old powder

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flatsticks

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Hope this is posted in the correct section .

Got an inline muzzleloader from my Dad and cleaned the rust out of he bore, it came out pretty good .

took it to the range and at 50 yars it was pretty accurate and about 1/2 to 1inch high of the aim point.

Brought it home and cleaned it out and went back a couple days later and shot at 100 yards .

Shot 3 times removed the breech plug and cleaned the gun .

took 6 shots total and most of them were at least a foot low and missed the target , was shocked .

There was one shot that was only 4inches below the aiming point.

Was using Pyrodex pellets 50, 2 of them for 100 and a 245 bullet, same as 50 yard target .

The powder is very old and stored in the original box , sure it is not airtight .

The gun went off in an instant every time .

Was shooting of a very good rest and was taking my time .

Thinking maybe the powder is not like it was when it was new ?
 
Seems like you all are thinking what I am that the pellets r could be a problem.

Will see if I can find any pellets or powder local.

Deer season is only a few weeks away, not sure how much time I will have to mess with a powder charge.

Think my Dad has one package of pyrodex pellets that are in the original package and still sealed , never opened .

No sure how old they are though .

Not too many shops local and wonder if switching to triple 7 pellets would be good as they may have them in stock .
 
You really need to find the best accuracy load. I am assuming this is a .50? Start off with 60 grains of powder and shoot a group of three, increase by 5 grains, repeat until you get the smallest group. I would ditch the pellets on account the rifle may not like that load. You can make paper cartridges easy enough with the proper load, they will load just as fast as those silly pellets.
 
I have no experience with Pyrodex pellets, only granulated. I have some that has been around for years and can tell no difference in it and new although I have never chronoed a load. I prefer the ability that granulated gives you to taylor your load for the best accuracy. I have never found great accuracy with 100 grains of powder in a 50 caliber gun. The post above gives good advice on how to develope an accurate load. 60 to 75 grains have given me the best out of my 3 different frfles. Round balls have poor ballistics and drop rapidly so take that into consideration at longer distances.
 
I notice no difference between old and new Pyrodex. It and Swiss perform about the same. Goex isn't in the same class with either one. I have Pyrodex powder, Goex, Old Eynsford and Swiss. I think the new Goex is starting to be available. I'm anxious to see how it compares.
 
Pyrodex doesn't age well and I've never seen pellets shoot accurately. Get some loose powder and do some load development
 
dave951 said:
Pyrodex doesn't age well and I've never seen pellets shoot accurately. Get some loose powder and do some load development
Click to expand...
My son has a 45 caliber Contender rifle barrel that shoots very accurately with pellets and bullets up to 385 grains. He also shoots sabots and 40 caliber bullets for antelope. Every time he shows up with that abomination I just shake my head and think about how much he takes after his mother. ;-)

I did try pellets in a few different sidelocks and couldn’t get the accuracy I needed.
 
Acorn Mush said:
I have very little experience with Pyrodex but have read many times that it does lose potency with age. If you can lay your hands on some real black powder you will have a propellant the potency of which will last for several lifetimes.

Good luck in your endeavors.
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Years ago I did an experiment. I soaked a few ounces of 2F Goex and let it dry out over the course of several days, It went off when I loaded some in a 45-70 case, just as nasty as ever.
 
tark said:
Years ago I did an experiment. I soaked a few ounces of 2F Goex and let it dry out over the course of several days, It went off when I loaded some in a 45-70 case, just as nasty as ever.
Click to expand...

I watched a documentary years ago where they brought up a loaded cannon from a ship that sunk 400 years ago. They unloaded it and dried it out and set it off. back in the 70's there was a farmer about 60 miles from here that plowed up a Springfield rifle barrel. He thought it would make a good gate hinge. He stuck the breech in his forge and the minie ball hit him between the eyes.
 
hawg said:
I watched a documentary years ago where they brought up a loaded cannon from a ship that sunk 400 years ago. They unloaded it and dried it out and set it off. back in the 70's there was a farmer about 60 miles from here that plowed up a Springfield rifle barrel. He thought it would make a good gate hinge. He stuck the breech in his forge and the minie ball hit him between the eyes.
Click to expand...

