New Kel-Tec Bullpup Rifle
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Thefabulousfink
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It is a new forward ejecting system to keep brass from ejecting into the cheek of left-handed shooter (a problem with the bullpup concept). The new FN bullpup has a similar system that ejects downward in front of the magazine. The Kel-Tec ejects up through a tube above the barrel and out the front (see vid and pics at the begining of this thread). These are new designs and it will be interesting to see how they hold up to use/abuse, but the video looks promising.
shappy0869
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Everyone loves a good conspiracy theory, and it seems like the RFB almost seems like it was built to order. I mean, here we have a company that is not known for expensive guns, yet it has produced one. It is not known for bullpups or the .308 yet it has produced one. The prototype pictures and video seem to show a product that is very far along in the development process, especially considering that the company has said sales are still a year away. Producing a rifle such as this is an expensive gamble for a relatively small company.
Anyone think there is already a customer in mind for this platform and the reason sales are so far away is that they have initial production already earmarked?
Anyone think there is already a customer in mind for this platform and the reason sales are so far away is that they have initial production already earmarked?
Bart Noir
Member
The FN P90 has downward ejection, but the FN2000 does the bunny-poop ejection.
I asked a man about whether his FN2000 ejected with the muzzle raised up high. He said yes. I didn't get into the question of how he safetly tested that but just hoped he was drilling new woodpecker holes high up a tree.
Bart Noir
I asked a man about whether his FN2000 ejected with the muzzle raised up high. He said yes. I didn't get into the question of how he safetly tested that but just hoped he was drilling new woodpecker holes high up a tree.
Bart Noir
Kel-tec has a reputation of needing to tweak new products after release. This is a new, unforgiving market for them and they can't afford to let anything except a thoroughly debugged rifle leave the plant. These are not economy rifles. It is a big gamble.
I don't think the FN2000 ejection is 1 shot, 1 eject, looks like it just lines 'em up in the tube, and pushes 'em out the end. Perhaps depending on how much gas gets vented into the tube determines how many poop out...
If you watch the video, it seems like that to me...
If you watch the video, it seems like that to me...
mordechaianiliewicz
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Kel-Tec is and always has been (since inception) a pro-gun company. This rifle is a combo of two things.
#1. A bullpup .308, which no one else ever even thought about it seems.
#2. A civie legal rifle made for the shooter, SHTF type guy in mind.
If this rifle comes out at $1500 or less, I'm gonna find a way to get one. Simple as that. More than that, I dunno.
Would a .223 version be a good idea? Of course. But they want the .308 out there to corner that market. With the ATF breathing down the necks of people who want HK, FAL, etc. type guns (with parts kits regs), this is a way to get around those fraudulent interpretations.
Now, if KelTec is able to get the rifle to around $700, they will simply own the market, and that's all there is to it. They probably would sell upwards of a million rifles simply on general principle, and if the Dems got stupid and talked about a ban, Kel-Tec would probably have 3,000,000 or more out before the ban closed them down.
#1. A bullpup .308, which no one else ever even thought about it seems.
#2. A civie legal rifle made for the shooter, SHTF type guy in mind.
If this rifle comes out at $1500 or less, I'm gonna find a way to get one. Simple as that. More than that, I dunno.
Would a .223 version be a good idea? Of course. But they want the .308 out there to corner that market. With the ATF breathing down the necks of people who want HK, FAL, etc. type guns (with parts kits regs), this is a way to get around those fraudulent interpretations.
Now, if KelTec is able to get the rifle to around $700, they will simply own the market, and that's all there is to it. They probably would sell upwards of a million rifles simply on general principle, and if the Dems got stupid and talked about a ban, Kel-Tec would probably have 3,000,000 or more out before the ban closed them down.
PaladinX13
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Since the forward eject is one of the major (in the name, even) features I'm curious how it handles grit, grime, and out and out obstruction.
I'm not intending to dunk the rifle in the swamp and expect it to come up shooting, but a lot of people are interested in that level of "reliability" (perhaps more accurate: neglect, abuse, or extreme circumstances?).
I understand there's a one-way catch that keeps the brass moving in one direction (and allows you to fire upwards without a hitch). But in the unlikely event that the catch fails, is stuck, or whatever... anyone understand the mechanism enough to analyze what would happen?
