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open carry for blackpowder revolvers ?

Discussion in 'Blackpowder' started by candymancan, Jul 30, 2021.

  1. GEM

    GEM Moderator Emeritus

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    Open carry in urban environments may not work out. While this is a police incident, it points out that you can be targeted for your firearm: https://www.police1.com/ambush/articles/fbi-man-stabbed-pentagon-officer-without-provocation-shot-himself-with-officers-gun-fWchqNIkMEe75XyV/?utm_source=Police1&utm_campaign=be624f5dfa-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2021_08_06_04_05&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_5584e6920b-be624f5dfa-83999136

    As far as the suggestion to carry what you trained with and are effective, shooting at the square range is not training for actual self-defense and carrying a less than optimal firearm is not to be reinforced on the theme of what you are comfortable with. The better solution is to come up to speed with a realistic firearm with realistic training. I grant you that studies show that the vat proportion of carriers have no significant training but that is not a good standard. I've said this position repeatedly. Like I said, this isn't COS play with obsolete firearms or the gun rotation of the day (that you never really practiced or trained with intensively). Making a single shot shotgun 'tactical' is in the same vein. Oh, wow - it looks cool. Yes, Clint Smith can run one. Maybe that's all you have - but there are reasonable pump guns that aren't expensive, so get one. If you have a 1911 you can't shoot, learn how or ditch it for a modern semi and learn how. Then get comfortable and effective.
     
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  2. Tommygunn

    Tommygunn Member

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    Seriously, you suggest President Biden is someone worthy to take advice from?????? :what::scrutiny:
     
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  3. woodnbow
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    woodnbow Contributing Member

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    Gosh! Who’s advice should I take? GEM or the PRESIDENT OF THE FREAKING UNITED STATES?
     
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  4. Tommygunn

    Tommygunn Member

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    Only a Democrat would have trouble deciding that!!! :neener: :D
     
  5. candymancan

    candymancan member

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    There is something wrong with it or th3 mags. Two mags wont rack the last round.. it jams the gun and actually bends the brass casing as i eject it. It also wont EJECT i have to tilt the gun upside down to get it out.

    Gun also shoot way to the left.. i aim dead center and my shots are all to the left.. If i aim on the 7-6 to the right on charts.. itll hit 0-9 if that makes sense ?

    Not happy with this 1911.

    As for my recoil issues firing in rapid repetition. Yes no doubt that is my issue.. holding the 45acp recoil and rapid firing and not being able to maintain my aim.

    I need to work on that.

    Thanks all again for your opinions
     
  6. MacAR

    MacAR Member

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    Care to share the name of the series? It sounds mighty interesting!

    Now, on to the subject at hand. I've never felt very good about OC in public; like others, I always thought it'd draw too much attention. Were I in the OP's shoes, I would (can't believe I'm saying this...) swap the 1911 for a nice CC pistol and go that route. I have carried my '51/'61 hybrid Navy on several woods jaunts and while I don't feel under-gunned, I can think of a couple situations where I'd much rather have a .357 or .45 on my person rather than a cap & ball gun; mainly for speed/ease of reloading. Now, having said that, I suppose that a person could carry paper cartridges with him and could reload somewhat faster than with loose powder and ball. I do not know, and would have to experiment with it a bit.

    Mac
     
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  7. gtrgy888

    gtrgy888 Member

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    You’d be surprised how quick paper cartridges can be reloaded, and if you have a star capper it saves time as well.
     
  8. MacAR

    MacAR Member

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    What, exactly, is a star capper? I'm familiar with the Ted Cash and inline style, don't guess I've ever heard of one of those. I'm looking hard at rolling my own cartridges now, just need to find some .380 conicals. It would certainly save a lot of fumbling around with flask, balls/bullets, and caps.

    Mac
     
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  9. Lyle

    Lyle Member

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  10. rodwha

    rodwha Member

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  11. MacAR

    MacAR Member

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    Agreed! Thanks @Lyle!

    Mac
     
  12. dickydalton

    dickydalton Member

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    Both times I needed a gun it was my Model 29 no dash and i didn't shoot it but did have to clean some blood and gum tissue of the front sight the first time!
     
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  13. arcticap

    arcticap Member

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    TC makes the Star 7 capper. --->>> https://www.muzzle-loaders.com/thompson-center-star-7-capper-31007015.html
    I know it works with the Remington 1858 but never tried it with Colts.
    It's a softer plastic than the one that Mesawinds sells, and the fingers that hold the caps are thicker but more pliable.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  14. Almar

    Almar Member

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    I built a few 1911s, in fact the one I carry is the last one I built. These pistols are like old chevys, you need to be able to do some fixing and figuring on your own. Sometimes its just one little dimension that is off and it becomes a nightmare. I always use Wilson combat parts and mags, they never let me down, sig mags are also great. Shuemann and kart barrels. Once I had the worst time trying to figure out why my brass kept hitting me in the face all the time, turns out my ejector just needed a little filing and now its great, perfect little pile of brass at 4 o'clock. another time, my ramped barrel was just a few thou aft and it would be completely unreliable, so a made a block with the perfect angle and milled my ramp back to the right dimension, its now perfectly reliable. Its just like that with these old designs, each one is unique.
     
