Mixed Loads for Self-defense/Wilderness-defense carry?

[WisBorn]

I was watching a Buffalo Bore video withTim Sundels on 357mag options today. He mentioned that he will load his revolvers with 2 rounds of hollow points (softs) followed by 4 hardcast loads.
I was thinking that would be a good idea while hiking in the wilderness. Say your in a National Park. Your biggest threat is humans. Then 4 legged critters.

Of course you can load your semiautomatic pistols in the same way. 2 or 3 SD loads then hardcast.

What are your thoughts about this method?

 

[EMC45]

For sure. Also have known folks to load first one or 2 snake shot as well. I wouldn’t take long to get past the snake shot getting to the solids or HPs

 

[AUhiker]

I’ve watched several of Tim’s videos as well, such a nice view of Idaho mountains with the fireplace. He makes a very good compelling argument about his choice of ammo carry. If I was near Idaho or Montana in the grizzly country I would do the same. Heck probably not a bad idea when camping or out about hiking in the woods even when not in grizzly country. I think he’s spot on when he says the danger for bystanders is from misses rather than over penetration. Here in the south where I roam there’s no grizzlies so I choose a good deep penetrating hollow point bullet. Critical duty rounds get really good penetration and some expansion. I’ve settled on that round it works in my neck of the woods for my needs, as well as in the city. Plus I can train and practice with just one load and get competent with it.

Do I disagree with his choices? Absolutely not, I think it has merit and I’m sure he’s making those decisions based off way more knowledge than I will ever have. I hope he keeps the videos up I’ve been enjoying them.

 

[fastbolt]

Not after my LE career and training.

It may be a non-issue for reasonable use-of-deadly-force in the real world, but why give any prosecutor or plaintiff's attorney (in either criminal of civil jurors), something which may be used to portray me as someone looking to make my ammunition loadout out of the ordinary? Reducing unnecessary exposure to potential problems.

Folks ought to be able to choose as they wish, of course, but I prefer to keep in mind that sometimes a seemingly simple choice may require some extra time and money (legal fees) to address and resolve if things end up in front of jurors. If someone wishes some legal advice about such things, they can always go buy some.

 

[Kleanbore]

I do not like the idea.

 

[FL-NC]

It makes more sense to me to carry the gun and round for the most dangerous threat in an area. So if you are carrying a dirty harry magnum because there are grizzly bears or dragons or whatever the apex predator is in the area, wouldn't the dragon killing round be sufficient for a human threat?

 

[jmr40]

I carry a semi-auto and 2 magazines. 9mm, 10mm, 40 S&W or 45 ACP depending on my mood and location. One is loaded with HP anti-personal rounds, the other with heavy for caliber hardcast bear loads. I insert the magazine most appropriate for where I am and have the other as a spare.

 

[.45Coltguy]

Hmmm. Think I've mentioned this before, not sure. When outdoors[ camping, trout fishing, etc.], I carry one of my .45 Colt revolvers loaded with 8.0gr Unique, 250gr coated rnfp bullets. Here in the Eastern Sierra's its pretty much Black bears, which are usually not a problem, possibly mountain lions, so, I feel pretty good about things. Especially if the fishing is good!

 

[bangswitch]

Let's say you load the same way Tim did in his videos. You have the need to shoot.....whatever the threat is, and use all six rounds. If you have to shoot something that many times, I don't see much point in a couple of different types of bullet, whether it stops the threat or not. If six rounds correctly placed don't stop the threat, the type of bullet isn't really going to matter much. If six rounds stops the threat, how do you know it made a difference that two were JHP and the others were monolithic?

I take a large enough caliber with me that JHP's should work. I'm still working on how to shoot accurately behind me as I run like hell away from the threat.

 

[.38 Special]

Honestly, I think hunting bullets and cartridges are generally better "manstoppers" than are the "light and fast" hollowpoints sold as defensive rounds. Or, put another way, I would rather hit a deer with a 325 grain flatnose from a hot .45 Colt than with a 115 grain hollow point from a 9mm.

The trouble, of course, is that the .45 is a lot harder to conceal under city clothes, and that the bullet will sail right through my attacker - and drywall, and car doors, and so on.

Wilderness carry obviates all of that. I can now carry my gigantic revolver, and forget my worries about car doors. So why would I then handicap myself by loading the first few chambers with an inferior bullet?

 

[d2wing]

It makes more sense to me to carry the gun and round for the most dangerous threat in an area. So if you are carrying a dirty harry magnum because there are grizzly bears or dragons or whatever the apex predator is in the area, wouldn't the dragon killing round be sufficient for a human threat?

I agree with this. Some folks are just too clever for real life.

 

[Boattale]

My 686 always has full power 158 semi jacketed flat point hardcast in it. Regulated to 25 yards. And by always, I mean 100% of the time. I've got other stuff available in the safe but honestly, I might as well give it away. The gun likes what's in it and so do I.

