Discussion in 'Hunting' started by Flintknapper, May 13, 2009.
That's an excellent pig Paul. Looks like good shot placement as well. Good job Sir!
Thank you, coming from you it's like Michael Jordan telling me I made a good basketball shot. I have really enjoyed your thread, what an education. Here's three more I got on the same trip, all taken with a 6.5x55, factory ammo. A couple went 200+ lbs.
^^^^^^^^^ That's quite a trio of pigs. Very nice 'cutters' on the middle one. Love the fluted barrel on your rifle.
Keep after them, we need all the help we can get in this State.
Checked one my cameras yesterday and was reminded they are making hogs....faster than we can trim their numbers.
They are the mammalian equivalent of Fire Ants....(here to stay and growing in numbers).
Wow, they breed like rats, don't they? The owner of the hunting ranch I was at said you'd have to kill 7 out of every 10 to even make a dent in them, he doubts 3 of 10 are killed.
They had a fun pig shoot at this ranch, once a week they take the under 80 lbs. pigs they trap and release them two at a time for a line of shooters, good practice.
Our group of three took seven big hogs weighing 1,000 lb. The other hunters had never done it and were in awe at how fun it all was, one had been hunting public land in New Mexico for deer and elk and hasn't gotten an animal since 1995. He said he almost felt guilty. I'd encourage you guys who have never tried hog hunting to do so, no waiting to get a tag drawn, no expensive out of state license, no competing with mobs of other hunters on public land, no camping out, no walking miles over days to MAYBE get a shot. Personally, I'm too old for that. And you can do it all year.
I'd rather eat a wild hog than a deer any day anyway.
OK....I've got a group of pigs that have been coming in to a bait site that is located about 500 yards behind my house. In fact...this past weekend I was out of town visiting my family in Central Texas when my wife text'd me there was a group of hogs in the pasture right behind the house. Sent me pics and video.
In the 30 years I have lived on my property...I have only had hogs in that pasture (in the daytime) one other time, so it figures these would show up while I am out of town. Well....I got back last Monday and Tuesday morning about 7 a.m. I let our Dachshund out in the back yard (fenced) to do her 'business'. I surveyed the pasture and noticed a bunch of small black figures (piglets) moving through the grass and weeds.... about 225 yds. out.
Soon afterward a few full grown hogs walked out. No mistaking what they were. So I quietly coaxed the dog back in the house and went to retrieve a rifle. Figured the 7mm-08 would be best for the distance they were at.
By the time I got the rifle uncased, loaded up and out on the back porch...the group was leaving the pasture, but there was time for a quick shot off the porch railing at the last pig in line. That pig was a boar of about 150 lbs. The shot was good and the pig went down. The rest hightailed to parts unknown. The hogs had not come back until just the other day...and are now back on the bait site.
They have grouped up tightly while feeding on the corn I have placed in hole in the ground. (see video)
So....I am debating which weapon to take with me when I go and sit for them (possibly this evening).
I am expecting them to group up fairly tightly again...or at least have a few cross in front of another. Whenever I use my 458 SOCOM I look for opportunities where hogs 'line up' in hopes of killing more than one hog with a single shot.
It has worked well for me on a number of occasions. But....at this particular bait site, I have stands set up at 100 yds. and 40 yds. I am wondering if I wouldn't do better to go to the closer stand and take a shotgun loaded with 'Dixie Tri-Ball'.
DTB's are a 3" shell loaded to 1100 fps with 3 Sixty Caliber...Hard Alloy...round balls, weighing 3/4 ounce each (so...over 2 ounces of payload). They penetrate very well.
If I take my SOCOM....I would be shooting a 540 grain hard-cast bullet that will shoot through several hogs. The Tri-Ball loads should do the same thing but I'd have more projectiles.
If I use the SOCOM....I can place the shot with great precision since the rifle has a scope. If I use my shotgun....I can send more projectiles downrange... but it is open sighted and I can't really predict the shot 'spread'
So....what say the forum members? Should I stick with what I know works (SOCOM) and take from 1 to 3 pigs, or try the shotgun and perhaps take more?
Actually, I have no idea which of the two scenarios you presented would be more effective, but I'd probably go with the SOCOM.
This is a perfect opportunity to see just how effective the DTB rounds are at range and on live hog flesh. You already know what will happen with the SOCOM.
Well....as it turns out, neither scenario came to fruition. I decided to take my SOCOM just in case a big boar showed up.
The hogs came back again (like I thought they would).... and they bunched up again (like I thought they would) BUT they did all this earlier in the day.....so Flint wasn't there to take advantage of it.
I put corn out and checked the camera at about 10 a.m. this morning. The hogs had previously been coming during the daylight hours, but recently switched to showing up just after dark. The weather here was threatening rain...so I thought I'd go to the stand extra early (about 4:30 this afternoon) in case the hogs were moving.
I decided to take the Land Cruiser instead of my Early Model Bronco because it is quieter....and I wanted to park within a couple hundred yards of the stand in case it started raining hard while I was on stand. I parked the vehicle out in the end of the pasture, quietly closed the doors and started making my way to the stand being careful to not make any noise.
