Cannonball888
Member
"I'll get my 1 minute of media attention somehow!" **bang bang** "ouch, ouch".
Officer shot in chest later admits shooting himself (San Antonio, TX)
- Thread starter Spreadfire Arms
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cpttango30
Member
How in the world do you shoot yourself twice. I have never shot myself but I am assuming that the first one is going to really freekin hurt. I hate to do it but you have to give the man cudos for shooting himself twice that takes some intestinal fortitude.
rkh
member
I'm the only one in this room professional enough *BAM*... that I know of *BAM*... to carry this Glock fohtay!
sacp81170a
Member
I am ex-military also. I know about chains of command. The problem comes when you paint the whole group with a broad brush. Is the whole military corrupt because of what happened at Abu Ghraib? That line of reasoning leads to the "nanny state" we all love to hate. Are all gun owners bad because one person does something stupid with a gun? We argue that the anti-gunners are painting us with a broad brush and then folks here turn around and do the same thing to others.
Pot to kettle, pot to kettle, come in, kettle....
sacp81170a
Member
Same fallacy, along with a couple of specious assertions.
What about their families, friends and the psychologist who examined them for mental fitness for the job? Just what sort of selection process would you put in place of the obviously defective one now in effect? What error rate would you deem acceptable? (Hint: you ain't gonna get perfection...)
Patently false. We just had a case in my area of the whole police force of a small town fired by the mayor and city council because of numerous citizen complaints. They were corrupt and they deserved to be fired, and I'm glad they were. Who cleaned up? The outraged citizens, that's who.
Corrupt police forces flourish because of corrupt politicians who don't listen to the citizens. Who puts the corrupt politicians in power?
Pilgrim
Member
About ten years ago an officer in central CA shot himself with his .380 backup gun, then told responding officers he was shot by someone he had detained. After a furious manhunt, some questions were raised about the inconsistencies in his story. He confessed he did it to himself to gain sympathy/respect/hero adulation.
He was fired and charged with filing a false crime report.
Pilgrim
He was fired and charged with filing a false crime report.
Pilgrim
kd7nqb
Member
assuming this is on purpose why didn't he drop the vest?
posted by sacp81170a:
OK. OK. I absolve all "good" cops of any responsibility.
Bad cops are entirely a problem for us civilians alone (that's for sure!). Police officers have no moral obligation to do anything to clean up their profession. It's OK to stand by (as the second officer did in Missouri) and let an unsuitable thug (pardon, "officer") abuse citizens verbally and physically. A police officer's duty to support the blue line completely surpasses all else.
OK. OK. I absolve all "good" cops of any responsibility.
Bad cops are entirely a problem for us civilians alone (that's for sure!). Police officers have no moral obligation to do anything to clean up their profession. It's OK to stand by (as the second officer did in Missouri) and let an unsuitable thug (pardon, "officer") abuse citizens verbally and physically. A police officer's duty to support the blue line completely surpasses all else.
The officer is obviously in crisis, made and EXTRAORDINARILY bad choice and compounded all his troubles by hiding the truth. A desperate act from a desperate person. Thank God he didn't carry out any murder suicide scenarios and no other person was physically harmed...this could have proven a much more grave situation. I won't jump on the wagon and start carpeting LEO's or the profession of which that he was a part. Certainly the 'person' must stand accountable first. The same could be said of firefighters who have had fellow members start fires for much more selfish or absurd gains. There are more people in these careers who can carry out their duties with professionalism and heroism than what the carrion-eating media report.
Officers'Wife
Member
Hi F4,
That much sarcasm even offends MY sensitivities! But he does have a good point. The "thin blue line" makes it impossible for the police to police themselves. It's too much in the order of the wolves guarding the henhouse.
Personnally, I strongly believe in civilian reveiw boards elected by the voters and completely separate from the executive branch. I started a petition for such when I lived in Indiana... the results were at the least interesting.
Selena
That much sarcasm even offends MY sensitivities! But he does have a good point. The "thin blue line" makes it impossible for the police to police themselves. It's too much in the order of the wolves guarding the henhouse.
Personnally, I strongly believe in civilian reveiw boards elected by the voters and completely separate from the executive branch. I started a petition for such when I lived in Indiana... the results were at the least interesting.
Selena
Roccobro
Member
This guy knew the consequences to his lies and actions. He deserves what he will get (termination and psych evals for a while).
However, F4GIB- In your last cop thread I told you the requirements of LE in CA and how they can be prosecuted for failing to act and/or report abuse of power. Did you already forget that?
Justin
However, F4GIB- In your last cop thread I told you the requirements of LE in CA and how they can be prosecuted for failing to act and/or report abuse of power. Did you already forget that?
Your claims keep getting wilder and wilder my friend. Please don't double tap yourself in the chest for attention. Please.
Justin
ScottS
Member
What? The guy's going to get detention?
MD_Willington
Member
Was the phrase "Here hold my beer".. involved in this scenario...?
sacp81170a
Member
The problem here is that you lump all "cops" together as if every single one of us knows what all the others are doing wrong and willfully turn a blind eye to it. The hodgepodge of jurisdictions in my little corner of the world prevents me from working regularly with more than a few people. Your assertion that "we" should clean up "our" profession rests on the false assumption that there is a single controlling entity. Nothing could be further from the truth. Unlike the military, there is no unified command structure. We have state, local, county and federal agencies that have arrest powers in my jurisdiction. Some of our officers don't even know that the Railroad Police have exclusive jurisdiction over the railroad right-of-ways that run through our town.
