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Making money reloading????

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by elkhuntingfool, Jun 10, 2008.

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  1. elkhuntingfool

    elkhuntingfool member

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    I've run across a few guys who claim they can make money reloading. Obviously they are reloading in bulk because I couldn't imagine a box or two for a neighbor would produce much income.

    Anyhow I can't believe it would be a viable business - wouldn't liability insurance be outrageous???

    Anyone out here do this for living?? Just curious - not wanting to reload for $$ just find it interesting.

    Thanks!
     
  2. buenhec

    buenhec Member

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    I know a few people who do it. I have had people ask me to but I really don't want that responsability. Accidents can and will happen.
     
  3. scrat

    scrat Member

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    you would need to obtain a federal firearms license. Then you would need a huge insurance policy. Not something you could get into for part time. that would be one of those things you get into all the way or nothing.
     
  4. AMBASSADOR

    AMBASSADOR Member

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    Sounds as if they are illegally manufacturing ammunition,pay attention to these letters B.A.T.F.E.
     
  5. AMBASSADOR

    AMBASSADOR Member

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    Sounds as if they are illegally manufacturing ammunition illegally ,pay attention to these letters B.A.T.F.E.
     
  6. strat81

    strat81 Member

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    In addition to the ATF and an ammo FFL, you'll need to contend with local laws regarding zoning of businesses.
     
  7. PowderApe

    PowderApe Member

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    plenty of guys do it--- just go to any decent sized local gunshow and there will usually be a booth or two peddling ammo.

    My buddy and I picked up some reloads and they were cheaper than store bought. Bulk boxes of 250 loose rounds. They shot "ok"--- that is to say- they went BANG and a slug went downrange... we had a dud and we pulled it apart to do a ballistic "autopsy" and to our surprise- found 3 distinctively different powders inside! Round flake- like Bullseye / Unique type; small flakes like 2400 and extruded rods like IMR rifle stuff!! We opened up another to check it out and it had 4 types!! as above plus little ball type granules kinda like H380.

    We pulled the rest of mine apart (300 or so for me) and got rid of the powder. Reloaded the primed case with known good powder and plugged back in the 230 gr FMJ projectile (.45ACPs). Those plinkers shot fine... In the end, at least I got some cheap brass out of the deal

    My buddy decided foolishly (but uneventfully) shoot off his remaining 3 boxes of 250 rounds without incident. there were obvious variances in recoil and report tho- and they weren't very accurate and it was tough to tell if it was him, the gun or the ammo but I suspect the ammo. So overall, it wasn't a "deal" but a waste of $$ just to blow em off

    Saw the guy at another show and he told me the outfit was sold not long before and he bought it- including inventory- and the he was the new owner. the new guy blamed the old owner! Disavowed any liability and basically said "ToughSh*t"... If something were to happen, I'm sure he'd just fold up shop and bail...

    Caveat Emptor!

    Simply put: Don't buy other people's reloads.... or at least buy from someone reputable and pay the higher price which includes liability insurance (which is probably pretty high for them, too!)

    "License? License??? We don neeed no stinkin' license"
     
  8. evan price

    evan price Member

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    If you wish to manufacture ammunition (other than for a Destructive Device) you need an 06 FFL for that. BATFE is really looking for guys who do that, too, and not to give them a pat on the back.

    Let me put it this way- there are significant potential problems for an unlicensed manufacturer vis-a-vis the BATFE, not to mention the personal liability resulting from any accident or misuse of the product.

    There are always those looking for a quick buck who don't care about liability- but would you seriously want to buy a product like ammo from aguy whose entire business ethic is to say, screw it, if I cock it up I'll just fold up and move away? Makes you real confident in his product!

    I always say- I don't shoot other people's reloads.
     
  9. OLD DOMENION

    OLD DOMENION Member

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    Making money reloading

    In order to sell your ammo. you have to have a Manufacturers License with the BATF. There is also, a MILLION DOLLAR LIABILITY requirement.

    The easies way to make a little money is to show the people how to reload and then, rent/let them RELOAD THEIR OWN ammo.
     
  10. DEDON45

    DEDON45 Member

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    I might reload a box for a close friend, no charge (I have a friend that also reloads, but he doesn't care to reload small pistol calibers... I'm getting him a carbide die set as a gift here before long!) ... but if anyone wants quantity, my policy is that I'll show them how to do it themselves on my equipment, and encourage them to get their own setup.
     
  11. MMCSRET

    MMCSRET Member

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    I have a class 06 and have since 1997, I do load new and reloaded ammo for sale. For the most part it is a hobby that pays for itsself and buys me a gun once in a while. I built up a loyal clientel in my area and some have been with me since the first day I got my license. There is no requirement for insurance in my state for this. When I got my 06 in '97 I had 42 years experience loading ammo and had run production camdex style loading machinery so I had an idea about how to do it right. I load on a Lee Loadmaster and 3 single stage presses. I do not load a lot of any one caliber but I load a few boxes of 142 calibers. All rifle is loaded on the single stage presses and done one at a time. I enjoy it, but when NCIS comes on I go watch it. There is not a television or telephone in the loading room. My biggest and most loyal customers are 3 sheriffs in the surrounding counties. Be careful and it will work. Be very selective of you customers.
     
  12. strat81

    strat81 Member

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    That's a lot of calibers. If I could name 50 cartridges, I'd be surprised.
     
  13. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    A State "requirement" for liability insurance, or not.

