Need info on Caracal F
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Urban_Redneck
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First, the pistols are under recall for a reported drop safety issue. The importer is to exchange all existing pistols.
The initial trigger pull is much shorter than comparable pistols approx. 5/16", reset is positive, and maintains the same stroke length.
Ergos are great, the pistol sits very low in the hand, making it very comfortable to shoot fast and accurate follow-up shot.
Accuracy has been very good.
The standard front sight nearly fills the(non-replaceable) rear notch, a fiber optic front is now offered.
The slide stop/release is small, yet it is easy to engage.
The steel magazines drop free every time.
I have fired 4000+ rounds without a malfunction through my F including a 400 round training class. I also have a C model that's been malfunction free for 700+ rounds.
Recall aside, I am planning to stay with the pistols.
The initial trigger pull is much shorter than comparable pistols approx. 5/16", reset is positive, and maintains the same stroke length.
Ergos are great, the pistol sits very low in the hand, making it very comfortable to shoot fast and accurate follow-up shot.
Accuracy has been very good.
The standard front sight nearly fills the(non-replaceable) rear notch, a fiber optic front is now offered.
The slide stop/release is small, yet it is easy to engage.
The steel magazines drop free every time.
I have fired 4000+ rounds without a malfunction through my F including a 400 round training class. I also have a C model that's been malfunction free for 700+ rounds.
Recall aside, I am planning to stay with the pistols.
Tim the student
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There have been a couple of threads about them. IIRC, the reviews of people that have actually shot them are very positive.
wally
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Why?
They are paying the shipping both ways and throw in a spare magazine for your trouble upon return, in today's panic, that seems a really good deal!
Urban_Redneck
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If you find one, just buy it and register for the recall.
This morning, I beat my F with a dead blow hammer for 5 minutes trying to make it fire, it didn't.
I'll run a box or two through it tomorrow
This morning, I beat my F with a dead blow hammer for 5 minutes trying to make it fire, it didn't.
I'll run a box or two through it tomorrow
Chances are you won't pay full retail, as i figure retailers are probably not going to charge a premium for them. And there is a plus that you get a mag for the hassle. And there's the fact that they aren't "working" on them rather just sending a new one as a replacement.
But see, that's what I don't understand. There's already a recall on the pistol, but they are still being sold in a defective condition to a consumer who may or may not send the defective pistol back so that it can be repaired or replaced. Why aren't they correcting the problem at the retail level so that defective pistols aren't being sold to consumers? There might be a good reason, I just can't see it, but it seems sort of bizarre to me.
Or I just don't understand the recall specifics....
Or I just don't understand the recall specifics....
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It's probably because it isn't a mandatory recall or something to that effect. I think Caracal is doing this voluntarily and not being required to initiate the recall. From what I understood it is a theoretical issue that hasn't led to any real incident.
I consider it a win win for the retailer and the buyer. They can "take one of the hands" of a retailer for cheap and either keep a fully functional great shooting firearm or send it in for a different new one not subject to a recall and get a free mag for the hassle.
This way there is no work (paperwork, shipping, inventory, etc) for a retailer. A mandatory recall at the retailer level could result in the end of a business relationship for a new broker in the biz.
I consider it a win win for the retailer and the buyer. They can "take one of the hands" of a retailer for cheap and either keep a fully functional great shooting firearm or send it in for a different new one not subject to a recall and get a free mag for the hassle.
This way there is no work (paperwork, shipping, inventory, etc) for a retailer. A mandatory recall at the retailer level could result in the end of a business relationship for a new broker in the biz.
el Godfather
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I really like the pistol. However this recall and drop safety issue has got me thinking.
I agree with Fremer that defective pistol should not be sold. I rather buy the extra mag with the comfort of knowing pistol is in awesome condition rather then issue that may injure or kill someone.
I agree with Fremer that defective pistol should not be sold. I rather buy the extra mag with the comfort of knowing pistol is in awesome condition rather then issue that may injure or kill someone.
Urban_Redneck
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I've yet to see, or hear report of a pistol in the US with serial # that doesn't begin with B, C, F, L, or M. So, effectively the recall encompasses ALL Caracal pistols in the US.
From Caracal USA:
The above could be read either way I suppose...
I put another 100 rounds though my fullsize yesterday... If I spot another F, I'll likely buy it
How is that relevant? I could say the same thing, but then again, I've only noted the serial number on one pistol--the one I own.
I guess what I'm getting at is:
1. Of the Caracal pistols in the U.S. what percentage of them have you seen, and/or what percentage of the Caracal pistols in the U.S. have you received reports on that include the beginning letter of the serial number?
2. If all of the pistols in the U.S. are affected, why would they bother to list the serial numbers? Wouldn't it just be easier to say that all Caracal pistols in the U.S. are affected?
"...Caracal USA, LLC is advising its customers that it has determined that the production tolerances in the grip frames of a very limited number of Caracal F and C pistols..."
This statement makes it sound very unlike "ALL Caracal pistols in the US" are affected.
Perhaps, but this is hard to read any way but one.
"Only the Caracal F and C pistols with the serial numbers identified above are affected by this recall. If your pistol has a different serial number, it is not subject to the recall."
Urban_Redneck
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I don't understand what has your knickers in such a twist...
