Looking to get a new pistol that's not a C&B revolver

[TTv2]

Having 5 or 6 shots in a revolver is nice, but the caps causing issues and the time it takes to load them is losing its appeal. So, I have been thinking it may be time to get a single shot or a double barrel muzzleloader, but I'm not sure what to get. What I do know is I don't want a flintlock and it must be at least .36 caliber.

Also, if it can use .375 or .454 round balls that would be a big plus.

No preference for it to be rifled or smoothbore, the distances I'll be shooting at with it (25 yards max) either would work.

Things that immediately come to mind are the Pedersoli Howdah and the American Guncraft Diablo. Lyman has their GPP, but that is rather large for a single shot. Also, I have long had an interest in the Great Gun derringers from Czech Republic and would pay to have one imported.

Thoughts?

 

[skeeterfogger]

Finding a rifle that will accommodate a revolver diameter is not going to be easy unless you have a barrel made for it. One for .375 would need to be .385 and for a .454 would be .464. Casting you own would be best bet if you want to reuse the lead.

 

[Malachi Leviticus Blue]

There has been some recent discussion her about the Italian copies of the Tingle Target Pistols.
They are single shot target pistols.
The copies made by ASM were .44 caliber. I cant remember if I used existing balls for C&B revolvers I had or if I acquired balls with the Tingle pistol but I did fire one I had a few years ago.

 

[Mike 56]

I think I would start with a single barrel or even a single shot 20 gauge shotgun you can hand load round balls as well as shotshells with black powder with homemade tools for not much money. I am on the lookout for one for myself.
Missed the pistol part How about a cap lock pistol. I have an old CVA Kentucky 45cal They are a lot of fun. I was at a Sportsman Wearhouse in Stockton, Ca today they had a kit in stock for 209.00. They are showing 50cal pistols in stock online. https://www.sportsmans.com/shooting...s-50cal-kentucky-black-powder-pistol/p/303541 Tingle Target Pistols would be a great choice as well as Malachi Leviticus Blue posted.

 

[arcticap]

Having 5 or 6 shots in a revolver is nice, but the caps causing issues and the time it takes to load them is losing its appeal.

Those issues can usually be overcome, paper cartridges, loading press, cap post or a different model.
And cartridges loaded with round balls can be used with conversion cylinders.

Not that it matters, but the time that it ends up taking to load a Howdah may end up taking twice as long depending on its configuration.

...but I'm not sure what to get. What I do know is I don't want a flintlock and it must be at least .36 caliber...
...that immediately come to mind are the Pedersoli Howdah and the American Guncraft Diablo. Lyman has their GPP, but that is rather large for a single shot. Also, I have long had an interest in the Great Gun derringers from Czech Republic and would pay to have one imported.

Thoughts?

There's nothing wrong with wanting to go in a different direction, but the direction seems pretty open ended.
Would you rather blow stuff up, plink, or target shoot?
It seems that you would rather plink than target shoot with precision accuracy.

Depending on the configuration, the Howdah can be expensive to buy and shoot too.
It's not as accurate as a target gun, especially because of the sights, and will probably cost more to shoot as a plinker.

Whereas if you went the target route, there are higher quality revolvers and some affordable single shot pistols.
The Pedersoli Continental .45 Target pistol is a newer model that's made for target shooting. --->>> http://www.cherrys.com/ped_pist.htm
But this type of gun would probably be fired with light powder charges to get best accuracy.
The experience and purpose would be a lot different than shooting a Howdah, although it could be used for plinking at clay birds and steel targets.
The same with the Pedersoli Bounty Hunter, which like the Howdah may also need two hands to hold it for offhand shooting.

The Great Gun Derringer seems to be more of a self-defense novelty gun due to its short barrels.
I wouldn't think that it would be as much fun to go shooting with as a revolver in good working order.
And many European dealers don't seem to have them available.

 

[TTv2]

From what I've read the company that makes the Great Gun derringers is a very small outfit and isn't able to produce a large number of guns.

Target shooting isn't necessarily the goal, but I don't want something that is totally inaccurate at a longer distance, so something like a pepperbox isn't what I want. If a smoothbore can hit the 8 inch plates at 15 yards, I'm happy. It's crazy to think, but the sights on a Howdah are probably better than a Colt style revolver.

 

[TTv2]

There has been some recent discussion her about the Italian copies of the Tingle Target Pistols.
They are single shot target pistols.
The copies made by ASM were .44 caliber. I cant remember if I used existing balls for C&B revolvers I had or if I acquired balls with the Tingle pistol but I did fire one I had a few years ago.

I was the one asking about them as I'd never seen them before. They would interest me more than the Lyman single shot pistol as they seem to be smaller and likely use the same balls the revolvers do.

 

[arcticap]

I was the one asking about them as I'd never seen them before. They would interest me more than the Lyman single shot pistol as they seem to be smaller and likely use the same balls the revolvers do.

Previous reports indicate that it takes a .433 ball and a thin patch which fits tight.
A .440 bullet fit snug at the muzzle.
And it shot PRB's 12" - 16" high at 20 yards. --->>> https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/cva-prospector-found-his-final-home.828740/

If bare .454 balls could be hammered into the bore, then that would be slow loading.

 

[TTv2]

In the past few days I've leaned very strongly towards the Lyman, largely because the barrels are easily replaceable and I've long thought about buying a spare barrel and drilling out the bore to 20 gauge as then I've got an accurate rifle barrel for longer distance and a smooth barrel for short range use with shot.

Now the question is .50 or .54 caliber? I don't cast and the price for 100 balls seems to be the same.

