rifles within that price point.
You have a lot of options available. What kind of tasks are you envisioning for this rifle? Specifically, what type of targets (game, if so what size?), what type of ranges, what type of firing schedule? Do you have size/weight restrictions?
You have a lot of options available. What kind of tasks are you envisioning for this rifle? Specifically, what type of targets (game, if so what size?), what type of ranges, what type of firing schedule? Do you have size/weight restrictions?
Old Dude
Member
I would say take a good look around where you live. If the fit hits the shan, what is the longest shot you're likely to take? Buy to that limit.
Buy something easy for you to both handle and shoot. Buy something you feel comfortable shooting.
There is no objective "best" answer. A lot of it depends on where you live and who you are.
I live in an urban area. I don't think I would ever need to shoot over 100 yards. When I look out my window, the farthest target away is probably no more than 70 yards away. I have some idea of what *I* might need in this situation, but you need to know your situation and know yourself.
Buy something easy for you to both handle and shoot. Buy something you feel comfortable shooting.
There is no objective "best" answer. A lot of it depends on where you live and who you are.
I live in an urban area. I don't think I would ever need to shoot over 100 yards. When I look out my window, the farthest target away is probably no more than 70 yards away. I have some idea of what *I* might need in this situation, but you need to know your situation and know yourself.
goalie
Member
SKS. Three weeks ago I would never have imagined me typing that. After finally buying one with my C&R license and putting it throgh the paces at the range, I can say that for 800 bucks you can have a reliable, brand-new SKS and about 6,000 rounds of 7.62x39 ammo to shoot through it.
SKS. I think you can pick one up for between 70 and 200. It's cheaper than an AR. These rifles are built to take a licking and keep on shooting.
The key is what do you want to do. If you want to pick off targets at 1000 then an Garand, at about 200 yards the SKS will do the trick. You can get a larger mag cap than the 10 the SKS comes with, but do you need more?
The key is what do you want to do. If you want to pick off targets at 1000 then an Garand, at about 200 yards the SKS will do the trick. You can get a larger mag cap than the 10 the SKS comes with, but do you need more?
Nick1911
Member
Just based on the title.... you can't go wrong with a good AK
willeo6709
Member
cmp garand, AR15, or a used "franken" fal.... The garand speaks for itself, any mission, any conditions, any reasonable engagement range. The non dsa used FAL's are an excellent choice as well. I bought my FAL Congo for $500 with a bunch of aluminum mags. A lot of AR's out there in that price range too. Don't flame me on the AR, many are reliable as the income tax deadline.
joab
Member
If you get an SKS don't get the cumbersome and overly long barreled Yugo.
I'd go with a "paratrooper" SKS or an AK
I'd go with a "paratrooper" SKS or an AK
itgoesboom
member
Really depends on you, your area, your training, and your plans.
Some good choices:
VEPR-K The cadillac of AK-47s, and one of the most accurate. $550-$600, and magazines are often available <$10 for 30 rounders. Ammo can be had for $100 for 1k rounds. Disadvantage is the sights (typical AK) and the rainbow trajectory. Figure this is a 300 yard and under gun. Really, thats all thats really realistic I think in most cases for SHTF....
PTR-91 Probably the best HK-91 clone out there, some think it is better than the original. The Roller Delayed blowback is one of the most reliable and accurate action types out there. Some people think that the HK action is more reliable than the AK action. I don't know if that is true, but its very reliable. Better sights than the AK, and uses 7.62 nato ammo. I am planning on getting a PTR-91KP at some point.
SKS Kinda like the mini-30, but you can get 3 of them for the same price, and it's more reliable. Ammo is cheap, and you don't need extra mags, just lots of stripper clips (20 strippers go for about $8 or less). If you do this, replace the sights, they suck. Cost of new sights is like $59.
FAL Lots of different manufacturers out there. Century is the bottom of the barrel of these, but you can probably find a good one for your price. The right arm of the free world. Very reliable, good accuracy, and magazines are cheap.
AR-15 You can get one in your price range. RRA or Bushmaster would be your best bet. Magazines are little more pricey, but the AR is a great design.
SU-16 Lots of various configurations. Stowable, and uses AR mags. Nice design, but there is a lot of plastic.
M1A Probably out of your price range. Good design, good sights, good accuracy. Some problems with some of the S/A ones, atleast according to some people.
M1 Garand Obviously a great rifle. Can get these through the CMP for about $500. .30/06 is still very available, and enbloc clips are plentiful and cheap. Hits well, and has good sights.