    If someone foolishly blows up a gun somehow and gets hurt, who do you think the guys lawyer is gonna come after first?

    I wouldn't reload and try to sell it on a bet, without product liability insurance out the kazoo!

    My wife would be very upset with me if we ended up homeless at our age!

    rcmodel
     
  14. strat81

    strat81 Member

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    Rcmodel makes a good point about liability. That also raises the issue of making sure you set up an s-corp or LLC to shield your personal assets.

    If someone is disfigured or loses a hand or eye because of your ammo, I don't care WHO it is, they're gonna want money.
     
  15. zxcvbob

    zxcvbob Member

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    You just incorporate the business, and make sure the corporation has little or no assets. You still get liability insurance, but that's so you can do the right thing for your customers if Something Goes Terribly Wrong, you won't really need it to protect yourself.

    All the more reason not to try to go into reloading as a side business. Do it as a hobby for yourself, or go into it like a real business. ("Hybrid model" doesn't work very well) :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2008
  16. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Even if it wasn't caused by your ammo, they are still gonna want money!

    Just ask any of the big firearms companies who have been bled almost dry with frivolous lawsuits through the years.

    rcmodel
     
  17. MMCSRET

    MMCSRET Member

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    On the insurance question, I stated that there was no requirement for it. I did not state that I did not have it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And I did not state How I was organized, I get the impression that some posters assume a lot of negatives.
     
  18. strat81

    strat81 Member

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    I get the impression some posters think we're talking about them, when the comments were directed to the OP. ;) :)
     
  19. gandog56

    gandog56 Member

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    And I'll bet all them guys selling them at the gunshows have a license to do so. Non moving targets are easier to hit.
     
  20. Galil5.56

    Galil5.56 Member

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    Never did it for a living, but 25 years ago while I was in high school, I made a tidy bit of spending money around deer season selling 30/30 and 06 ammo.

    Yeah, I guess looking back now it seems "risky", but somehow the world seemed different. For Gods sake we had deer rifles in the cars for after school hunting, not mass shootings, and you could even walk around the neighborhood with a rifle slung w/o people calling the cops.

    Not that being careful with liability is a bad move, just that I'm frickin sick of billboard warning labels, integral gun locks, wimpy reloading data, and most of all a lack of personal responsibility, slimy lawyers, and juries in certain areas that let them spew their venom. Not that the "tough sh%t" answer will fly, but I like the sentiment.
     
  21. evan price

    evan price Member

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    In a better world, people would realize that stuff happens, that you should know not to stick your arm in a lawn mower with the engine running, without some lawyer sticker telling you not to.

    Personal Responsibility!!!!

    However, if someone is doing something with a gross disregard for safety and accepted practices of the industry, then they deserve to take responsibility for what they did if it hurts someone else.
     
  22. borntwice

    borntwice Member

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    Fark the BATF nazis. They are owned by the Council on American-Islamic Relations, in my humble opinion (as is most of the rest of the U.S. government). Ohhh! I said the unthinkable! Oh, well! At least I have an opinion, and my heart pumps red American blood. These people would sell their grandmother to make a buck!
     
  23. MMCSRET

    MMCSRET Member

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    When I asked about insurance the general consensus was that it would be impossible east of the Mississippi. However in the Northern Great Plains,ND,SD, MT, and WY and Idaho and Utah, NM and Arizona it could be done relatively easily due to the nature of the product and the very high(proportionately) population % that owns and shoots.
     
  24. zxcvbob

    zxcvbob Member

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    The key to making this work is limiting liability. I tried to point this out earlier. Once you do that, insurance is just icing on the cake. They can sue your business (but not you personally) and potentially get a judgement to seize all the assets of the corporation -- but the corporation doesn't have any significant assets so they are SOL.

    IMHO that is why you are morally obligated to have some liability insurance, but probably not as high a limit as you might be thinking -- perhaps $1000000? It shouldn't be too expensive.
     
  25. SSN Vet

    SSN Vet Member

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    First or last....they will only go after the entity/person with deeeeep pockets.

    Ever tried to retain a lawyer to sue somebody? It's not quite as easy as Judge Judy might make you think. The only way your going to get a lawyer to spend his time talking to you is if you....

    (1) Plop down some significant cash (that you never expect to see again).

    or..

    (2) Have a reasonable case and an offending party with deep pockets.

    When Mr. I. Chase Ambulances, Esq. sees that the "offending" party is Mr. Modest means, he's not going to waste his time taking the case on a percentage. Because.....50% of zero is still zero.

    Setting up as an LLC or Corporation. is smart, but even if you don't, you can file for bankruptcy and keep pretty much everything you have.

    My wife runs her own business and I set her up as an LLC taxable as an S-Corp. for tax purposes, and to create a means to buy fully deductable health insurance (I can legitimately claim to be her employee, as I'm a registered agent of the LLC and authorized signator on the business checking) as it only takes two people to qualify for group rates.

    As far as all the "internet shock and awe" advice about liability insurance. Have you guys ever gone out and bought any. Years ago when I was inbetween jobs, I did landscaping and light excavation to put food on the table. Every customer required proof of liability insurance and I easilly picked up a million dollars in coverage for about $200.

    I'll bet ya a DD coffee that both roofers and loggers pay higher rates than Joe Homebody reloading in his basement.

    Insurance is all about the numbers and I suspect most gun accidents are easilly attributed to other casues than using reloaded ammo.

    There's a certain "Hutspha" required to go into any business and my $.02 is that you either "do it" or you "don't", but don't "play around."
     
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