As the happy owner of two pistols with an investment in mags and holsters I have been following this issue and recall since day one. I've checked the Caracal boards nearly every day for the past 9 months, and have yet to read of any serial # beginning with a letter other than those listed for recall. IIRC, there was even a gent in the Philippines had an "affected" serial #.
Of course the Corporate recall statement is crafted to not only to convey the pertinent info but, also to reassure. It would be less reassuring and less descriptive if "all the pistols must be returned" was the statement. No doubt they'd still get calls from folks insisting that they bought their gun from billyjoebob who had some "special line into Caracal".
Likewise, folks who want their particular pistol back have been advised that process will take several months as the pistols will be returned to the UAE for evaluation and remediation. I am under the distinct impression that this will be a straight swap.
Enough semantics. How long have you had yours, how many rounds?
Peace
As the happy owner of two pistols with an investment in mags and holsters I have been following this issue and recall since day one. I've checked the Caracal boards nearly every day for the past 9 months, and have yet to read of any serial # beginning with a letter other than those listed for recall. IIRC, there was even a gent in the Philippines had an "affected" serial #.
Of course the Corporate recall statement is crafted to not only to convey the pertinent info but, also to reassure. It would be less reassuring and less descriptive if "all the pistols must be returned" was the statement. No doubt they'd still get calls from folks insisting that they bought their gun from billyjoebob who had some "special line into Caracal".
Likewise, folks who want their particular pistol back have been advised that process will take several months as the pistols will be returned to the UAE for evaluation and remediation. I am under the distinct impression that this will be a straight swap.
Enough semantics. How long have you had yours, how many rounds?
Peace
It's Clintonian concept 'some' is less damaging then 'all'. There were claims of passing most stringent tests is Germany? and now 'all'??? pistols sent to US are on recall. In terms of pressure this is MEGA-tonnage. Quite honestly
I do not know if all or some have been recalled because I do not know what serial ranges came over and I will not be part of the recall process.
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These are just tools like any polymer framed pistols and free $25+/-5 item isn't worth the bother. I would buy something else that was not subject to recall.
And I don't understand why you would think that they are in a twist.
You made a claim that is clearly inconsistent with the information Caracal USA has provided and I'm merely trying to determine if your claim can be supported with fact, and if so, how.
I think we can agree that the claim that all pistols in the U.S. are affected is not at all consistent with Caracal's claim that a "very limited number of Caracal F and C pistols" are affected.
Furthermore, no one's provided a plausible reason why Caracal would go to the trouble to list serial numbers if they could simply state that all pistols in the U.S. are affected. Certainly they would know which pistols have been sold in the U.S. given that they are required to maintain such records by law.
I'm not familiar with those forums, does everyone who signs on to them list their serial numbers up front so the percentage of pistols affected can be determined?
Hardly. As explained, I'm merely trying to figure out how to take two conflicting reports, one from Caracal and the other from Urban_Redneck, and makes sense of the contradiction.
Urban_Redneck
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I'm not disputing the company statement: "a small number of pistols are affected". I don't expect we'll ever know how many pistols have out of spec frames.
The crux of the biscuit is:
A) My contention that all the US imports are represented by the B, C, F, L, and M serial range.
B) Caracal USA (once the recall gets started!) will be exchanging all returned pistols, rather than evaluating each one.
Of course if a single pistol in the US, is outside the B, C, F, L, or M serial range I am wrong
I can live with that
The crux of the biscuit is:
A) My contention that all the US imports are represented by the B, C, F, L, and M serial range.
B) Caracal USA (once the recall gets started!) will be exchanging all returned pistols, rather than evaluating each one.
Of course if a single pistol in the US, is outside the B, C, F, L, or M serial range I am wrong
I can live with that
Rob21sf
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Caracal
I just picked up my second Caracal this time the F QS model and it's even "Waffen Werks" marked the orginal importer. I personally believe recalls either happen because of "minor" flaws that are found on newly released models or it's a way for Manufacturers to get back certain models that maybe should have never left the factory!
Like what others have said, recall or no recall I am very happy with the Caracal pistols! I buy firearms to shoot and enjoy not to polish and showcase!
I just picked up my second Caracal this time the F QS model and it's even "Waffen Werks" marked the orginal importer. I personally believe recalls either happen because of "minor" flaws that are found on newly released models or it's a way for Manufacturers to get back certain models that maybe should have never left the factory!
Like what others have said, recall or no recall I am very happy with the Caracal pistols! I buy firearms to shoot and enjoy not to polish and showcase!
I have two questions regarding the Caracal, thought I'd add them in here:
1) How easy is the magazine release to activate? I'm not asking about reach, but rather how much force is there required to activate the mag release? I've had some guns that were way too stiff under certain conditions (i.e. full mag).
2) What's the aftermarket support like? Holsters, for one, but also down the road I'd like to add a RDS to my pistol. I notice that the options available are usually just for Glock, M&P, and XD.
1) How easy is the magazine release to activate? I'm not asking about reach, but rather how much force is there required to activate the mag release? I've had some guns that were way too stiff under certain conditions (i.e. full mag).
2) What's the aftermarket support like? Holsters, for one, but also down the road I'd like to add a RDS to my pistol. I notice that the options available are usually just for Glock, M&P, and XD.
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