Before reaching my stand I looked beyond it and could see a single hog with 3 piglets feeding in the bait hole. So I got my binoculars out and scanned the area around the pig (all heavily wooded) for other animals. Nothing to be seen.
Knowing it is quite unusual for a Sow to be by herself, I surmised she was either an early arrival (not likely) or a straggler from the group and the hogs had already been there. I eased my way closer using a few trees to hide myself. I got within 60 yds and could go no further without exposing myself. So I braced against a tree, settled the crosshairs on the pigs shoulder and pressed the trigger.
The 540 grain bullet creates enough recoil that you lose your sight picture through the scope, but as soon as the rifle settled back down...the familiar scene of a crumpled pig appeared. In this case the pig just dropped right into the muddy hole she was eating out of. No squeal, no grunt, no sound....just dropped dead right there. It was a small Sow...perhaps 80 lbs. but they ALL need to go. The piglets scattered and never returned (surprisingly). I waited until dark to see if any other hogs would show, but none did. The weather was worsening...so I bailed out while I could. Will check the camera tomorrow to see what happens overnight tonight.
Flint, in the interest of reducing the population, if you only have one shot, is it better to take a sow?
So, while not a multiple kill, at least there's yet another feral hog down.
Keep after 'em!
Paul....I would say it depends on the circumstance. I have argued the question on other forums and feel that in most situations a Boar and Sow are equally valuable targets. That was met with quite a bit of resistance...with some folks suggesting I had taken 'ignorance' to new heights.
I would be happy to address the question in another thread if anyone wants to start one.
IMO....the very 'best' hog you can kill are the juveniles...as they have yet to reproduce and haven't been around long enough to have done a lot of damage to the environment. But that approach applies chiefly to efforts that are 'preventative' and long term in nature.
Conversely, if you can only hunt occasionally and happen upon a pregnant Sow, then obviously She should be high on your list. A pregnant Sow might represent a tally of up to 11 pigs killed (the Sow and up to 10 fetuses on board).
Personally, I will go to great lengths to drop what I am doing and pursue any Mature Boars that I see on the property. The reason being....one boar can 'service' many Sows over a large area in a short period of time AND they tend to be harder to hunt (most places) since they are solitary, cover a lot of ground and generally are not predictable as to when they show up.
Others will staunchly defend the idea that 'Sows' are always the best target "Because they are the baby making factories". I think this notion is held over from an Animal Husbandry point of view where conditions are tightly controlled and I submit it does not transfer well to Wild Hogs.
My official position is as follows: Kill ANY hog you have a chance to dispatch, Male/Female/Mature/Juveniles/Piglets....it doesn't matter. Because in the grand scheme of things....ALL of them represent future generations of pigs and tremendous damage to the environment.... if left to breed.
There are lots of variables and many things to consider if we hope to significantly reduce the population. I find some folks to be shallow thinking and dogmatic in their beliefs with respect to the best approach. But that is another subject for another day.
Your question (a good one) concerns having only one shot (one opportunity) to make a short term impact.
In that limited scope....I'd have to say:
1. Pregnant Sow
2. Mature Sow
3. Mature Boar
Thank you, Flint, it makes sense if you can identify a pregnant sow to go after that one. To switch gears a little, in the interest of eating a wild hog, I don't know if you have an opinion but recently read that a 90-140 lb. boar makes the best eating, as a sow that has been nursing can have had the life sucked out of her, so to speak. Similar to the idea that a dry cow elk is better eating than a cow elk that has been nursing. That is contrary to what most people think.
Obviously you still want to get it dressed ASAP and remove the little scent glands from that boar.
This is an example of a good spot to place a snare. I’ve had this group of hogs coming into a bait site for a couple of weeks. Normally they would not approach a terminal site (end point) such as a feeding or watering area as quickly as this group does…but it is a very secluded area and I don’t put much pressure on them.
In the first video you will note how briskly they go under the fence line and descend upon the bait.
I placed a few sticks in the wires of the fence line to help persuade them to go to one side of the metal fence post (right hand side). A couple of days later…I set a snare in that spot, hoping that one of the little hogs wouldn’t be the first to go through. But as luck would have it…that is exactly what happened.
I always crimp a small ‘stop’ on my snares that will not allow the loop to close down any smaller than 6” in diameter. I do that avoid foot snaring animals such as deer, etc… Of course that means smaller pigs will escape the snare too (as was the case here), but that is fine.
Anyway, the point of the video is to show a typical ‘fence crossing’ set and to stress the importance of placing your snare in spot where the pigs are moving at a good pace. This will increase your catch rate dramatically.
Hogs are used to pushing through vines, brush and weeds….BUT if they encounter too much resistance they will stop and back out of the situation. A snare loop is more likely to ‘close’ down on the animal IF they hit it at a good pace. I catch most hogs at night since it less likely they will spot the snare and they tend to travel quickly at night.
So…just a couple of tips on using snares. Good luck.
Here's my contribution to helping control central texas hogs. Shot with 300 blk at 80 yds with 130 gr hog hammer ammo. Shredded the heart.
