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Need knife suggestion

Discussion in 'Non-Firearm Weapons' started by buy guns, Feb 20, 2008.

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  1. buy guns

    buy guns Member

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    I'm finally starting to get paranoid enough about school shootings that it's distracting me in class because I end up day dreaming about it happening at my school. It's time to break the rules a little bit and start carrying a knife to class.

    I already have a 3" folding Buck knife that I keep in my car but I don't want to carry that because it's not assisted and, if god forbid I have to use it, I don't want to worry about fumbling as I try to open it.

    I've decided to go with a fixed blade. It has to be under 3" because my state is run by commies. I also want it to come with a horizontal sheath so I can wear it across my belt. Smaller is better as far as overall size...I have small hands anyway and it needs to be easily concealed on my skinny waist. I also want it to be flat black so it stands out less.

    The most important point is price. I would like to keep it under $50 if that is possible. I don't have much money to spend and I don't want to lose much if for some reason it ends up getting confiscated.

    I know nothing at all about knives. I don't know what brands are good, what prices are fair, where to order from, etc so any guidance is helpful.
     
  2. QuakKillz

    QuakKillz Member

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  3. RancidSumo

    RancidSumo Member

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  4. RancidSumo

    RancidSumo Member

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  5. sm

    sm member

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    Get a cane and limp a little.
    Remember you did trip over the dawg, and missed that step on the front porch the other day...

    20 oz bottle of Soda, is nice, and refilling with water from the water fountain is a great healthy drink to tote around campus.


    Those smaller staplers , about 5" , that you carry in a backpack to staple papers, I noticed how my extra lanyard for USB storage drive always got caught in that stapler...
    Cat 5e patch cords do too...


    Scissors allow one to cut paper, without having to go where there is a paper cutter...


    Tightly rolled up magazine , just seems like a nice something to hold like a worry stone, that de-stresses a person...


    It is nice some class rooms have a broom , or wooden dowel to reach the overhead monitor , as the remote never seems to work...


    Sorry about hearing you tripped over the dawg and missed a step, that cane will assist I am sure....

    *wink*
     
  6. JShirley

    JShirley Administrator Staff Member

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    I would not suggest you do something that could get you into trouble, especially when the tool you're considering is marginally effective for defense, anyway.

    The water bottle idea is a perfect one. While carrying a pocketknife is not illegal or restricted by the college I attend, there's a .5 L water bottle lying next to my right leg. And a strong key lanyard about 20", with a heavy "D ring" carabiner is clipped to my belt.

    Practice slamming a full bottle into things, to be sure you have good technique. Don't do this when others are watching, and especially never do this just to impress anyone.

    John
     
  7. CWL

    CWL Member

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    I've always liked soda cans. Harder than plastic soda bottles.

    Do you play a musical instrument? I've always thought a flute case would make a great club.

    Don't do anything illegal, with 100% no-tolerance nowadays, you will be subject to more than confiscation.
     
  8. ArfinGreebly

    ArfinGreebly Moderator Emeritus

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    Non-Compressible

    I'll go with the water bottle.

    Better grip, more mass, and water doesn't compress.

    It's not the container, it's the contents.

    When I'm about to go out for the day, and I feel the need of refreshment on the road, I take a water bottle that's been in the freezer overnight, half full. I fill the bottle the rest of the way up with liquid water, and I have cool refreshment for a good couple of hours. If I have to travel longer, I'll freeze 2/3 of the bottle. Some of the engineers I work with show up with the bottle 80% frozen, as they're gonna drink coffee most of the morning anyway, so they won't need the water till later.

    Your mileage, as usual, will vary.
     
  9. JShirley

    JShirley Administrator Staff Member

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    I used to use the frozen water in a bottle trick, when I worked for the CCC in Ohio.


    That was only 14 years ago!
     
  10. strambo

    strambo Member

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    School shootings get so much media attention because they are so rare. Common occurances don't get any attention at all. I wouldn't be paranoid about school shootings.