I'm not intending to dunk the rifle in the swamp and expect it to come up shooting, but a lot of people are interested in that level of "reliability" (perhaps more accurate: neglect, abuse, or extreme circumstances?).
I understand there's a one-way catch that keeps the brass moving in one direction (and allows you to fire upwards without a hitch). But in the unlikely event that the catch fails, is stuck, or whatever... anyone understand the mechanism enough to analyze what would happen?
Lobotomy Boy
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I'm definitely buying one.
PercyShelley
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Amen to that!
I need to take a cold shower now.
mordechaianiliewicz
Member
Finally a gunmaker noticed an unfilled niche of the folks in this country (of whom there are millions) who would like a tacticool, badaaasss rifle like this. And, because they are pro-gun (unlike HK, who could have owned this market for years now if they weren't against making semi-auto rifles for civilians), it'll be out there for all of us. As has been asked before, "How much will it cost?"
As for the whole bunny poop issue, all I can say is that parts can and do break on all guns. It may look funny, but this is one of the better ideas I've seen for handling the lefty bullpup issue. And as I said, if under $1500, I'm definitely gonna buy it.
As for the whole bunny poop issue, all I can say is that parts can and do break on all guns. It may look funny, but this is one of the better ideas I've seen for handling the lefty bullpup issue. And as I said, if under $1500, I'm definitely gonna buy it.
Kimber1911_06238
Member
looks cool but for over $1,000 I'd just buy a socom
Tell me that isn't the BEST all purpose rifle around. Short enough to use inside a building, long enough barrel to get far accurate shots, a heavy caliber suitable for large game, simple design, and if god answers my prayers a price around 700 
.
.Wes Janson
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Price is going to be double that. Expect $1500. Which just means you have to save for twice as long
I didn't look at it too closely, but from what I recall it's just a small tab that sits just inside the ejection tube, above the chamber. Not sure if it was spring loaded, or made from a bent piece of plastic/metal leaf spring. Obviously, if it breaks and you're shooting uphill, it might pose a potential problem, but I'm not too concerned about it. There's no way to tell without removing the detent and shooting it upwards, but I almost suspect that the older piece of brass will be shoved back forward and into the tube by the newly extracted piece. I'm sure Kel-Tec is messing around with it right now to find out for sure...but it's not like you can't figure out ways to cause malfunctions in every other type of rifle out there. When it happens, jams will probably be of a different nature than we're used to, but the real question is if they occur more or less frequently than on other rifles.
I didn't look at it too closely, but from what I recall it's just a small tab that sits just inside the ejection tube, above the chamber. Not sure if it was spring loaded, or made from a bent piece of plastic/metal leaf spring. Obviously, if it breaks and you're shooting uphill, it might pose a potential problem, but I'm not too concerned about it. There's no way to tell without removing the detent and shooting it upwards, but I almost suspect that the older piece of brass will be shoved back forward and into the tube by the newly extracted piece. I'm sure Kel-Tec is messing around with it right now to find out for sure...but it's not like you can't figure out ways to cause malfunctions in every other type of rifle out there. When it happens, jams will probably be of a different nature than we're used to, but the real question is if they occur more or less frequently than on other rifles.
mordechaianiliewicz
Member
I think Wes Janson is largely correct here.
Kel-Rec could obviously put the rifle into production today if it wanted. But, if any bugs came up, we'd have a THR in a couple of years about that "silly bullpup" from KelTec.
The video was cool. And the rifle looks good, bunny poop and all. But it was also fired under the very controlled circumstances of a range. If this rifle is meant to fill the .308 bullpup niche of SHTF concerned shooters, that means alot of guys are gonna get this thing, shoot it in "field" conditions, and maybe clean it every other time or so. Kel Tec wants to be sure it will be able to stand that.
Am I likely to shoot upwards at the range, or on some land? No. But, if the SHTF did happen, I might and I would want the gun to work correctly. And while I noticed that chambering a round seemed to clear the ejection tube, the gun is functionally a single shot in upward fire without the ability of the rifle to "poop" rounds out in sustained fire upwards.