 

[shafter]

It makes no sense to mix loads. If I'm out in the wilderness and dangerous game is my concern I'm going to load for that. In the event I'm attacked by a human threat I'll just shoot with what's in the gun. It's not going to matter. If I only get two shots off at something large and dangerous I want those rounds to count.

 

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

Recall discussions on pattern loading a revolver for SD. A couple of light load to get on target and show them you mean business, then heavy loads if they inists on being stubborn.

 

[Pat Riot]

Years ago I used to put 2 rounds of snake shot in my revolvers then the rest HP or hard cast cartridges for outdoors adventure.

One day I decided to carry my Glock 9mm to try a new holster. I found myself debating on how I should load the gun. Snake shot, a couple of HP then some flat point jacketed?… I decided to skip the snake shot altogether and load out for the most dangerous threat I could encounter. Humans.

All my years out west were spent in mountain lion and black bear country except for a few excursions into possible brown bear country.
A round that will kill a bad guy or girl will kill a mountain, psychotic deer and perhaps even a one in a million black bear.

So, my answer is just load for your biggest perceived danger. Also, don’t forget that bug repellant for the most harmful creatures you will probably encounter.

 

[Ks5shooter]

No mixing here,load for biggest threat and all will be well.

 

[herrwalther]

I would not mix either. If I am carrying different ammo in the brush for different threats, they will be in different magazines.

When I mow my yard I put two or three snakeshot rounds in a firearm. Because that is the biggest I expect to run across while mowing. If there was more coyote/bear threat, I would carry a magazine with the appropriate ammo in the firearm instead.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

Based on actual threat, my woods walking load for revolver is first up snakeshot, the rest jacketed hollowpoint. Biggest fear is snake, followed by coyote then bear.
For a while I did carry a CZ-52 loaded with alternating full metal jacket and hollowpoint 7.62x25mm when I was ATVing in the woods.

 

[GEM]

Why wouldn't the hard cast in 357 be effective against a human? Also, in the woods, over penetration seems not the risk. Given a charging animal, will you have time to get to the later rounds? As far as snake shot, I can see that but when I went hunting, I threw a NAA Mini revolver with 22 Mag snake shot in my pocket. I assume I didn't have to do a lightning fast draw for a snake and pockets aren't that slow.

 

[Boattale]

About snake shot: If I've got time to shoot the snake, I've also got time to walk away.

Now any venomous snake around my place is in trouble. But out and about where I'm not likely to ever see that snake again? I'm chill then.

 

[WisBorn]

I thought I should share the video of Tim when he made the comment about the mixed loading. (Part 2)

PART 2 COMPREHENSIVE 357 magnum & 38 Special use from carbines to short barreled revolvers & between

This series of videos, will likely be a four or five part series in order to cover this most useful cartridge.

youtu.be

I included part one incase you are interested.

PART 1 COMPREHENSIVE 357 magnum & 38 Special use from carbines to short barreled revolvers & between

This series of videos, will likely be a four or five part series in order to cover this most useful cartridge. This is Part 1.

youtu.be

 

[WisBorn]

I personally have never loaded my carry with mixed loads. I agree with most of the comments including everything from the legal to the biggest threat.
While traveling I will carry a magazine or speed strip of expanding bullets and one of hardcast. This also doubles as my reload. I will hike with hardcast and when in town I carry the HPs. A good Hollow Point can handle both tasks.

I found Tim's comments interesting, so I felt it would make for good conversation.

Shot and snake loads! Snakes creep me out, but I don't just kill them to get rid of them. The only exception is close to the house. The strange thing is most of the snakes I have seen in my yard have been While mowing the lawn. Snakes do not fair well against fast moving cutting blades

 

[Jim Watson]

The only time I ever mixed loads was when my only serious weapon was a 1911 and the only expansive bullets on the market were Norma and Super Vel. Neither would feed in that USGI, so it went a good ways with a hollowpoint in the chamber and ball in the magazine.

I am pretty much a city slicker and the only dangerous animal I am at all likely to encounter is a mean dog. For which the same ammo as for a mean human should do well.

 

[Charlie98]

or whatever the apex predator is in the area

+1

The right tool for the job at hand. Tromping around in a National Forest requires a different tool (bullet) than walking around in the Big City... maybe. For that matter, a completely different tool... I carry a big bore revolver when I'm up in the mountains, but a more concealable mid-bore (9mm) automatic when I'm in town.

 

[StrawHat]

Once I gave up wearing a badge, I have been carrying a revolver chambered for the 45 ACP, for everything. I use two bullets. A 235 wadcutter or a 235 grain Keith SWC, either is loaded over a hardball dose of powder. Where I live, it is sufficient for my needs. If I ever go back out West, I will up the powder charge to get 1100 fps.

The hardball load gives complete penetration on Ohio white tails.