It's our job to clean up the problems that we know about. To cast suspicion on everyone who wears a badge because somewhere someone of us is doing something stupid or wrong is a sweeping generalization. Your statement above is called "argumentum ad absurdum" since you won't admit there is a middle ground to the argument. You assert that only police can clean up their own house and I provided evidence to the contrary. You then state that "only" civilians are responsible, which is also false. I've stated again and again that I'm glad to see corrupt and incompetent police leave the job, so I am one example that your "thin blue line" theory is a faulty generalization .
Back on topic, what a dufus. If I were one of the other officers involved in the search, I'd be plenty mad.
frankcostanza
Member
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he almoooooost had himself a darwin award. so close
Old Dog
Member
F4GIB stated
Additionally, in my limited life experience with but a mere half-century on this earth, I have known a few people who committed entirely unexpected, unpredictable, bizarre and randomly shocking acts -- and even those closest to them had no idea that these folks suffered from any sort of mental disorder.
Now, I could be wrong here, but this, to me, does seem to enter the realm of "cop-bashing" (just a bit). I'd also have to ask Mr. F4GIB just how he knows this, as his statements totally contradict my personal experience.
Additionally, in my limited life experience with but a mere half-century on this earth, I have known a few people who committed entirely unexpected, unpredictable, bizarre and randomly shocking acts -- and even those closest to them had no idea that these folks suffered from any sort of mental disorder.
No. I read it as a single jurisdiction's requirement to report "criminal" conduct. Most states don't even have that. The vast majority of the conduct that indicates an officer is "unsuitable" is not criminal but thuggish. At least that was my experience in 9 years on a police civil service appeal board. It's stuff that only the victim (often not a #1 citizen) and the other cops see or hear. Without videotape, the victim has a real uphill battle even getting heard by the Chief.
I have known no one real close who has gone off the deep end, but one casual acquaintance committed suicide 15 or 20 years. Everyone who knew her was just stunned. Even more so that she used a firearm to do it.
You just can't tell what is going on in deep, dark recesses of someone's mind.
Bazooka Joe71
Member
Uh, no you don't.
sacp81170a posted:
Of course, it is hyperbole. The entire paragraph is written "tongue in cheek."
Everyone should be interested in working to keep unsuitable persons out of positions of physical and legal power. But, when it comes to identifying and removing unsuitable police officers, it is primarily a job for the good police. Always has been, always will be.
Officers'Wife posted:
That makes it difficult.
Of course, it is hyperbole. The entire paragraph is written "tongue in cheek."
Everyone should be interested in working to keep unsuitable persons out of positions of physical and legal power. But, when it comes to identifying and removing unsuitable police officers, it is primarily a job for the good police. Always has been, always will be.
Officers'Wife posted:
That makes it difficult.
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Dorryn
Member
Poor guy. 
beaucoup ammo
Member
The guy cost the city's tax payers thousands! Officers went house to house, waking residents and alarming them with word of a cop shooter on the loose.
sacp81170a
Member
Ah, now we're getting to the middle ground we can both agree on.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that since you were on an appeal board, you normally saw the "bad" or sub standard officers (else why would they be appearing before an appeal board?) We share the feeling that the bad ones need to be weeded out and that the good ones should help this along as much as possible. From your previous statements I was getting the implication that you were accusing all police of being corrupt because a few were actually corrupt, guilt by association, as it were. I apologize if I was misreading your intent.
Where a police department is responsive to the citizens, the few corrupt officers have a much harder time getting away with it. I have observed this in action. Where the political structure of a city is populated by corrupt individuals, the police department is far more likely to have that spirit of corruption that makes it easy for groups like the Rampart CRASH Unit and the Chicago PD to survive and flourish(there's still controversy as to whether the allegations in the Rampart scandal are true).
Cops are human beings, subject to all the follies and foibles of that species. They don't deserve to be treated any differently in the eyes of the law and I was always taught that they derived their authority from the authority of the common citizen. Sadly, the nanny staters have encouraged many to rely on the police for protection while at the same time making it nearly impossible for the police to perform that function in a free society. It's a catch 22 and everybody but the practitioners of the Hegelian dialectic for obtaining power is caught in the middle. Righteous indignation against the ones who step over the line, especially in light of the authority entrusted to them, is correct. We just shouldn't let it bleed over to the majority who want to make the world a safer place and yet want to live to go home and spend that huge paycheck that they're earning.
macadore
Member
Not a real officer
Many of you miss one important point. This was a campus cop and not a member of the San Antonio Police Department. I have lived in places with incompetent corrupt police and I have lived in San Antonio for the past four years. That is not the case here. The SAPD is a class act.
Many of you miss one important point. This was a campus cop and not a member of the San Antonio Police Department. I have lived in places with incompetent corrupt police and I have lived in San Antonio for the past four years. That is not the case here. The SAPD is a class act.
Roccobro
Member
I see where your coming from now and can sympathize. I liken that prejudice to the 10/15/20 year veteran cop that treats EVERY person he contacts as criminals. The 3% of the population, taking up 90% of his uniformed life- day-in, day-out for hundreds of months. Now THAT attitude by cops are the more common anger inducing law abiding citizen complaint I hear about in real life, and here on the forum boards.
This Campus cop will get his. Hope he gets the help he needs.
Justin
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