CETME I hesitate to mention this one, despite my having a very good one. The CETME is the HK91s father basically. Same action, and many parts are interchangable. Only problem is that Century has done a number on screwing these up, so unless you know what you are looking for, you are really rolling the dice. But if you can find one affordably, and check it out and test fire it, you might end up with a great rifle for not too much $$$. Mine is my SHTF rifle, and is very accurate (I have posted photos showing <1" @ 75 yards or so) as well as being extremely reliable.
I.G.B.
Some good choices:
VEPR-K The cadillac of AK-47s, and one of the most accurate. $550-$600, and magazines are often available <$10 for 30 rounders. Ammo can be had for $100 for 1k rounds. Disadvantage is the sights (typical AK) and the rainbow trajectory. Figure this is a 300 yard and under gun. Really, thats all thats really realistic I think in most cases for SHTF....
PTR-91 Probably the best HK-91 clone out there, some think it is better than the original. The Roller Delayed blowback is one of the most reliable and accurate action types out there. Some people think that the HK action is more reliable than the AK action. I don't know if that is true, but its very reliable. Better sights than the AK, and uses 7.62 nato ammo. I am planning on getting a PTR-91KP at some point.
SKS Kinda like the mini-30, but you can get 3 of them for the same price, and it's more reliable. Ammo is cheap, and you don't need extra mags, just lots of stripper clips (20 strippers go for about $8 or less). If you do this, replace the sights, they suck. Cost of new sights is like $59.
FAL Lots of different manufacturers out there. Century is the bottom of the barrel of these, but you can probably find a good one for your price. The right arm of the free world. Very reliable, good accuracy, and magazines are cheap.
AR-15 You can get one in your price range. RRA or Bushmaster would be your best bet. Magazines are little more pricey, but the AR is a great design.
SU-16 Lots of various configurations. Stowable, and uses AR mags. Nice design, but there is a lot of plastic.
M1A Probably out of your price range. Good design, good sights, good accuracy. Some problems with some of the S/A ones, atleast according to some people.
M1 Garand Obviously a great rifle. Can get these through the CMP for about $500. .30/06 is still very available, and enbloc clips are plentiful and cheap. Hits well, and has good sights.
CETME I hesitate to mention this one, despite my having a very good one. The CETME is the HK91s father basically. Same action, and many parts are interchangable. Only problem is that Century has done a number on screwing these up, so unless you know what you are looking for, you are really rolling the dice. But if you can find one affordably, and check it out and test fire it, you might end up with a great rifle for not too much $$$. Mine is my SHTF rifle, and is very accurate (I have posted photos showing <1" @ 75 yards or so) as well as being extremely reliable.
I.G.B.
Define "SHTF." If it's "need to survive by hunting for food" then you'd be well-served by a .22 rifle, and maybe a .30 caliber for larger game. If it's "repel the looting hordes" or "world war III," then you should think about a semi-auto of some sort -- I prefer .308's, but you can make a reasonable argument for most anything fielded by a modern army, or even for a 30-06 Garand -- but note that a rifle itself isn't going to be nearly enough in a situation, and the coordination and organization required for those situations will dictate their own rifle needs.
Start with your premise, and go from there.
Start with your premise, and go from there.
No_Brakes23
Member
You talking about the M59/66? Cause the M59 doesn't have the GL on the front and is considerably shorter and handier. The M59 is almost exactly the same length as an 870 with a 20" barrel.
GotGlock
Member
Thanks im going to look into the ak style rifles, only thing im worried about is during a SHTF is protection from the mutant/vampire/zombies, and looters.
Old Dude
Member
Where I live, an AK is just about the ticket. I can hit anyone I'm likely to need to hit with it. That said, when I think about SHTF scenarios where I live, I think I know where looters would be headed--and it wouldn't be our area.
itgoesboom
member
Good choice.
Look at the VEPR line, Arsenal, Vector, ORF and KrebsCustom.
Those are some of the best ones out there right now.
I.G.B.
No_Brakes23
Member
+1 on the Krebs. I have only heard about how good the others are. But Krebs are built on Russian Izhmash rifles from Saiga. I have put a whole bunch of rounds trough a Saiga. The Saiga can be an amazing little rifle. It changed my view of what AK variants are capable of. Krebs makes Saigas more modular.
joab
Member
The 59s are not as common as the 59/66 and cost more.
The ones I've seen advertised warn of pitted barrels But they would be a better choice as would the Cali Catstrated 59/66s
But I believe they are still heavier than the Chinese SKSs even with out the GL
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