P365 Recoil Spring Life Expectancy

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by TomJ, Mar 24, 2019.

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  1. TomJ
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    TomJ Contributing Member

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    A couple of weeks back I mentioned that after 2000 trouble free rounds, with the exception of one failure to go into battery I started having light primer strikes one to two times per magazine. Before and after I experienced those issues I had three conversations with Sig's customer service. The first time I called I was looking for a new spring, as I knew I was going to need to replace it in the not too distant future. They were out of stock and their rep assured me the recoil springs last much longer than 2500 rounds, which is when they recommend changing it. After I experienced the issue I had a second conversation with Sig. The rep informed me that those recoil springs could last between 800 and a few thousand rounds, and he was certain it was the culprit. He didn't come out and say it, but implied there had been quality control issues with those springs. I received a call back from a supervisor a few days later, who told me the springs should last 2500 rounds and sent a shipping label, offering to take a look at the gun. I replaced the recoil spring and had a chance to shoot it yesterday for the first time since I experienced the light strikes. I put over 250 rounds through it without issue and won't send it in for repair, as it's working and I want to leave well enough alone. Going forward I'm replacing the recoil spring after 1500 rounds and will continue to carry it, now that I know what the problem was. I'm posting this as a FYI for others who carry it, as I'd recommend not waiting for the 2500 round mark to change that spring.
     
  2. sequins

    sequins Member

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    Small guns chew through springs it's true. 800 rounds is rorhbaugh territory though- at least this wonder design breaks down for cleaning and replacement of parts easier.
     
  3. imashooter

    imashooter Member

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    A cop buddy of mine got one (at cost / 400.00) the other day. All the way around, that is a sweet pistol imo. I fired a few and really liked it. After a few magazines, he put all 11 in the head at 15 meters. Fairly rapid fire but not wide open. Probably 8 seconds or so. I'm gonna give them a while longer to see if any more bugs surface. If gtg and the wife can get past her gun phobia, she'll get one of those. I'd kinda like one myself. But don't spread that around. I'm 7-round / 1911 all the way. :D

    Appreciate the info on the recoil spring.

    Q target w/ training rounds.

    RcekN3K.jpg
     
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  4. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    Interesting, but how does a weak recoil spring cause light strikes?
     
  5. TomJ
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    TomJ Contributing Member

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    Per their supervisor it was causing the gun to be just slightly out of battery. I didn’t notice it being out of battery but he said it wouldn’t be visibly noticable.
     
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  6. mrmike7189

    mrmike7189 Member

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    Glock recommends recoil spring assembly replacement at 5k rounds in the sub compacts, like the /26/27/33.
    Sig 365 being even smaller, 2500 rounds sounds about right?
    Sig designers should have figured this out already?
     
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  7. TomJ
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    TomJ Contributing Member

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    Attached is a link to a video explaining how to check your recoil spring. I'd be interested in input as to whether this video is accurate. It's a simple enough test.

    https://www.btguiderods.com/spring-test/
     
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  8. frogfurr

    frogfurr Member

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    About 3k on springs for auto loaders. CZ 9mm and 1911 Colt Government 45acp auto loaders. Round springs and flat wire springs. Expensive springs and cheap springs. I can't reliably get 3.5k out of a recoil spring.

    I keep a round count on my guns. When a recoil spring is ending it's life cycle the slide will fail to return to battery.
     
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  9. SteadyD

    SteadyD Member

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    This happened with a CW380 to me. The recoil spring had gotten so weak that it couldn’t hold the slide in battery and I would get light strikes. Happened at about the 900 round mark as best I can figure. I could slightly push the slide back, perhaps an 1/8 of an inch and it would just stay there. When shooting sometimes it just didn’t have enough tension to return all the way to battery.
     
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  10. frogfurr

    frogfurr Member

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    Returning to battery is just that and no more. In my a experience the gun shouldn't fire when out of battery. No light strikes. If a gun does fire when out of battery there is certainly a lot more wrong with the gun than a worn recoil spring.
     
  11. SteadyD

    SteadyD Member

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    On my cw380 you could definitely pull the trigger with it slightly out of battery. We are talking a very small amount though. And it would fire sometimes, and others light strike.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2019
  12. frogfurr

    frogfurr Member

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    A gun that will fire out of battery is a very good way to be injured. Not to mention the damage to the gun.
     
