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New Reloader Question

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by GuitarsAndGuns, Oct 15, 2011.

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  1. GuitarsAndGuns

    GuitarsAndGuns Member

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    Let me first say thanks to everyone who posts here, I was pretty much able to answer every question on how to start reloading from the posts on this forum, and a few youtube videos. I got everything set up this week and loaded some .45 ACP pretty easily. However, I am about to load up some .38 wadcutters and I need to know if this looks like a good crimp before I proceed. This is just a dummy round I loaded to practice on. I hope the pics are good enough. Thanks, any advice will be greatly appreciated.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  2. GP100man

    GP100man Member

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    Looks as if ya need to go deeper to the "crimp groove". that`s why the powder load is so lite on Wadcutter loads ,most of the boolit is in the case !

    I myself like a firm crimp , just too many pluses , such as more rugged ammo (boolit slippin out or in) better ign of powder.
     
  3. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Looks pretty good.

    But you have way too much crimp for a wad-cutter load.
    They don't need much crimp as they don't recoil enough to back them out of the cases.

    Also, did you intended to seat long and crimp in a grease groove?
    The crimp cannulure is the one still sticking out of the case.
    Unless it's a grease groove too, with the grease cleaned out of it.

    Most folks seat wad-cutter almost flush with the case mouth.
    I prefer to seat about 1/8" longer, but not that long!

    rc
     
  4. Missionary

    Missionary Member

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    Gretings
    Looks to me like you are crimping not in the crimp groove... any reason for the particular place you chose to crimp ?
    Your crimp tool.. is this a Lee Factory Crimp type or another... you can put so much crimp on a bullet with a standard roll crimp type tool that it can bulge the case.
    Mike in Peru

    Have you tried to test load this dummy cartrige in your revolver ?
     
  5. GuitarsAndGuns

    GuitarsAndGuns Member

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    Thanks for the fast replies. Here is another one. My Lyman manual states 1.317 OAL, and this one measures exactly that. Next to it is the type of bullet I am using. To achieve 1.317, I have to crimp in the second groove. I am using a RCBS Turret with Lee dies, but not the FCD, I am crimping with the seating die. Thanks again, please feel free to point out any and all mistakes I am making.

    [​IMG]
     
  6. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    I think you might want to measure that again.

    A .38 Spl case is 1.155" long.
    Seating to 1.317" would leave .162" of bullet sticking out.

    That sure looks like a lot more then that!

    rc
     
  7. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    The real problem is, you have a Lyman book and a Lyman number but not a Lyman bullet.
    If you are going to load by "recipe" you have to have all the ingredients as listed.

    It looks like a Speer or Remington wadcutter to me, but might be another similar brand.
    It is made to be seated flush with the case mouth and lightly roll crimped at the front edge. OAL = case length.

    I guess if you want some lead out of the case mouth like rcmodel, you could crimp in the front lube groove. But I don't. There are wadcutters with real crimp grooves and a front band - the Lyman does - but this ain't one.
     
  8. flashhole

    flashhole Member

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    If the bullet shown in the pic is the same orientation as the one in the case it looks to me like you seated it upside down.
     
  9. GuitarsAndGuns

    GuitarsAndGuns Member

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    The measurements are right, i just checked. I am using Winchester brass that all measures approximately 1.155. I do not know the brand of bullet, I bought them in a bag of 200 at my local gun store. They may be locally made. I will find out next time i go. If they measure .652 at 148 grains, should I seat them to the first groove, or all the way in? I was planning on using the minimum Lyman load of 3.1 grains of Titegroup.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2011
  10. GuitarsAndGuns

    GuitarsAndGuns Member

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    Please tell me I am not that stupid. I thought the hollow end went in the cartridge, the other end that is seated in the case has a much deeper cavity.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2011
  11. GuitarsAndGuns

    GuitarsAndGuns Member

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    The Hodgson data on their website recommends 1.160 OAL with 2.7 grains of Titegroup for a Hornady 148 grain LHBWC. This will seat it almost all the way in. Is there any reason why I shouldn't use this data instead? Thanks again, i really appreciate the help.
     
