National CCW for Animal Lovers

[Michael Zeleny]

Do you seriously expect your interpretation of Article 1 Section 9 of our Constitution to be upheld in any court of law in this land?

I'm not claiming SCOTUS agrees with me; for that matter, after Kelo and Raich I'm disinclined to guess what if anything they think the Constitution means. What I'm saying is that the law is dangerous and is in opposition to republican principles and the rule of law. Trying to get into the new "just like everyone else but better" class in this case is no better than joining the Baath party in Iraq.

Is it your contention that the Baath party in Iraq did nothing worse than try to get into the new "just like everyone else but better" class?

 

[Kurush]

Is it your contention that the Baath party in Iraq did nothing worse than try to get into the new "just like everyone else but better" class?

The Baath party in Iraq was the "just like everyone else but better" class. It is very alarming to me that this law creates in our nation such a class by giving certain citizens extra rights off-duty and not in furtherance of their job, and worse that those rights are retained after they have retired.

 

[artherd]

I think the idea here is to create a "Just like everyone else, but better" club that is infact OPEN TO ALL INTERESTED & CHAIRATIBLE NON-PROHIBITED PERSONS!

Circumvent the elitism by diluting the 'members only' club.

Fine, if only LEOs can carry nationally, let's make every voulenteer non-felon a LEO if they want.


Regarding HR218, we need to look at the definition of 'employee'. Do they seek full-time employees or is a paltry part-time salary acceptible so long as we get W2s?

 

[Michael Zeleny]

Originally Posted by Michael Zeleny
… after beating weapons charges on two occasions in the Los Angeles Superior Court …

Do tell.

In 1990 I got the prosecutor to drop knife charges under P.C. Section 626.10 by explaining that I used my Randall #14 and Lile button lock folder in preparation and consumption of food. Two years ago I beat multiple weapons carry charges in a bench trial, by establishing that my 7" Darrel Ralph folding dagger was not a switchblade under P.C. Section 653k, whereas my carry of a SIG P210-2 was justified as a reasonable countermeasure against death threats under the predicates of the necessity defense. Got my knives back in the first instance, lost my weapons and spent $3,000 in legal fees getting exonerated in the second matter.

However, your idea sounds like as much if not more work than simply becoming a cop and would probably be equally dissatisfying.

Level I and II reserve officers in most, if not all, California police departments are both paid and authorized to carry arms on, and usually off duty. Most reserve deputy sheriffs are issued CCW permists that enable them to carry concealed weapons off duty. I would expect the commitment to service in the reserve humane officer program that I am proposing to equal or exceed those of a reserve member of a law enforcement agency, with rates of pay ranging somewhat closer to the $1 per year paid by to reserve deputies by the California Sheriffs, than the $15-$25/hour or thereabouts paid to reserve police officers by local police agrncies. It's all a matter of whether you would rather rescue animals than lock up criminals.

 

[Michael Zeleny]

Is it your contention that the Baath party in Iraq did nothing worse than try to get into the new "just like everyone else but better" class?

The Baath party in Iraq was the "just like everyone else but better" class. It is very alarming to me that this law creates in our nation such a class by giving certain citizens extra rights off-duty and not in furtherance of their job, and worse that those rights are retained after they have retired.

You have failed to answer my question. Please try again. Do you believe that the Baath party in Iraq did nothing worse than serve as the "just like everyone else but better" class?

 

[Kurush]

You have failed to answer my question. Please try again. Do you believe that the Baath party in Iraq did nothing worse than serve as the "just like everyone else but better" class?

First, that is not the question you asked. Second, your new question is irrelevant and off-topic. Third, you are very presumptuous and rude, especially considering that you didn't address my objection to your plan in any way. I see that arguing with you is pointless and so I will desist. Have a nice day and plonk.

 

[gunsmith]

I remember this plan

What came of it?
it sure seems like a good idea.

 

[Michael Zeleny]

You have failed to answer my question. Please try again. Do you believe that the Baath party in Iraq did nothing worse than serve as the "just like everyone else but better" class?

First, that is not the question you asked. Second, your new question is irrelevant and off-topic. Third, you are very presumptuous and rude, especially considering that you didn't address my objection to your plan in any way. I see that arguing with you is pointless and so I will desist. Have a nice day and plonk.

First, this is the question that I asked, with emphasis on the point that made your analogy so offensive. Second, it is directly relevant to the topic, which is your attempt to tar me with the Saddamite brush for proposing to create a humane society that satisfies the predicates of a law enforcement agency per the H.R. 218. Third, although I am proverbially almost unbelievably rude, I am nowhere near presumptuous enough to play the fascist card without a proper warrant, especially after my interlocutor had addressed my objection with a reference to the principle that I claim to endorse.

I will spell out my response, not for your benefit, but for the sake of interested bystanders. Reacting to a political proposal with overheated rhetoric not only fails to respond to the substance of the matter, but also discredits the self-righteous party as being more enamored with his own demagoguery than either the duty to speak truly or the burden to advance the cause of justice. Nothing in my proposal involves or implies granting anything like a title of nobility. Even assuming for the sake of argument that I aimed to create a hereditary elite, it would be strictly my doing, and not an act of Congress forbidden by Article 1 Section 9 of our Constitution. Moreover, not every hereditary elite has the character of the Baath party, as opposed to that of the Lubavicher Rebbe. Finally, it is pointless to argue with anybody, until and unless you learn to abstain from flaming strawmen and changing the subject.

You have a right to object to the law of this land on the basis of a constitutional interpretation as unfounded in elementary logic, as it is devoid of legal acumen. You have no right to claim that everyone who fails to follow you in this futilitarian self-torment is therefore a fascist. Lighten up.

 

[Art Eatman]

What in (bleep) does the Baath Party have to do with trying to figure out a way to use California laws to one's benefit? Why drag in that sort of stuff?

Stay on topic!

Art

 

[Aguila Blanca]

No animal control officers in my state are authorized to carry weapons. Accordingly, "LEO" credentials notwithstanding, they do not qualify under H.R. 218.

I think this idea is idiotic. Sorry, but that's my opinion.

 

[ziadel]

are bounty hunters considered federal agents?

I only ask because I am pretty sure anyone can become a bounty hunter...