milwaukee police chief

Discussion in 'Legal' started by turbojohn41, Apr 22, 2009.

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  1. turbojohn41

    turbojohn41 Member

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    milwaukee police chief Ed Flynn said his officers will put you on the ground and in cuffs and then ask questions about why you are carrying. wisconsin D.A. von hollen said its leagel but milwaukee is still going to treat you like a criminal. can they be sued? doyle has to go so we can get concealed carry.
     
  2. Deanimator

    Deanimator member

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    Purely a function of state law.

    Ohio is an open carry state and has preemption.

    If a cop were to do that here, for no other reason than lawful open carry or lawful concealed carry, he'd be as good as signing his house over to you. There are a few stupid enough to do it, but only a few. Now's not a good time to be doing things that could get you fired or cause you to not have money to pay your mortgage, and most cops here seem to realize it.
     
  3. rbernie
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    rbernie Contributing Member

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  4. Phatty

    Phatty Member

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    The Milwaukee police chief just opened himself up to a flurry of lawsuits. He handed future plaintiffs their case on a silver platter by telling the media he was going to ignore the law and do what he wanted. A smart anti-gun cop would have kept his opinions to himself, harrassed every open-carrier in Milwaukee, and then in a lawsuit claim that they were acting in good faith. Instead, the plaintiff can waive the newspaper article in front of the jury, and the case is over.
     
  5. damien

    damien Member

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    Why not a march with a bunch of guys, media, and a bunch of video cameras? Pearson in Illinois would have this going next week.

    Is there a state rifle association up there in Wisconsin or not?

    I'd be happy to come up there and join you. How about a guy OCing both with a handgun and a slung Springfield M1A as a kicker? Downtown rally and march, right past the federal building, city hall, and downtown cop shop, assuming Milwaukee has all of these.

    The week afterwards, repeat in Madison.
     
  6. Husker_Fan

    Husker_Fan Member

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    I don't believe the A.G.'s memo carries the force of law. It explains how his office interprets a statute. The city attorney may reach the opposite conclusion (and be wrong), and that is what the local PD will rely on. It won't be resolved till someone challenges a disorderly conduct charge based on OC.
     
  7. highorder

    highorder Member

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    Wow.

    Can someone remind this guy that he has peace officers, not troops?

    While were doing that, can we explain to him that he doesn't get to decide who has what rights?
     
  8. turbojohn41

    turbojohn41 Member

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  9. Husker_Fan

    Husker_Fan Member

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    I realize he won with the trial court. It will take a ruling from the state supreme court to sort it out.
     
  10. Phatty

    Phatty Member

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    I agree with you there, so the police chief should have said something like, "I respectfully disagree with the A.G.'s interpretation of the law. My view, and our city attorney's view is that open carrying is disorderly conduct in all circumstances." Instead, he bone-headedly said, "I don't care what the law is, I'm going to instruct my officers to do what I think is best."
     
  11. Old Fuff

    Old Fuff Member

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    Well he may have a problem if the officer does, "put them on the ground, take the gun away and then decide whether you have a right to carry it,” and then finds they're isn't enough cause to support a disorderly conduct charge. Chief Braindead should first see what the City Attorney's thoughts are.

    There are a fair number of hungry lawyers that would love to have an opportunity to separate the City of Milwaukee for some of its money. While an Attorney General’s Opinion may not have legal standing, a judge might take it under consideration when awarding punitive damages. :uhoh:
     
  12. cbrgator

    cbrgator Member

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    If the residents of Milwaukee go about this the right way, the police department is in for one hell of a ride.
     
  13. damien

    damien Member

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    Is there a Wisconsin rifle association? Why not set up a march? Maybe the police chief can make a nice donation to his "enemies"?
     
  14. Speer

    Speer Member

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    Troops?
     
  15. mbt2001

    mbt2001 Member

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    What an idiot... First off they are policemen, not troops. Second off he and the rest of the officers work for the PEOPLE of Milwaukee. Thirdly, if there is nothing in the law to allow you to detain the person IT IS UNLAWFUL DETAINMENT. Since the law allows open carry and 4th amendment protections, then there isn't anything he can do that is legal. In fact, what he just said is coercion / intimidation...
     
  16. LaBulldog

    LaBulldog Member

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    Once a person is detained, placed in handcuffs and, in this case placed on the ground to further restrict their mobility (liberty), they are technically under arrest. The key here is that their freedom of movement has been taken away from them. Once that is done, they must be Mirandized before any questions are asked.

    So here we have a case of a guy legally carrying a gun, being handcuffed, placed on the ground, denied his liberty being asked questions. What if he tells the cop he is invoking his 5th Amendment rights to silence and demands an attorney present during questioning? Does he go to jail? Is he charged with something? If so, what?

    I understand that the police officers want to be safe while questioning someone. But there are better ways of disarming someone and checking them out.
     
  17. mbt2001

    mbt2001 Member

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    Disarming... Thomas Jefferson and Madison are collectively rolling in their graves.

    Does safety necessitate the action though? I mean, how long is it before we all have to bow down with public officials walk down the street so that they will feel safe?
     
  18. cbrgator

    cbrgator Member

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    This is the best way to challenge the police. Cause them to violate the 4th,5th,and 6th Amendments once or twice and take them to court... They'll stop. Yes sir they'll stop. Whatever shooting associations are in Wisconsin need to get their Milwaukee residents walking around OC on the streets. Make a stand. It will be so easy to prove it was malicious in light of the chief's comments.
     
  19. Matt-J2

    Matt-J2 Member

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    I knew something like this was going to happen. Maybe it will become some odd blessing in disguise.
     
  20. G.E. Lee

    G.E. Lee Member

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    What kind of a Police Chief exclaims, " I don't care what the law says..." ?
     
  21. Fisherman_48768

    Fisherman_48768 Member

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    Chief need new job

    Definitely one that needs a demotion to working for the sewer department, I'd say dog catcher but that takes a reasonable amount of intelligence and understand of the laws.
     
  22. wheelgunslinger

    wheelgunslinger Member

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    The vernacular gives a fair view into his mindset, I guess.

    They have the WGO up there. They should get people going for a march through Madison with cameras rolling.


    I wonder if that chief would tackle Tito Ortiz if he was open carrying and wrestle him to the ground?
     
  23. irishsquid

    irishsquid Member

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    Guilty until proven innocent. Nice. I wonder how long it will take to get your gun back. Something tells me it won't be immediately returned.

    Got me. Gestapo? KGB?
     
  24. Dark Skies

    Dark Skies Member

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    “A lot of people who get guns and carry guns don’t always understand the responsibility and risk that goes with gun ownership,” Helmke said. “People get drunk, people get angry, people make mistakes. More guns generally mean more violence.”

    Patronizing twit. I was under the impression it was illegal to enter a bar with a firearm (unless you're a cop) anyhow. So how are they to get served alcohol in an open carry scenario anyway?
     
  25. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    Depends on what state you're in. In a fair number of states (like Pennsylvania where I live :)) it's no problem. In Wisconsin, I'm guessing that it is a problem. Of course, lots of drinking happens in places other than bars, so it's kind of a moot point.

    -Sam
     
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