  12. sugarmaker

    sugarmaker Member

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    I think you have the seating right, upside down wadcutter makes a heckuva hollow point. It isn't, however, going to like being made into the same OAL as the lyman mold would make as the grooves aren't right. For a revolver just seat it until it has a workable OAL and the groove aligns with the case mouth so you can crimp it a little (really doesn't need much at all, just remove the bell). For a revolver it'll be OK. If it were a Smith 52 it would matter.
     
  13. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Light Taper crimp
    [​IMG]

    Light Roll crimp over front ledge
    [​IMG]

    Light roll crimp into cannelure
    [​IMG]

    Fit the OAL to the bullet.
     
  14. oldreloader

    oldreloader Member

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    I'm not familiar with that particular bullet either, but it looks to me like the bottom two groves are larger than the upper groove. Maybe two lube groves and a crimp groove?? Also how are you lubing the bullets? Just askin.
     
  15. GuitarsAndGuns

    GuitarsAndGuns Member

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    Bullets were pre-lubed. They may be manufactured locally, as they are sold in bulk plastic bags. They were also very affordable.
    Thanks Sugarmaker for the explanation, and a big thank you to Walkalong for the pics, both were very helpful.
     
  16. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Just a reminder, those are soft lead swaged bullets intended for target velocities.
     
  17. Lost Sheep

    Lost Sheep Member

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    The rest of the story (with a nod to Paul Harvey)

    Higher velocities will cause leading.

    Lost Sheep

    P.S. The extremely deep hollow in the base of the bullet allows the pressure of the burning powder to expand the "skirt" of the (very soft) lead bullet to engage the rifling. Even at the fairly low pressures found in the typical target ammunition.

    Hopalong, I keep forgetting about the possibility that the skirt may drag on the rifling hard enough to separate the skirt from the main body. Thanks. Good think I don't ever load wadcutters. (No dig on wadcutters, I just like semiwadcutters.)
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2011
  18. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    And they can separate at higher pressures, leaving a ring of lead in the barrel. You blow the front half off and out, while the rest stays in the barrel. Not good for the next shot.
     
  19. GuitarsAndGuns

    GuitarsAndGuns Member

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    Thanks for all the advice. These are actually going to stay on the shelf for now, and I am going to order some Speer or Hornady to try first, so I can have a definitive recipe to use. I will use these later when I have some more experience with wadcutters and how they work. Also, I definitely plan on using the lowest charges to prevent leading, as well as to save a little $$$, as I shoot a lot of .38. Thanks again for the help, it is greatly appreciated.
     
  20. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    No reason to do that.

    Just take your perfectly fine wadcutter bullets.
    Load them over 2.7 to 2.9 grains Titegroup.
    Seat to just past case length, (about a fingernail thickness sticking out).
    And go enjoy shooting them.

    That or something very similiar has been an NRA Bullseye target load longer then you have been alive I betcha.

    rc
     
  21. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Yep, load em up and shoot them.
     
  22. Cherokee

    Cherokee Member

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    +1 what rcmodel said.
     
  23. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    I load my Speer hollowbase wadcutters with NOTHING sticking out.
    Flush. Even. Square. Flat. OAL = case length.
    Moderate roll crimp. My Python doesn't care but my M52 does not feed well with a faint taper as usually shown.
    See if you can get a look at a factory wadcutter.

    You are operating below the maximum pressure for the gun, since the aim with wadcutters is accuracy. No need to ignore serviceable bullets in search of a recipe.
     
  24. Hondo 60
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    Hondo 60 Member

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    Just to confuse the heck outta ya, too slow can cause leading as well.

    The science behind it is, you want the bullet & gasses at just the right temp to obturate.
    (make the lead soft enough to fill the lands & grooves of the barrel)

    So too fast is bad in that it actually melts the lead & causes lead streaks, but too slow will cause leading too.
     
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