    The way to handle it is to hit the deck, crawl to cover, look around, escape when able. A knife isn't gonna help at all.
     
  11. JShirley

    JShirley Administrator Staff Member

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    ...and if you needed some "equalizing" in other school confrontations (much more likely) using a water bottle is going to look WAY better than a knife.
     
  12. CWL

    CWL Member

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    Ever since I saw the movie "Bad Boys" where Sean Penn put 3 (full) soda cans into a pillowcase and used it to beat the crap out of 2 people, I've always respected the full aluminum can.

    These can be swung and thrown and are pretty-much available on any school campus -probably elementary-thru-college. I think that they make convenient field expedient weapons.
     
  13. theken206

    theken206 Member

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    as someone who had a fast mouth and faster hands up untill I left HS and a little after, I spent a good time of my school career avoiding violence as well as inciting it.

    I carried a knife alot but mostly for before and after school and as a tool of course, not having anything to do with worrying about a random school shooting, but trying to carry a knife on you every day is not a good idea at all.

    What I suggest is LOTS of situational awareness. I am sure that every school shooting had some implied, vauge or outright knowlege of it amongst the students. Look and listent to what is going on around you.

    I saved myself from getting jumped more than once just by paying attention. Noticed a couple girls talking quitley in class once in my direction. It was the day after a confrontation with a friend of theres boyfriend. I walked up to the teachers desk and lolly gagged and asked some random question but I was really ease dropping. I heard I was to be jumped by a bunch of people at lunch yadda yadda.

    It gave me the upper hand and let me dictate the terms, allowing me to avoid violence all together. With a bit of help from the Art of War {when weak, appear strong, when enemy goes right go left, when strong, attack and/or force favorable terms} and my "rep". I avoided no less than three seperate groups of people looking to kick the living crap outta me, including defusing one of the situations all together, scaring off two older brother of a girl whose friend Id wronged the year before, avoiding a possible shooting, and other stuff.

    What im saying is, I carried a weapon of some sorts for years, be it a knife, a big fat math book, a HOT cup of coffee at lunch, glass pop bottles and metal energy drink bottles, a bike chain once, and some other random objects that seemed choice at the time{a big thick drum stick for once, never heard of any rules aginst drum sticks or say a hardwood one piece flute}.

    Only twice did I ever TRULY think about having to use one and that was all over the same incident, one that in retrospect could have been avoided im sure.

    The chance of you really needing a weapon are slim and not being able to avoid violence in what ever form it finds you in are, depending on your school and what type of person you are, would tend to be slim IMO out side of the "you meet me here and duh duh duh duh duh".
     
  14. mike101

    mike101 Member

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    Never bring a knife to a gun fight. ;)
     
  15. gunjunky

    gunjunky Member

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    Sorry to hear about your fall +1

    Does your school prohibit carry of a knife?

    If they do, don't, as what mike101 says is true. A knife is a very good defensive tool, but if you can close distance (as you need to be close) with a rifle or hand gun armed assailant and stab him. You are a better man than me!
     
  16. Joe Demko

    Joe Demko Member

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    I have a one liter lexan water bottle with a cute pink nylon sling. Got it at Gander Mountain for about $20. I like lexan because it is so durable. No matter how many times I accidentally bang the bottle into stuff, it doesn't crack or break. The sling is convenient for carrying, too. It's important to stay hydrated.
     
  17. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    The threat of a school shooting is infinitesimally small in the real world and becoming preoccupied isn't warranted unless you know more than you're indicating.


    Are you in college or high school? I ask because colleges don't typically prohibit knives, they usually follow the state weapons laws. Public schools, OTOH, do have zero tolerance rules for knives.

    Considering that the risk is nearly nonexistent and that knives make a relatively poor SD tool when compared to many other unregulated items you could carry out in the open, and that in a school shooting it would be nearly useless, you may want to reevaluate your needs.