Had a small (still striped) piglet in the snare this afternoon when I went to go pull the cards from the game cameras.
I'm surprised it didn't get loose. All it would have needed to have done was pull BACKWARDS one good time. The loop had closed up tight against the 'deer stop' I put on each snare...but it was not choking the piglet in any way. After it managed to wrap itself all around a metal fence post, it just laid down (videos show).
Lots of 'squealing' when I picked it up of course, but when I turned it loose it ran off seemingly no worse for the wear.
The group is coming into the bait site every day (about mid day) and then again sometimes late in the afternoon, but I need to wait for a favorable wind (Easterly) if I hope to shoot any of them. The mosquitoes in that area are pretty much unbearable right now...so I don't want to have to wait a long time for the pigs to show up. We call that stand 'The Blood Donor' for a reason.
Flint... I'm curious why you let the shoat go? They grow up to be hogs!
Yes, they do grow up...no arguing that.
"Why" did I let it go? I don't know. Maybe I felt a bit of compassion for it. It had been laying there all night long...alone. I am quite surprised Coyotes didn't find it overnight. Normally I would not give any hog a reprieve as I consider all of them destructive vermin.
But something inside of me was telling me to just let this one go. Not one to question such visceral feelings...I walked the piglet over to the brush line and put it down. It ran like it's tail had caught fire and after 15-20 yds. I could no longer see it.
I have little doubt we will meet again...and in that day the outcome will likely be different, but today was not that day.
I'm glad this thread is active again. Was the reason I kept coming back to this forum.
Have a blessed day,
Just wanted to say thank you for the best thread I've read anywhere online.
Great read, fantastic information, and an up close look at invasive species managment techniques in a real world environment.
Tons of great strategy here.
Great job on a great thread.
Thanks Flint. I was not questioning. Just curious if there was a reason you let the little thing go. And 'just because it seemed like the thing to do' is plenty good enough reason.
I've been following this thread for a while now and learn new things all the time. Thank you for the time and effort you put into this thread.
Tannerite with the socom for maximum kills. When they are all around the tannerite, set it off with the socom.
Awesome thread, I enjoy reading it.
Wow, what a thread! I found this a few days ago and have steadily worked my way through, reading every post as I went.
Great work Flintknapper - impressive to keep this thread active for so long and even more impressive that you're still out there, fighting the good fight against these hogs.
Please, keep it up - I'll continue to follow this thread and hope to continue to be regaled with the tales of your exploits.
Watch at the right hand part of the video and you will see a young 'Sow' almost get caught in a snare I have set.
She got lucky and the loop closed down around her snout before she got her head all the way through it. And since I put 'deer stops' on all my snares, the loop could not pull down tight enough to hold her. All she had to do was pull backwards and the snare slipped right off her tapered snout.
Sows, unlike Boars... do not have a prominent set of 'whetters' (upper tusks) for the snare to lodge behind.
This Boar also was also caught by the snout...but you can see how the snare loop got behind his whetters and he could not pull it loose.
I don't often catch hogs by the snout (Boars or Sows) as long as their mouths are closed. More often they are caught when they push through the loop with their mouth open and then the loop usually stays put. A 'snout catch' is not something you want because the hog will be very much alive (and unhappy) when you find it. Thankfully it doesn't happen often.
So...right now the hogs are winning until I get a good Easterly wind and can set up to shoot some of them. Win some, lose some.
I've been wondering how you decided on the .458 SOCOM for your hog gun - the two most obvious competitors to that caliber when building a big bore AR are the .450 Bushmaster and the .50 Beowulf. (I'm guessing you're going to tell me bullet selection?... Just something I've been trying to figure out myself and was wondering what swayed you your direction) thanks!
All are capable Big Bore offerings. I looked at all three when deciding to build a dedicated Hog Gun. After careful consideration (and some amount of personal preference) I determined the SOCOM would be best for 'me'.
At the time...all three of these cartridges were still pretty much in their infancy, so none of them had a 'reputation' that made one stand out from the others. I knew whichever I chose....I would be reloading my ammo for it, so finding commercial ammo was not a concern.
In the end....the things that swayed me to the SOCOM were:
1. Bullet choice (anything from 100 grains to 600 grains). This was a big factor.
2. The SOCOM cartridge head spaces on the shoulder (the other two on the rim). This is largely personal preference and a non-issue for most folks but there are reasons why I think it is better.
3. I wanted an accurate rifle. At the time... Marty ter Weeme (inventor of the cartridge) lived a couple of hours away from me and was available to build a custom 'upper' for me. I wanted certain features (Stainless Pac-Nor Super Match Barrel, threaded, my choice of Receiver and hand guard). Six months after placing my order...I received the upper and found out just why his work was of such great demand. If I were to get another SOCOM today (since Marty is presently overseas), I would commission Tromix to build it.
Anyway, there is plenty of debate over the 3 cartridges, all have their strong points. All will put down hogs with authority.
'Fewer' Feral Hogs is the goal. Any of the Big Bores mentioned (with good heavy bullets at moderate ranges) will afford you shot angles that might better be passed up with certain other cartridges.
Separate names with a comma.