 

[arcticap]

In the past few days I've leaned very strongly towards the Lyman, largely because the barrels are easily replaceable and I've long thought about buying a spare barrel and drilling out the bore to 20 gauge as then I've got an accurate rifle barrel for longer distance and a smooth barrel for short range use with shot.

Now the question is .50 or .54 caliber? I don't cast and the price for 100 balls seems to be the same.

The Lyman Plains pistols are very accurate.
There was a time when there were more than a few complaints about the stocks cracking at the wrist.
It shouldn't dissuade anybody from buying one, but it's something to be aware of.
This first report was from 2020 and happened during the first time loading it.

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/...ls-loading-like-my-rifle.121859/#post-1670549

This report was from 2010 and the same thing happened during loading.
See the photos. --->>> https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/broken-grip-on-lyman-plains-pistol.498747/

 

[TTv2]

Seems like something that's caused by poor quality wood and happens quickly into the life of the gun. Also, I wasn't buying a kit, I was going to buy one already made by Lyman, so if there's any issue with the stock Lyman is more likely to cover it than if it were a kit gun.

Also, from the velocities listed it seems like the .54 is the way to go. Almost 500 lbs of muzzle energy? That's great for a black powder pistol!

 

[Ironhand54]

If you watch the used market you can sometimes find a TC Patriot pistol. They were very well made single shots, usually in 45 with some in 36. Set triggers, good sights and TC quality.



I like mine
IronHand

 

[TTv2]

I've decided to get the .54 Lyman Plains Pistol. One last question on it tho: can it shoot conical bullets? Are .54 caliber conical bullets available? Does anyone shoot conicals in either their .50 or .54 GPP?

 

[arcticap]

I've decided to get the .54 Lyman Plains Pistol. One last question on it tho: can it shoot conical bullets? Are .54 caliber conical bullets available? Does anyone shoot conicals in either their .50 or .54 GPP?

There was a Plains pistol thread on the MLF. --->>> https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/any-lyman-plains-pistol-fans-here.111369/
Rat mentioned many times that he shoots both balls and Hornady 240 grain PA Conicals with his .50.
He shoots from 30 - 70 grains of powder with balls, and 60 -65 grains of powder with the conicals.

And 8 Bore mentioned that he has a .54 which he casts balls and conicals for.

Most of the .54 bullets seem to be discontinued, probably because many .54 guns have been discontinued in recent years.
I can only find the TC Maxiball 425 grain in stock at TOW. --->>> https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Search.aspx?search=.54 bullets

Lee makes 2 different .54 REAL molds, one is 300 grains and the other is 380 grains. --->>> https://leeprecision.com/bullet-casting/black-powder-molds/black-powder-real-bullet-combo-molds/
Lyman makes a .54 minie mold - 425 grains. --->>> https://www.buffaloarms.com/54-cal-425-grain-lyman-hb-minie-mould-542622-lym2654622

May be better off looking at .54 bullet sabot combinations if you want to find some variety.

No Excuses makes a 525 grain .54 conical but that heavyweight bullet is really made for rifle hunting. --->>> https://www.muzzleloading-bullets.com

 

[TTv2]

One last question on the Lyman Plains Pistol.

I see that it's specified for #11 caps and I'd like to know can #10 CCI caps work? I have lots of those and caps are hard to come by right now.

 

[arcticap]

If CCI #10's don't fit, the nipple can be carefully adjusted using an emery board or emery cloth and sand paper.
Some have suggested to use a quicker method of chucking the nipple in an electric drill and running it against a file or sandpaper.
Be careful to not take off more than needed to provide a snug fit.
Lyman Investarms replacement nipples are 6 X .75 .

 

[Rex in OTZ]

How about a revolver that is not fired by a cap?


Matchlock fired japanese samuri revolver?

 

[Rex in OTZ]

Or how about Needle fired handguns?
Dreyesse single shot

Joealland single shot

Bottom Dreyese needle revolver.

 

[bannockburn]

Might want to check out militaryheritage.com for some interesting single shot pistols (and one double barreled flintlock pistol that I'm rather keen on), of British, French, and German heritage.

 

[damoc]

This is my not quite a howdah its a lot of fun to shoot has heaps of power and i like that I can load with small shot charges for around the barn/shed area.

 

[Captain*kirk]

Just saw this thread...sorry for the late reply!
I have the Plains Pistol in .50. It is shockingly accurate with a .495 roundball and a .010 patch. It's a bit of a corker to get started but once past the muzzle it seats with little pressure. 30gr of 3F or Pyrodex P will give you big grins, guaranteed. The Remington #10s do not fit; 11s go right on. The barrel comes off in a snap (one wedge and a hooked breech). It comes with an easily removable belt hook if you are so inclined (took mine off). IIRC, the problem with the cracked stocks was pretty much confined to the .54 cal models. Not sure why, but that was pretty much the consensus last I heard. FWIW, .495 RB are much easier to come by than the .54 cal, if that means anything. I highly recommend this for a rockin' good time!

 

[Rex in OTZ]

Track of the Wolf and Dixie Gun Works with random parts and firearm kits.

Of purchase in firearms featured below that are non-firing replicas.
They come with a non-firing statement and can have a vent hole installed by a gunsmith.

http://www.militaryheritage.com/muskets.htm

 

[Pete D.]

You might consider an underhammer. Both of these are .50 caliber and very accurate.
The gun at the top is by Bob Worthington at Greyhaven Arms. (greyhavenarms.com)
The gun below that - if you can find one - is a Hopkins and Allen boot pistol.
Pete

 

[Rex in OTZ]

And the underhammer breechloading system Based on the Loebnitz system Norwegian military, Kammerlader Cavalry Pistol?

 

[Rex in OTZ]

Here is a odd duck the British made cap and ball JR Cooper Underhammer revolver with folding front sight.
Making one from scratch could be a real challange.