Quantcast

New Rules for CMP 1911's

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Tirod, Dec 5, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Speedo66

    Speedo66 Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2008
    Messages:
    6,197
    Location:
    Flatlandistan
    I, too, am upset that they, as a gov't agency, refuse to sell to C&R holders who have already been vetted to receive handguns directly by another gov't agency.

    Why am I not surprised?

    To be honest, I have no interest in worn out 1911's just because they were previously owned by the gov't. M-1's, Carbines, Springfields, yes, 1911's not so much.
     
    JR24, jstert and Neo-Luddite like this.
  2. ford8nr

    ford8nr Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2011
    Messages:
    1,762
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Slamfire, my thoughts exactly.
    If the CMP can sell worn out guns for more than they are worth to support their programs they have met their mission. If I as a buyer see no value in what they are offering I will not buy. If I find like I did when I bought my H&R M1 a good value then I'll buy.

    Don't (can't) understand all the heartburn.

    If people think there are better deals / conditions out there start shopping now.
     
    DoubleMag, JR24, Slamfire and 2 others like this.
  3. ford8nr

    ford8nr Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2011
    Messages:
    1,762
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I don't believe they are a government agency. I believe they are a corporation chartered by the gov.
     
    CoalTrain49 likes this.
  4. alsaqr

    alsaqr Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,267
    Location:
    South Western, OK
    Won't be buying any of those guns. Own several nice model 1911 handguns, including two WWII bring backs; one is worth considerable money. .

    When Kuwait was invaded i was the senior firing range advisor to the Saudis. US troops armed with model 1911 handguns used our range. i fired several of those guns. They were ill fitted mis-matched junk then: Now they are worse.
     
    JR24 and jstert like this.
  5. BigBore44

    BigBore44 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2013
    Messages:
    3,332
    Location:
    Oklahoma
    These 1911’s aren’t even complete originals. They are rebuilds (who knows how many times). I’d pay $1,000 for an original, complete, numbers matching. Even if it had slop. I wouldn’t give you $50 for one of these pieces of junk. Funny thing is I actually have half a mind to buy one just to flip it. They do it everyday with CMP Garands. I’ve seen them sell for $1,500+. There’s a sucker born every minute. But I just can’t bring myself to do it. Morals really suck sometimes.
     
    JR24 and alsaqr like this.
  6. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    3,094
    Location:
    Northwest IL--the other 'Downstate'
    + 1 === CMP has been great for parts & ammo for our two M-1s---I've had a S&A 1911a1 for 25 years and don't need a GI one for the prices they are talking.
     
  7. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    3,094
    Location:
    Northwest IL--the other 'Downstate'
     
  8. Mayvik

    Mayvik Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2010
    Messages:
    354
    Another alternative is just buy one of Sarco's parts kits and build your own. It is not much investment, you end up with a mixmaster on a new frame, and you get the satisfaction of building it and learning the ins and outs in detail.

    Agreeing to no C&Rs was assinine and a total turnoff from future CMP business. The people most likely to appreciate POS pieces of history got cut out first.

    As far as who "deserves" one...if you paid your taxes you should be eligible. You bought it already.
     
  9. jstert

    jstert Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2013
    Messages:
    390
    Location:
    ne and sw
    the directorate of civilian marksmanship (dcm) was created by law in 1903 within the department of the army to improve marksmanship in the general population. the current cmp dates from 1995 drafted law as a clinton-created, tax exempt, nonprofit, non federally funded corporation, which receives donations of surplus firearms for resale. the old dcm moved firearms and ammunition at minimal cost out the door to lawabiding, shooting citizens. the new cmp sells them to fund its operations with a primary emphasis on youth safety and air guns. thus dcm sold firearms for a couple of dozen dollars, cheap even today after adjusting for inflation, they were often used by hunters. the cmp now sells its limited supply of firearms for 100s and even 1000s of dollars, the cmp’s nonfirearm products are sold at or above market prices, and ammo supply is spotty. both entities are fish, the dcm was a brook trout, the cmp is a perch.
     
  10. cfullgraf

    cfullgraf Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2010
    Messages:
    9,325
    Location:
    East TN
    Original Garands and M1 carbines that had not been rebuilt at least once were few and far between and were rare. They commanded a very premium price. It's the nature of the "beast" that most folks do not seem to consider.

    Before folks dump on CMP on the condition of the 1911s, it would be best to wait to see what they have to offer. They might be good--or bad.

    I've had nothing but good experiences and service from CMP. I expect this will continue with the 1911s.
     
  11. Tirod

    Tirod Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2008
    Messages:
    4,839
    Location:
    SW MO
    I fully expect the CMP to offer the outstanding service they have in the past. However, they have very little control over condition.

    Two requirements have been in long standing, first, membership in a club. If you are retired military, I read it as being part of that club. There online information outlines that. Secondly, participation in marksmanship, if you carry a CCW you qualify, if over 60 the rule is waived. I researched those requirements last year and found I can qualify all on one retired ID. Therefore there is some institutional bias giving an older veteran some advantage, albeit not much.