    A nice knife makes a great tool that allows you to accomplish many tasks. There are plenty of other everyday items that make better SD tools.
     
  18. buy guns

    buy guns Member

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    Thanks everyone for the words of wisdom. I do constantly work on situational awareness as well as take notice of what around me can be used as weapons. The can idea is nice but there is no doubt I will need one when I am older so I would really like to not use one while I am still young.

    In terms of general defense, I really feel a knife is the best option for me, assuming I can't get avoid the situation all together. I'm a small person with a terribly short reach so if I were to use a blunt object I would most likely be within someone else's reach before they are within mine. If I had enough distance to throw it I would just get the hell out. However, I do practice BJJ so being close up against someone is where I am comfortable and it's also where knives are very effective.


    I live about an hour from NIU and it was a school I had applied to in highschool. The Tinley Park murders were 15 minutes from me and I go to that area regularly.

    I know neither are common but generally bad things are happening close enough to home that I think I would be a fool to not be more proactive about self defense. Plus it doesn't help that ghetto surrounds my town and the other nice town next to me. It's slowly taking over.
     
  19. buy guns

    buy guns Member

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    It's hard to not think about it when my school has posters at every door with big letters saying "NIU, can it happen here?" along with a list of their recommendations to suppport suspiscious activity and what to do if you hear gunshots.

    Plus, at the first school I want to, there was a period of a few weeks where a man was hiding behind things and randomly assaulting students (sexually against girls or physically against males) and then running away so those small odds already struck one school I've attended.

    The odds of someone getting mugged or home invaded are also small as well but you problaby have no problem with people discussing CCW ideas. I take exteme offense that you would infer I may "know something" simply because I choose the option to have a means of defense :fire:
     
  20. auschip

    auschip Member

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    Next time you are in your BJJ class try and hold a marker while rolling (ask your partner first). You will find that it both limits your ability to defend (no or limited underhooks and limited arm control), and you end up with lots of marks on your body. If it is legal, and you still want one, look at something like the HAK (slightly more then your budget) or one of the Perrin La griffes. Edited to add the Perrin may be out of your price range but I believe Emerson has a version of it that is also slightly higher then your budget ($70ish).
     
  21. buy guns

    buy guns Member

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    That outcome I would have guessed, but my thinking is that by having a fixed blade carried IWB, I can pull it out after first establishing a beneficial position. That's why I got the idea of geting a fixed as opposed to a folder because it's always mentioned that motor skills decrease in these situations.
     
  22. conw

    conw Member

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    A cool improvised weapon can be made from a bandana. It can be used to garrote or as a wicked sling with, say, a motorola razr in it.

    Like the others, though, I don't think you'd be able to, or want to, do anything hand-to-hand to a VA tech type shooter. Even if you did score a few hits, you probably couldn't avoid getting seriously wounded.
     
  23. sm

    sm member

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    Defensive does not mean one has to go hand-to-hand physical contact.

    Kids.
    Kids cannot have any kind of knife at school, not even a SAK Classic.
    Most, if not all schools don't allow anything "sharp and pointy" not even kids scissors.

    Now these kids have a right to be a bit afraid, they are small, they have not lived as long as some, and one is not fully developed until about age 16-18.
    Girls develop a bit sooner than boys.

    This includes the part of the brain that deals with judgment.

    I and others listen to the kids, and concerns they have, these concerns are real to them. Sensory Input they get from schools, TV, Radio, and other kids, is real.

    I and mine do not discount these fears, instead listen, let them share what it is, and work on breaking these down to how they can deal with it, emotionally, mentally, and physically.

    Mental game is the one we put the most focus on. Paying attention, is different from being "in fear".
    Trust your gut, if something feels creepy, listen to your gut and do not go into Panic, instead use that "creepy" to assist them in taking prudent steps to deal with it.

    Prevent, avoid trouble, evade trouble, and deal with trouble.

