M17 Issued to Sentinels at Tomb of the Unknown

[Alte Schule]

The unique distinguishing features for the M17 Tomb of the Unknown Pistols include:

• Pistol Names: each of the four pistols bears the name of Silence, Respect, Dignity, or Perseverance and is featured on the dust cover. Dignity and Perseverance represent “The Sentinel’s Creed,” and Silence and Respect represent the request to the public by Arlington National Cemetery when visiting the Tomb of the Unknown, and during the Changing of the Guard;
• Custom Wood Grips: in 1921 the chosen Unknown was transported to the United States of America aboard the USS Olympia. The custom wood grips are made with wood from the USS Olympia and include the crest of the 3rd Guard, Tomb of the Unknown Soldier identification badge inset;
• Cocking Serrations: XXI cocking serrations are engraved on the slide to signify the twenty-one steps it takes for the Tomb Sentinels to walk by the Tomb of the Unknowns and the military honor of a 21 Gun Salute;
• Sight Plate: an engraved impression of the Greek Figures featured on the east panel of the Tomb – Peace, Victory, and Valor – are featured on the sight plate;
• Sights: a glass insert made with marble dust from the Tomb of the Unknown fills the sights of the ceremonial pistols;
• Engraved Magazines: the 21-round magazines feature an aluminum base plate engraved with the names of the Greek figures featured on the Tomb of the Unknown – Peace, Victory, and Valor – and include a name plate on the bottom of the magazine engraved with the Tomb Sentinel badge number.
• Serial Numbers: the pistols are serialized with a unique set of serial numbers that incorporate items of significance to the Old Guard: “LS” represents line six of the Sentinels’ Creed, “My standard will remain perfection; “02JUL37” to signify the first 24-hour guard posted at the Tomb of the Unknown on July 3, 1937; “21” to signify the 21 steps it takes the Tomb Sentinels to walk by the Tomb of the Unknown, and the military honor of a 21 Gun Salute. The full series of M17 Tomb of the Unknown Soldier Pistols serial numbers are LS02JUL37A21 (Silence), LS02JUL37B21 (Respect), LS02JUL37C21 (Dignity), LS02JUL37D21 (Perseverance).

Full article here https://www.militarytimes.com/off-d...-guard-the-unknown-soldier/?utm_source=clavis

 

[ATLDave]

We had another thread on this recently. Several questions were raised as to whether this is actually something that is or will be officially "issued" to anyone. Questions include which of the guards even carry sidearms, and why the ceremonial version of the M17 would be missing the manual safety that was required by the specifications. Maybe Sig will choose to "issue" these to anyone selected for honor guard duty as a gift, but there is at least some reason for skepticism as to whether they are in any way sanctioned or official.

 

[Wisco]

Reminds of the corfam (spelling?) shoes the military issues. Trashy to say the least.

The duty performed deserves something better than shiny plastic...if these are even issued to replace the M9 issued to the sergeant of the guard.

I’m a polymer gun junky for actual use, but for ceremonial purposes I think some high polish 1911’s would match the M14 much better.

 

[ATLDave]

The duty performed deserves something better than shiny plastic.

The article says it is actually an aluminum frame (and the slide would be steel, of course).

 

[Wisco]

The article says it is actually an aluminum frame (and the slide would be steel, of course).

Good catch. I just read the summary in the OP.

That being the case, it still looks more to me like shiny plastic than shiny black aluminum and reminds of the horrid shoes.

If you don’t go Airborne in the Army for any other reason, do it to not wear low quarters...

 

[ATLDave]

As I wrote above, I'm highly skeptical this is going to be part of any kit actually used at the Tomb. I could be wrong, but this feels like commemorative coinage issued by the Franklin Mint.

 

[Texas10mm]

There are only going to be FOUR pistols.

 

[JR24]

Pretty hideous to my eye, especially compared to a M9 or even Sig 226 or 229.

Remove that extended mag for a flush fitting on and it would look a bit better.

 

[primalmu]

Sig should be ashamed.

 

[JONWILL]

I don't like it. They carry an M-14, it should be a 1911.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

The article says it is actually an aluminum frame (and the slide would be steel, of course).

If they offered a commercial aluminum-framed 320, I might actually buy one. I'll take it in anodized grey, thanks!

 

[BSA1]

It does make me wonder what defensive arms and tactics they have in the event of a attack at the Tomb. It is a high value terrorist and nut-job target.

 

[AlexanderA]

(a) This looks horrible.

(b) SIG is probably giving the 4 pistols to the army, with the ulterior purpose of then selling this "commemorative" product to the public.