I like the idea of them waiting a year. Plenty of time for Kel Tec employees to drive to the Everglades, and attempt to perforate flora and fauna, and abuse the gun to see how much it can take. On that note, I'm about to look on the Kel-Tec website for employment oportunities, and look at cost of living in the area.
Kel-Rec could obviously put the rifle into production today if it wanted. But, if any bugs came up, we'd have a THR in a couple of years about that "silly bullpup" from KelTec.
The video was cool. And the rifle looks good, bunny poop and all. But it was also fired under the very controlled circumstances of a range. If this rifle is meant to fill the .308 bullpup niche of SHTF concerned shooters, that means alot of guys are gonna get this thing, shoot it in "field" conditions, and maybe clean it every other time or so. Kel Tec wants to be sure it will be able to stand that.
Am I likely to shoot upwards at the range, or on some land? No. But, if the SHTF did happen, I might and I would want the gun to work correctly. And while I noticed that chambering a round seemed to clear the ejection tube, the gun is functionally a single shot in upward fire without the ability of the rifle to "poop" rounds out in sustained fire upwards.
I like the idea of them waiting a year. Plenty of time for Kel Tec employees to drive to the Everglades, and attempt to perforate flora and fauna, and abuse the gun to see how much it can take. On that note, I'm about to look on the Kel-Tec website for employment oportunities, and look at cost of living in the area.
There was an amateur video out there of an owner with an SU-16 going through a 30-round magazine, rapid fire, smashing the icy out of a frozen pond, throwing the gun in said pond, and then fishing it out, clearing the action of water, and then rapid firing another mag through it, without any failures.
I don't think the average Joe would go through those kind of conditions when the SHTF, but it's nice to know the guns can take it.
I don't think the average Joe would go through those kind of conditions when the SHTF, but it's nice to know the guns can take it.
mordechaianiliewicz
Member
Wow. The SU-16 was capable of going through that, and keeping on shooting like a champ, I have every confidence that this rifle will do just as well if not better once they have the kinks worked out.
Oh, and by the way, it depends on the "amount" of feces that has struck the oscilator as to what the rifle might have to go through. If it was a low level SHTF like Katrina, no stresses. If it is a TEOTWAWKI incident of massive civil unrest from a depression worldwide leading into a horror world of rival warlords, you want a rifle that works in all circumstances with maximum reliability, and is concealable enough to fit in a backpack (sounds like this bad boy to be sure [atleast the carbine anyway]) yet reach out to atleast 500 yards away.
If Kel-Tec has everything from Katrina to the end of the world as we know it in mind, this rifle will be worth it. (And, if I were Kel-Tec, once I'm done with the .308, I'd work on a .223 to market to police and military. I bet no matter what, their rifle would be cheaper than the FN2000)
Oh, and by the way, it depends on the "amount" of feces that has struck the oscilator as to what the rifle might have to go through. If it was a low level SHTF like Katrina, no stresses. If it is a TEOTWAWKI incident of massive civil unrest from a depression worldwide leading into a horror world of rival warlords, you want a rifle that works in all circumstances with maximum reliability, and is concealable enough to fit in a backpack (sounds like this bad boy to be sure [atleast the carbine anyway]) yet reach out to atleast 500 yards away.
If Kel-Tec has everything from Katrina to the end of the world as we know it in mind, this rifle will be worth it. (And, if I were Kel-Tec, once I'm done with the .308, I'd work on a .223 to market to police and military. I bet no matter what, their rifle would be cheaper than the FN2000)
Thin Black Line
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Count me in even if it's $1500.
mordechaianiliewicz
Member
So, there it is. Kel-Tec better come out with this pretty soon, we all appear to be hanging on the edge of our seats.
If it works, it's a rifle I'd be happy to call Vera.
Well from the images of the innerworkings of the rifle it appears as if the cartidges are pushed into the "bunny poop tube" with as much force as they are pushed into the barrel. So functioning at an awkward angle should not be a issue. Also even if it is, a pump action shotgun can jam if held and pumped in an awkward angle. But, still it performs extremley well at what it's used for.
Lobotomy Boy
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I think the technical term, according to Kel-Tec literature, is "bunny poop chute."
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