    First option for a kid no bigger than a kitchen table and only weighs a bit more than a sack of dog food, is not going into West Story Rumble Mode.

    i.e. Classroom door opens into room, hallway is brick, no windows.
    Gunshots are heard and get that door closed, lock it, and scoot desk up and under lock, and other desks to hold and give weight, and get to a far corner where if someone is shooting (a) angle of shots will not hit them, (b) brick will protect as best can.

    Door opens out to hallway, and shots are close [listen, not hear Listen is the key] and use the cord from pull down screen, belts, patch cords, - whatever to tie that door shut. Get desks, tables, and whatever else to keep door shut, to offer resistance to be being pulled opened and shots fired into room.

    Stuff shoes under a door like a door stop ( little feet , little shoes).

    Kids are not dumb, they just don't know, and that part of the brain is not fully developed yet.
    So, adults are supposed to parent and mentor, and by taking the time to do so, the kids are able to work on this thinking, development, and see, just because they are little, and "we can't even carry a little SAK Classic to school", they are Armed, with mindset, and thinking skills, and have some quality practiced defensive things they can do.


    Focus on the target - not the equipment - Will Fennell

    Will was referring to shooting clay targets.

    It applies to staying safe.

    Magic talisman's can and will impede one in staying safe.
     
  24. R127

    R127 Member

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    This is a very interesting subject. Do you follow the rules and put yourself at risk of not having what you need to defend your life or do you disobey the rules and put yourself at risk of administrative discipline from the school or potentially the government?

    Soda cans and other such containers won't last long once you start swinging them around. Go put some soda cans in a pillow case and start wailing on something and see for yourself. I've seen a full unopened can burst when thrown at somebody's head. Warning: contents under pressure, right? Soup cans are more durable plus they are lunch. There are some types of trauma people can absorb a lot of and blunt trauma is one of them. To effectively use any striking weapon requires the same abilities it takes to beat them into a pulp with your bare hands. That isn't very good odds. I used to carry a knife as a weapon when I was young. I was feral. Same problem as striking weapons plus now you have to worry about bloodborne pathogens. Want some aids or hepatitis or who knows what?

    Any of this stuff against a gun is maybe better than nothing but not all that great. A gun is a ranged weapon and to counter it you will also want a ranged weapon. A can of pepper spray is possibly more legal, definately more effective and can be deployed against a wider variety of threat levels than a lethal weapon can. I reccomend DPS X-Stream Range out of all the varieties I've experimented with.
     
  25. sm

    sm member

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    Personal Responsibility for personal choices made.


    Laws will apply to those under certain ages, for various things in life.
    One is also under "house rules" of Parent or Guardian too.
    So while the underage person makes a personal choice and is responsible for actions, a parent or guardian may also be held responsible for action a person under their roof, or by law they are still responsible for.

    Age 21 is often cited as the age of "adult" , or "parents are free of" - it can vary, as some are responsible at younger ages, and can be of older ages.
    It depends on jurisdiction and laws, and how written and interpretation.

    A 27 year old attending college and parents paying all or part of tuition "might" be held responsible, too many variable and something student and parent/guardian/benefactor need to check into and communicate on.

    THR does not advocate anything not legal.

    So if a parent and kid communicate, with clear understanding of all this responsibility, and a student, has a weapon, that is between them and nobody else and none of my business for sure.

    School differ around the country , and in what grades/levels of education.
    Up until HS around here, no knives.
    College, knives are allowed, and some have differing Code of Conducts on what knives can and cannot be legal.


    Some folks choose to never be a victim, and take prudent steps to not be one, and are responsible for decision's and actions.
    One has to be brutally honest, just as they must if they choose to get a CCW permit/license, and all the responsibility that goes along with it.

    School Board, Review boards, Dean, Grand Juries, Jury of one's Peers...
    What a prudent person would do in a situation...
    Disparity of force...
    Beyond a reasonable doubt...
    In fear of life...
     
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