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  13. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    Ouch, now that's worn out for sure, thanks. I guess I have never let any of mine get that bad, but the P-365 is my first (Owned long term) sub compact auto, and they are definitely more critical, something to keep a close eye on, thanks.
     
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  14. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    No doubt, but I am guessing here that the gun is in battery enough to be safe, just a hair from being fully in and enough to cause a light strike, which is a very small distance. Interesting thought though for sure.
     
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  15. WYO

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  16. drband

    drband Member

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    My P938 has around 1500 rds through it. No issues with light strikes or return to battery. Flatwire recoil spring. It’s my second one. The first one had issues with light strikes and grip screws. Sig eventually replaced it.
     
  17. TomJ
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    TomJ Contributing Member

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    That’s what I understood, but mine failed after 2000 rounds. As I mentioned I’m changing mine after 1500 rounds as I carry it and don’t want to risk a failure if I’m in the unfortunate situation of needing it in a defensive situation.
     
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  18. Bartojc

    Bartojc Member

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    This is an interesting conversation to me. I've wondered as my round count goes up on my older semi-auto's when I would need to replace the recoil spring. When you ask no one sees to have a set number, and mfg suggestions vary. I guess as my two carry weapons both have over 3000 rounds I should start paying attention.

    -Jeff
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
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  19. Jeb Stuart

    Jeb Stuart member

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    On my 380 pistols, I have always changed out the recoil springs on a regular basis and I just do not get failures. I buy them 4 or 5 at a time. Change them out every 500 rds. I had a Nano guide rod and spring that wore out quickly. It might have been a bad spring, but I immediately ordered one from Galloway. Really nice quality and worth the price. The Nano is comparative to the 365 in size. Stock is 16#, but I do have the 14,16,18, 20. I emailed Galloway and he said they should be good for 2,500 rounds, which I believe to be correct. I suspect Galloway will have his springs for the 365 in the near future.
     
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  20. Fiv3r

    Fiv3r Member

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    I almost never wear out my springs. I don't get to shoot enough. When I do, it takes me a good long while. That said, I always buy a spare within a few weeks when I buy a gun. Having one on hand means I am not down any shooting time waiting on the parts. I do swap out the micro .380s in pretty short order. I've had issues going with heavier springs to try and preserve the gun, though. A heavier spring in a LCP caused way more malfunctions than just keeping the stock spring and letting it wear itself out naturally. If it means I beat a $200 gun to death sooner, who cares. I just need it to go off when I need it to go off.

    2500 sounds about right for the 365. Little guns are engineering marvels, and thus they tend to be picky beasts when the are even a little out of spec.
     
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  21. Tony k

    Tony k Member

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    My Kahr cw380 will do the same thing.
     
  22. TomJ
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    TomJ Contributing Member

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    I just ordered 2 more. At $25 each it’s inexpensive enough to change frequently, especially for a carry gun.
     
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  23. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator Staff Member

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    That is almost always a bad idea...what you're doing is now battering the gun as the slide returns into battery.

    The smaller that slide travel is on a gun the more often you'll need to change recoil springs. You won't get a "standard" answer/number because it varies with the platform.

    A good rule of thumb with a Service sized pistol is 5000 rounds, as they get shorter the number of rounds between changes gets smaller. The shortest I've ever heard of for a delayed blowback 9mm was the Wilson Combat ADP and the Detonics Pocket-9 at 500 rounds
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2019
  24. RecoilRob

    RecoilRob Member

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    Striker fired guns need the recoil spring to be able to hold it in battery against the full striker tension just before firing....unlike a hammer gun where the recoil spring only needs to be able to chamber the round (though many smaller guns use the spring tension to help hold it closed during firing). I had an early Glock 19 that would just about come out of battery when you pulled the trigger and if you held it just at the point before release then quickly shoved the gun forward it would unlock. Didn't like that much but otherwise it was functional and reliable.
     
  25. paulsj

    paulsj member

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    Nothing. I would not want to own semi-auto in which pin fell on primer when the gun was slightly out of battery.
    If I owned small carry gun I would use it for carry and buy larger one for range use. In this case it would be 365-320 Compact. In case of Glock it would be G43-G26 or G19 combo.
     
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