Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by redfin00, Jun 12, 2021.
Should be Berdan and should be just fine to shoot.
Hirtenberger has a reputation as excellent 7.62x51NATO.
And welcome to the monkey house!!!
Some boxes shoot better than others, so keep that in mind.
The primary difficulty in reloading berdan-primed cases is related to the decapping process(removing the expended primer cups from the cases).
Boxer-primed cases sport a single, centered flashhole so a centered decapping pin mounted in the resizing die does the trick.
Berdan cases feature 2 (and, rarely 3, I have read) flashholes so removal is not as simple. From what I have determined by investigating the subject, a hydraulic approach appears to be the most efficient decapping method, but I have yet to find a proper berdan case hydraulic decapper available for purchase in the States, so ...
Thanks for the video,researched a bit but never saw that one!Was in Visalia 2006-2008 on a job.Neat place,thanks. Again!
Most I have seen (illustrated) were home built.
A friend's .450 BPE came with a couple of boxes of Kynoch brass. Actually .450 Nitro, but the chamber is the same. There was one live round which he pulled, it would have been a large overload in the BPE, and there was one .500 mixed in with the .450s; so he had nine cases to start out with, eight of them fired.
We decapped them the low-tech way, clamp the sizing die upside down in a vise and dig the primer out with an awl driven into the indent at a flat angle to avoid hitting the anvil.
Correct size Berdan primers were available at the time, I don't know if they are now.
Fortunately, Bell was setting up for .450 and he bought a supply of those for Boxer primers and loading got a lot more convenient.
The few handloaders in England now seem dependent on US equipment but there used to be a small but innovative English industry. Wamadet made a little press that bridged the gap between hand and bench tools and the Prime press was said to be so powerful as to size .30-06 to 8x33 in one pass. Both were meant for small English houses, the Wamadet is small enough to store in a kitchen cabinet, its dies and accessories in a shoebox. The high leverage Prime came on a sturdy steel tripod you could set up next to a card table. Then set it in a corner and throw a drape over when not in use.
Prime had several designs of Berdan decappers.
The Hydro Punch put a nozzle through the case neck firmly against the flash hole so that a whack on its piston with a mallet would hydraulic decap with one drop of water.
The Power Punch set a nozzle against the flash hole and popped a primer, literally firing the spent primer out of its pocket. Using one primer to decap and one to reload made it a convenient but expensive approach.
There was also a pin decapping spindle for a sizing die. It had a collet holding two small pins, adjustable to match the distance between the Berdan flash holes. Left loose in its threads, you eased the case into the die and manipulated the decapping spindle to feel the pins into the holes. Then stroke the press to decap and size like a Boxer case.
Visalia's a nice town -- I used to drive down there pretty regularly during the mid-90s, when there was a neat downtown store selling militaria and firearms.
Both are good shooting surplus ammo.
I ordered some a while back and it was listed as 80s production Boxer primed and that's exactly what it is.
Huh. That ... is very interesting. Does the headstamp on that 80 Hirt bear the NATO mark? Just wondering if it is milsurp or a non-military-specific production.
I have unsuccessfully looked thru my invoices pile. Last time ordered a case of Hirt was, like, 15-16 years ago. At the time I had a ton (OK, maybe only half a ton ) of berdan milsurp 7.62x51Nato. The pricing was excellent if it came in boxer brass but not so much if it were berdan (reloader, dontchaknow).
I recall it was advertised as boxer-primed and, being skeptical of the claim, when it was delivered I immediately pulled a bullet to check. Berdan.
I am pretty sure that the headstamp was early 80s, possibly 80(?).
Now it sounds to me like the vendor (and I) may have inadvertently gotten caught between product changes. <sigh> Shouganai.
The ones I shot we’re good quality, with good quality brass that was boxer primed. Great for reloading
There was. Dude over on the M14 forum documents everything, and some of his data shows some Hirt as boxer primed. I would have to dig through his posts to see if it was NATO, but I don't know if there was anything but.
I ordered it from Aimsurplus back in January.
Their description of it on the order was:
Austrian Hirtenberger 7.62x51 400rd Can Milsurp on stripper clips and bandoliers
The page for it said it was 80s production Boxer primed Austrian surplus
FWIW, on a reasonably-priced (price/round) case of ammo, original stripper clips & bandoleers are usually considered to be a plus.
redfin00, I must confess to finding myself a bit nonplussed by all of the info being shared regarding Hirt being boxer-primed.
If I provided you with inaccurate information, I apologize.
I am beginning to wonder if the case of milsurp ammo about which I was thinking may have actually been either DAG or MEN headstamped. <sigh & smile> It was 15-16 years ago, after all, and I am afflicted with O.L.D. and have gone thru a lot of many different "flavors" of 7.62x51 ammo ... so not beyond the realm of possibility.
I just returned from my basement where I did a quick & rough inventory of my extant 7.62x51 milsurp ammunition. All that remains (in QTY) is British, Portuguese, S'thAfrican and Venezuelan(IIRC). No sign of Hirt or DAG or MEN.
I was surprised to find that I currently have less than 10k rounds on-hand which is OK since I have slowed down quite a bit.
ammunition showing this level of corrosion is dangerous to shoot. Old gunpowder does not burn nice and evenly, it is called burn rate instability and it has blown up weapons. Take a look at this video.
This is an interesting video that clearly shows the dangerous of old ammunition, and everyone who is involved in it, and everyone who has commented on it, none of them have any idea that old gunpowder will blow up weapons.
And the thing that jumped out to me were the immense fireballs, and finally the gun blew up.
The guy from Kentucky Ballistics says in the video that the “Slap round was very, very old”
And there you have it. Old ammunition with old gunpowder inside.
With ammunition as old as yours, shoot it up. Don't sit on it thinking it is going to get better with age, it won't
Sometimes, really new ammunition goes bad.
Separate names with a comma.