    What I find interesting is that things like that are still news to some. It goes to the public perception the CMP is just running a surplus store selling to all and sundry. Not hardly. They have always had hoops to jump thru. For all the complaints I've read in the last few years about the CMP "wholesaling" Garands and reading about them showing up on auction sites, it would seem that this addresses most of it.

    Having a signed copy of your FFL's license is a new wrinkle. I perceive there have been issues about it in the past. Any stories you know about?
     
  12. Milt1

    Milt1 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2014
    Messages:
    913
    Location:
    N.C.
    Either you are reading this (below) wrong or I'm reading it wrong. I was aware of the CMP back in the '60's much further back than 1996.
    The CMP traces its direct lineage to 1903 when Congress and President Theodore Roosevelt established the National Board for the Promotion of Rifle Practice (NBPRP) and the National Matches. From then until 1996, first the Department of War and later the Department of the Army managed the program that became known as the “civilian marksmanship program. During this period, program objectives shifted from military marksmanship to training civilians who might serve in the military to developing youth through marksmanship training. In 1996, Congress acted again to establish the Corporation for the Promotion of Rifle Practice and Firearm Safety that now governs the CMP.
    The above is straight from CPM and nothing is mentioned about DCM.
     
  13. CoalTrain49

    CoalTrain49 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2014
    Messages:
    4,168
    Location:
    Somewhere in WA.
    Non-profit 501
     
  14. sbwaters
    • Contributing Member

    sbwaters Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2016
    Messages:
    625
    Location:
    Rome, NY
    Reading all this I think I might just revere the 1917 1911 my Grandpa carried in WWI and that my WWII Pa passed down to me. That 1911 I keep in the safe along with the current SA 1911 I actually use.
     
  15. 22250Rem

    22250Rem Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,984
    Location:
    Western NY State
    1995 - 1996 was the transition period from the DCM to the CMP.. I sent in all my completed paperwork and a check to the "Director of Civilian Marksmanship" (DCM) to purchase a government owned M-1 Garand in May or June of 1995. Before the end of 1995 they sent me a letter stating that they had already sold their quota of rifles for 1995 and that I would be put on the list to receive one from their 1996 quota. It was October 1996 before it arrived and by then it was the CMP that sent it to me. I used to joke about how I sent a check to the DCM and the CMP sent me an M-1. My other joke from that era was how I bought a semi-automatic rifle through the mail from Bill Clinton! ...... Back then they were delivered directly to you and didn't have to go through an FFL. My background check back then involved a trip to the police dept. which included fingerprinting IIRC; but it cleared you to receive the gun direct.
     
  16. edwardware

    edwardware Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    2,206
    They still do. I ordered two M1s, delivered to my door, from Barack Obama :neener:.
     
  17. CoalTrain49

    CoalTrain49 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2014
    Messages:
    4,168
    Location:
    Somewhere in WA.
    That happens everyday with antique Winchester rifles and Colt SAA revolvers. It also happens with USGI 1911's. These fall into that category. The value in these pistols is that of military history and nothing more. A person would have to be a fool if they thought they were buying a serviceable firearm. The reason they have been in storage since the M9 replaced them is the fact that they are no longer serviceable. Those babies are used up. I can see a lot of folks here trying to assign value based on serviceability.

    Regarding value. There is no value here other than as a historic relic. I remember reading an article about a rifle that was determined to have been used at the battle of Little Big Horn thru forensics and recovered cases at the site. That rifle was sold at auction for $258,000. I suppose some might say there was little value there because of it's condition but obviously someone felt differently.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
    Slamfire likes this.
  18. Elkins45

    Elkins45 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2009
    Messages:
    5,332
    Location:
    Northern KY
    Not really. There are at least two organizations you can join online that satisfy the affiliation requirement. And a concealed carry permit satisfies the proof of marksmanship.
     
  19. CDW4ME

    CDW4ME Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Messages:
    1,491
    Location:
    Free State USA
    Perhaps could is a more appropriate term.
     
  20. Elkins45

    Elkins45 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2009
    Messages:
    5,332
    Location:
    Northern KY
    ?
     
  21. CLP

    CLP Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2010
    Messages:
    1,389
    Location:
    Alabama
    ... two delivered to my office- the address which isn't even listed on my C&R!
     
  22. CLP

    CLP Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2010
    Messages:
    1,389
    Location:
    Alabama
    my expectation was that they were going to grade these things on a scale similar to Garands and also have a "CMP special" option - reparked, barrel reblued, maybe tighten up the slide, etc.

    any leads on what they're intending to price them at?
     
  23. ford8nr

    ford8nr Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2011
    Messages:
    1,762
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    No word from the CMP
    A lot of speculations
     
  24. CoalTrain49

    CoalTrain49 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2014
    Messages:
    4,168
    Location:
    Somewhere in WA.
    I don't think they know. They haven't received the pistols yet.

    If they are what I think they are there's going to be a lot of field grade pistols.:(

    Anything in excellent condition will be sold on their auction sight. Collectors will be rolling around in the mud fighting over those.
     
  25. 627PCFan

    627PCFan Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2007
    Messages:
    2,145
    Location:
    Sterling, VA
    You can build a nice custom Caspian 1911 for not much more. Ill pass.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice