Need M1 Garand inspection

[Bexar]

Infamous 7th round stoppage. Load your rounds in the clip to where the first round and the last are on the left. Check the internal receiver guide rails and make sure they have not been drilled through from the barrel end of the receiver during manufacture. (Not likely at all) Your bullet guide could be bad. I'll post some pictures later...I have a momma mission to do.

What's the make rifle and what is the stock make? Could be a bind in the trigger group or worn trigger group lugs.

We won't see you for a week if you do a "7th round stoppage" search on the Internet. Opinions will range from not possible to not fixable. Also what exactly happens when you say it won't feed?

 

[dprice3844444]

https://www.standardpartsllc.com/productcart/pc/viewcategories.asp?idCategory=14

 

[Reloadron]

Went with aggiejet to the match and bought a high serial number M1. I am unable to get round 7 to feed from the clip. The first 6 feed perfect. Tried 2 different clips and the same result. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks

What exactly happens? Does the 6th round eject and the bolt comes forward passing over the 7th round or does the bolt catch the 7th round but the bullet point misses the chamber and jams.

Were both clips you tried the same manufacturer?

There are a few possible causes one of which goes back to the early days development of the rifle and I seriously doubt you have that problem.

Give this thread a read. Would the failure shown in the first image be what you had?

Also, as to orientation of the ammunition in the loading clips.


While my rifles never seemed to care some say the clip must be loaded as seen in the above image. Note the orientation of the cartridges with respect to the "bumps" on the clip.

Some people have mentioned problems using the Greek HXP loading clips, or certain HXP loading clips. Personally I never used the HXP clips or ammunition so I can't say if a HXP clip could be your problem.

Ron

 

[Bexar]

What exactly happens? Does the 6th round eject and the bolt comes forward passing over the 7th round or does the bolt catch the 7th round but the bullet point misses the chamber and jams.

Were both clips you tried the same manufacturer?

There are a few possible causes one of which goes back to the early days development of the rifle and I seriously doubt you have that problem.

Give this thread a read. Would the failure shown in the first image be what you had?

Also, as to orientation of the ammunition in the loading clips.


While my rifles never seemed to care some say the clip must be loaded as seen in the above image. Note the orientation of the cartridges with respect to the "bumps" on the clip.

Some people have mentioned problems using the Greek HXP loading clips, or certain HXP loading clips. Personally I never used the HXP clips or ammunition so I can't say if a HXP clip could be your problem.

Ron

Good advice...
However...I disagree with the round configuration of the clips shown. Col. Hatcher, the director of Springfield Armory during development of the Garand and later the President of the NRA, specifically demanded that the M-! clips not be loaded with the leading rounds on the right. As stated above...there are also reports that some HXP clips and HXP ammo were manufactured with different specs of the original design and contribute to seventh round stoppage. I'm not an expert and don't imply that I am; however, the leading round on the left was told to me by a National Match armorer for the M-1.

 

[Bexar]

Went with aggiejet to the match and bought a high serial number M1. I am unable to get round 7 to feed from the clip. The first 6 feed perfect. Tried 2 different clips and the same result. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks

What manufacture rounds are you using?

 

[Reloadron]

Good advice...
However...I disagree with the round configuration of the clips shown. Col. Hatcher, the director of Springfield Armory during development of the Garand and later the President of the NRA, specifically demanded that the M-! clips not be loaded with the leading rounds on the right. As stated above...there are also reports that some HXP clips and HXP ammo were manufactured with different specs of the original design and contribute to seventh round stoppage. I'm not an expert and don't imply that I am; however, the leading round on the left was told to me by a National Match armorer for the M-1.

My understanding has always been...

the first step is to verify that the clip is loaded properly. All the cartridges loaded should be the same height with the base of the cartridge fully seated in the clip. As a general rule you want the top round to be on the side of the clip with the indexed bump (Shown in my image clip labeled Correct). This positions the top round such that when right handed shooters press the clip in the round is closer to the right hand. The clip can be loaded either way without issue.

The clip being loaded either way has been my experience with my rifles. Any idea what Hatcher's reasoning or logic was?

As to the HXP clips? Beats me as I mentioned I don't have any. I have seen a few images where the clips weren't to the same specification as you mentioned but have zero experience with it.

Also, before I forget to the original poster on the problem rifle. Congratulations on your new to you M1 Garand. If you bought the gun at the match through the CMP they will make good on any issues and are a pleasure to deal with. You may want to give them a call.

Ron

 

[Orlando]

I suppose you mean your rifle is short stroking and not picking up the 7th rd?
Very simple fix , replace the op rod spring with one from Orion 7 and make sure rifle is properly greased. Your issue will go away
Also make sure your gas screw is tight, not loose or cracked. AS 1/4 inch drive extension on a ratchet fits perfectly

I own 20 Garands and it makes absolutly no difference which way they are loaded
There is no such thing as HXP or Greek enblocs. Greek HXP comes loaded on USGI , French (sf) and German (JMO) Enblocs. Some report issues with JMO and SF enblocs.
All my garands will work perfectly with any of these enblocs

 

[Bexar]

And what you have here Aggie is a micro example of what I said you would find on the Internet..."is to" "is not" ad nauseam.