Almost 60 years ago I got my start in muzzleloading and was fortunate enough to befriend an older gentleman (born in 1908) who taught me a lot about shooting and handloading. At that time, he still had a small supply of DuPont 2fg black powder he had gotten from his father. He estimated it was made in the 1870s or 80s. It shot every bit as well as the then-currently manufactured DuPont powder I had just gotten. If any of that powder was still around today, I would bet it was just as good as the day it was made - given reasonable storage conditions. Black powder remains stable and useable for a VERY long time as evidenced by Mr. Hawg's post.
 
When the ironclad Cairo was raised from the Mississippi River, the cannonballs were retrieved. The plugs were removed and the wet powder put on in the sun. After being dried, it was found to go boom!
 
Speaking of the Cairo it's on display at Vicksburg MS. They have a nice museum of artifacts removed from it.
 
hawg said:
Speaking of the Cairo it's on display at Vicksburg MS. They have a nice museum of artifacts removed from it.
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While visiting that museum about 12 years ago, I met and spoke to a lady who claimed that her great grandfather was responsible for sinking the Cairo. Apparently, it was done-in by a 5-gallon demi-john filled with black powder which was tied to an underwater wooden spar and detonated electrically from shore. Perhaps a Layden jar was used as a power source? Anyhow, the lady said that because of the sinking, Federal officers were after her great grandfather for many years after the war and that he had had to change his name a number of times in order to evade them. I have no idea of the veracity of her tale, but it seemed plausible to me. Made for a good story at any rate.
 
My one friend is still a Pyrodex fan and offered up his caplock gun to test it. He reported no change in point of impact at 100 yards. After 30 years the old Pyrodex performed quite well. He compared my old stuff to some recent Pyrodex he had just purchased.
I found this on the web. I've been shooting Pyrodex over 25 years and never has a problems with it losing power. Does it lose something? I don't know other to say it still hits where I expect it to at 100 yard targets. Now with regard to pellets, it depends on how the pellets are used.
Pellets are to be crushed when rammed home for consistent combustion when ignited. So there are a lot of variables to take in consideration on how you load and prime your front stuffer.
 
Some pellets have black powder on 1 side as a primer to help the main charge get started. Forget brand or type. Looks darker then the rest of the pellet.

Can only be loaded the 1 way.

Google found this-
Which way do Pyrodex pellets go in?


Note: Pyrodex pellets must be loaded into the muzzle with the darker end of the pellet first, due to the dark end having a special igniting charge that ensures complete ignition.Aug 25, 2015
1696289799171.png
https://muzzle-loaders.com › blogs

Loading a Muzzleloader | Muzzle-Loaders.com​

 
Somewhere along the way, I've heard tell that Pyrodex pellets and Pyrodex powder are not from the same formula.
So experience from either may not be so relevent to the other.
 
Thomasss said:
My one friend is still a Pyrodex fan and offered up his caplock gun to test it. He reported no change in point of impact at 100 yards. After 30 years the old Pyrodex performed quite well. He compared my old stuff to some recent Pyrodex he had just purchased.
Click to expand...

When my ex's step dad died her mom gave me his CVA Hawken. It hadn't been used in 12 years. All he had was Pyrodex RS and some lead conicals and round balls. I discovered it to be loaded. His measure was set to 90 grains. I capped it and fired it. It went off on the first try and the recoil was what I'd expect from 90 grains and a conical.
 
I worked with a gentleman collector of Civil War firearms and related paraphernalia in the 1990's. He enjoyed collecting and was not ever a shooter. It never occurred to him that the 10 5# kegs of powder were still function-able as meant over a hundred twenty+ years ago [at the time].

He asked what to do with the black powder seeping out of the kegs. I gave him instructions and he asked me to come over and help him. I swept up a little powder and demonstrated it to him. Once he settled down, all the kegs were dumped and watered into the woodline behind his house. Really a shame to waste it all, but if his wife found out....

No, I didn't get to keep any powder. But I was given some Civil War rimfire ammo. That I still have .
 
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