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  15. grter

    grter Member

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    1911s are made to be loose and sloppy (in comparison to some of the ones made today) with sloppy but adequate accuracy. This is when they function flawlessly in the mist of dirt and crap without a whole bunch of fitting and fiddling.

    Turning them into precision firearms with 1 MOA accuracy is to me almost a redesign.
     
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  16. CraigC
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    CraigC Sixgun Nut

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    This rhetoric about "fantasy" and "cosplay" cuts both ways. People obviously have fantasies and wild notions of running gunfights with hordes of gang bangers, along the lines of Die Hard or John Wick, that is also not congruent with reality.

    People also have ideas that their "modern" equipment is such a huge advantage over other weapon types. They cannot fathom how any reasonable person could or would choose differently from them.

    Where metal meets flesh and the balance of life & death is tipped in one direction or another, your mindset, your situational awareness and your skill with the weapon you are carrying at the time will have a far greater effect on the outcome than magazine capacity and your ability to rapidly send 15rds downrange.

    I don't often carry a single action revolver concealed but I'm 100% comfortable in doing so. Because I have spent untold hundreds of hours and tens of thousands of rounds getting and staying proficient with them, running them fast. What I usually carry is a single stack 9mm. Not because of any perceived advantage in doing the job but because they're lighter and flatter. Since we're being "brutal" in our honesty, if you really think a semi-auto is a huge advantage in your average gun fight, it ain't. If I can draw and fire five shots in 3secs, there is no advantage whatsoever for the first cylinderful.

    That said, I've never suggested anyone carry a single action revolver. I've only explained why I'm comfortable in doing so. To date, I've had this discussion dozens of times and NEVER has there been an argument against by someone with any appreciable experience with the single action revolver. NEVER. It's always those with the least experience that argue the loudest.
     
  17. GEM

    GEM Moderator Emeritus

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    I've hit six targets in 3.75 seconds with a 1911 from the draw. Three shots left. Then I can reload much faster than a SAA. Of course, the more intense gunfight will never happen. We all know that. It is only the single economically motivated mugger.

    I also can drive stick cars reasonably well and might still remember some DOS commands. What is the point, the OP picked a less than optimal carry configuration. As usual folks defend it because of - who the heck knows. I can only offer advice that one can do better.
     
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  18. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    The 1958 and and 1860 .44 Army revolvers were replaced by the SAA, the Colt New Army, the 1911, the Beretta, and ....

    I wonder why.
     
  19. GEM

    GEM Moderator Emeritus

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    There will always be a tantrum when something new comes along. I recall Jeff Cooper flipping out over the move from 30.06 to 308. We were going to lose the Cold War. Not really on topic.

    To summarize:

    1. OC is not optimal in the majority opinion of most experts
    2. A BP gun certainly is not unless you postulate the one opponent, few shots scenario as always happening.
    3. The OP demonstrated the need for a quality semi and instruction in usage.

    What else is there to say in this thread?
     
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  20. CraigC
    • Contributing Member

    CraigC Sixgun Nut

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    That depends on the individual. What people can't seem to fathom is that others might have different preferences. You assume that everyone is going to train with the same platform as you and to the same degree. That may or may not be the case. My argument is that self defense training is practicing for something that will in all likelihood never happen. I shoot single action revolvers in preparation for what I know WILL happen and has happened every year for 35yrs. I hunt with them and carry them afield regularly. If I do 90% of my handgun shooting with single actions and 10% with the rest, there are very good reasons for that. It makes no sense for me to spend equal time with more socially acceptable defensive handguns. It's the Indian, not the arrow.
     
  21. CraigC
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    CraigC Sixgun Nut

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    It's not a tantrum and I won't allow my position to be characterized as such. This is not a resistance to change, being a "Fudd" or an old stick in the mud. This is an honest assessment of my own ability with a given platform. I've spent more time with these over the last year than most other guns. Apparently there's a lot more to be said in this thread. :confused:

    Beretta%20M9A3%2001.jpg

    003.jpg
     
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  22. GEM

    GEM Moderator Emeritus

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    That's all fine. The OP was making bad decisions. If you are or not a Fudd, I really don't care.
     
  23. CraigC
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    CraigC Sixgun Nut

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    You basically don't care for anything that contradicts your opinion. Got it.
     
  24. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    That's a fact. GEM will not dispute it.

    But one can have better or worse tools, too.

    Two ex-Texas Navy Colt Patterson revolvers afforded each Ranger one heck of an advantage over their single shot pistols.
     
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  25. CraigC
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    CraigC Sixgun Nut

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    Yeah but those tools are only better A) if you train with them and B) if you can actually use what they offer. At some point there's a law of diminishing returns. For law enforcement or military use, a single action revolver is dumber than crap. Civilian self defense is an entirely different matter. Different purposes mandating different tools. For LE or military, you can justify the need for a full sized semi-auto carrying 15rds or more. Our needs are purely defensive and if we're smart, we're exiting the scene where there's gunfire. IMHO, there's a sizable gap between what people need and what they think they need.

    Here's another point. There's a HUGE segment of the concealed carry crowd that packs a .38 snub and nothing else. I can tell you right now that I am a far more dangerous individual with a 4¾" SAA than a .38 snub. Do we have 'this' conversation every time someone asks about carrying one of those? Nope.
     
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