(c) The army should reject this monstrosity. It's an insult to the dignity and decorum that befits the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier.

 

[Balrog]

It is hideous, not matter who its issued to.

 

[RETG]

Sure doesn't do anything for me; but I only consider a handgun a tool to be used in times of emergency.
Fanciest handgun I have is a INOX PX4, .40, with Talon grips.

 

[jmr40]

If they offered a commercial aluminum-framed 320, I might actually buy one. I'll take it in anodized grey, thanks!

To me aluminum is the worst possible choice for a handgun. I understand synthetic for tough use and light weight. And I like steel for the aesthetics. There are certain guns that should only be steel framed. Aluminum doesn't look any better than plastic and isn't nearly as tough as steel or plastic.

I like the M17 and M18 and will probably buy one eventually. But if making a ceremonial gun a 1911 would have been a much better choice. And Sig makes a 1911, it wouldn't be that hard. That is about the ugliest gun I've ever seen.

 

[Jenrick]

This sounds like a promotional item from Sig that was donated to the the Sentinels. To quote from the article:

Silence, one of the four ceremonial pistols to be presented to the U.S. Army’s 3rd Guard will be on display in the SIG SAUER Booth (#3425) at the Association of the United States Army (AUSA) Annual Meeting

I believe the Sentinels normally carry an M14 with bayonet affixed, that would seem to be a better options then a pistol.

 

[bannockburn]

jmr40

I wouldn't say it's the ugliest gun I have ever seen but more like the tackiest one I have encountered. I wouldn't even want one like that as a BBQ pistol!

Better still SIG should have made a nicely polished, engraved, and blued M1911 that would be more befitting the Sentinels at the Tomb of the Unknowns.

 

[FL-NC]

I watched 2 changing of the guard videos. It appears the Sergeant Of The Guard was carrying a M9 with wood grips and some gold medallion on the grip(s). I was surprised by this, as I would have guessed it would have been a tastefully adorned M1911A1, out of tradition, etc. As far as the hideous monstrosity from Sig, I have a hard time accepting that the Tomb Guards would be carrying a pistol that looks like something from"el chapo's" collection, or something a "New Orleans p--- in a w-house would carry", to steal a quote from Gen. Patton. Then again, its a different Army today than the one I was in- and I've only been out since 2010.

 

[TomJ]

At first glance I kind of liked it, but I also thought my '74 Pinto station wagon was cool when I was 17 and still wear Garanimals to make sure my clothes match, so I may not be the best judge of these things.

 

[1911 guy]

OK. They put thought into making much of this pistol symbolically significant. At least they tried. But the execution is lacking. The overall effect is one of way too much time at a buffing wheel.

I have stood in front of it many times. The Tomb is a place of stark beauty and harsh realities. Blended edges and softened lines are not appropriate.
The magazine looks like, well, this is The High Road so I'll stop there.

If the universe granted Mulligans and Sig could do it over again, I would offer the following suggestions:
1911 pistol retaining the grips, cocking serrations and serial numbers of the current unfortunate item.
Issue three magazines, seven rounds each, making 21 rounds.
Gold bead front sight to represent the purity of motive and value of service of the unknowns.
One inert cartridge per pistol. In place of gunpowder, use the marble dust. "May we never again be required to fire in anger. May we never again be required to carve monuments to our dead".

Thus endeth my ruminations.

 

[Old Dog]

It appears the Sergeant Of The Guard was carrying a M9 with wood grips and some gold medallion on the grip(s).

That's what I noted when I visited. I had no problem with that.

These SIGs don't really look attractive to me, and for the life of me, I don't get why they have the extended magazines, but really, in the great scheme of things, I have more to worry about than ornamental weapons carried by ceremonial guards (with all due respect to the Old Guard, I think they're friggin' awesome).

 

[Nature Boy]

If you don’t go Airborne in the Army for any other reason, do it to not wear low quarters...

Or better yet, go Cav.

Not only do you get to wear Black Justin Ropers instead of those hideous shoes, you also ditch the bus driver hat for a black Stetson

 

[RETG]

In my day, Airborne got to where the "C" cap, at least until you earned a beret if you went that way. (Those who served many years ago will understand the "C" cap, a word I cannot add in this forum.)
Now, I believe all wear berets; however, not sure since I have been out longer than most here have been living.

 

[WestKentucky]

I’m not busting on them about the model chosen or the ceremonial pistol enhancements or visual keys. What I will say is that with a custom gun that is going all out that a person really needs to plan things out and make sure that all of the custom bits don’t clash and don’t go from mild to wild because wild is generally tasteless. I feel like they designed each little custom bit separately and never considered the final product.