And the seventh round stoppage is not an every day...every gun...every shooter problem.

Reload....Hatcher had experienced the SRS in the Garands and was concerned about it when he presented the guns for demonstration at the national level. He modified the follower so that no clips could be loaded with rounds on the right and all clips were to be loaded with the first and last round on the left. The rifles he used were early manufacture and may have had the yet undiscovered over boring of the receiver guide rails. Even experts, especially military experts, are subject to pass down information which may or may not be valid.

The Garand rifle gas system while not complex in design is subject to several tight tolerances including cartridge powder selection. As always when solving a problem always take the information you receive here or anywhere...compare similarities and then try the simplest/inexpensive possible solutions first. Everyone here has offered you good advice and the first thing I would try is the clip round configuration then work through it if that doesn't solve the issue. You will also find that Garands have a following that is almost if not a religion so enjoy your new adventure and welcome. I wish I had a gunsmith's crystal ball but I don't...let us know...it would be fair to say we are as interested as you are.

 

[Orlando]

I would guess 90% of CMP Garand forum posted problems are cured with a new op rod spring and being properly greased. The Op Rod spring does more than assist in cycling the bolt.
First thing I do on any Garand I get is a complete tear down to smallest part, properly grease and replace op rod spring.
If nothing else you will have a clean slate to start diagnosing your rifles issue

 

[Reloadron]

Bexar, thank you for the information regarding Hatcher.

Hopefully M1Newbie will read through this stuff and find a solution to his problem. M1Newbie, enjoy your new rifle and let all know what develops.

Orlando, your post regarding the op rod spring reminded me I am due (past due) to get a few on order.

Ron

 

[aggiejet]

M1Newbie and I bought the Greek HXP ammo the CMP was selling. I went out and shot my rifle Sunday. After a little sighting in and getting used to the rifle,from 200 yds, I put 3 inside a 9" diameter circle shooting off my elbows off a bench. really happy with my new barrell.

As a point of info, the gun M1Newbie bought was a CMP Special. I got the impression that the gun was within specs and had a new barrell and ops rod in it. I was surprised when he told me round 7 wouldn't feed.
(As I understand it, round 6 fired, extracted, and bolt came forward on round 7, but jammed cartridge; didn't feed clean into the chamber.

I am learning a ton from you guys. Appreciate all the info and experience.

 

[Bexar]

M1Newbie and I bought the Greek HXP ammo the CMP was selling. I went out and shot my rifle Sunday. After a little sighting in and getting used to the rifle,from 200 yds, I put 3 inside a 9" diameter circle shooting off my elbows off a bench. really happy with my new barrell.

As a point of info, the gun M1Newbie bought was a CMP Special. I got the impression that the gun was within specs and had a new barrell and ops rod in it. I was surprised when he told me round 7 wouldn't feed.
(As I understand it, round 6 fired, extracted, and bolt came forward on round 7, but jammed cartridge; didn't feed clean into the chamber.

I am learning a ton from you guys. Appreciate all the info and experience.

Welcome to you both and thanks for the update. Sounds like the CMP needs a phone call. Your description of the stoppage sounds like a textbook example. Please keep us posted.

 

[M1Newbie]

Thanks for all the info. The 7th round misses the feed ramp as in the link from reloadron. I'm not sure if i loaded the clips incorrect or not as the picture displays. I am shooting the Greek ammo and will replace op rod spring and try again. Gun is CMP Service Grade Special by H & R manufactured in 1955 or 56. Thanks again for all the info. I now have a place to start.

 

[M1Newbie]

Just got off the phone with the CMP and he said the new stock could be rubbing could be rubbing the ops rod. I will pull the stock and see if I can find anything. Will post what I find. The ops rod and spring are new.

 

[Orlando]

So this is a reparked rifle with new commercial barell and stock, correct?
Here are just a few things to look for
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=496002
If you havent tore the rifle down and properly greased it you need to. They normally come dry with no or little lubrication. Lack of grease with new park will cause short stroking

 

[M1Newbie]

Thanks for the link Orlando, I will take a look at that before I send her back to CMP. New stock, old barrell.

 

[Orlando]

OK, so this is the Special Grade that is all correct except for the stock/handguards ? I cant keep the Special Grades straight.
I did the write up in the link, somewhere I have more pics and info if you need them

 

[saltydog452]

Bexar, post 33, 3rd para

Maybe I misread, but how can the 1st rd AND the last, be on the left side of the enbloc?

ty.

salty

 

[saltydog452]

Bexar, post 33, 3rd para

salty

 

[BBBBill]

Maybe I misread, but how can the 1st rd AND the last, be on the left side of the enbloc?

Oops