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Peep Sights

Discussion in 'Long Gun Accessories and Optics' started by 0ne3, Dec 22, 2016.

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  1. 0ne3

    0ne3 Member

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    I have been wondering about peep sights. Lets look at the sights for shooting and hunting. What is the size of hole, for the rear sight, that seems to work the best? Military rifles have them for a reason.
     
  2. Bart B.

    Bart B. Member

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    Peep, or aperture rear sights have different size apertures (holes) for different applications. Military ones are pretty large because they're used in the entire spectrum of available light. Hunting ones can be smaller as they're typically used in daylight. Competition ones are the smallest as they make the front sight and target appear the sharpest for precise alignment on the target bullseye.

    M1 and M14 service apertures are about .070" diameter. Match ones are either .059" or .052".

    Good size for hunting rifles is about .060".

    For shooting from a bench or competition, .050" down to .030" are typical.

    Adjustable apertures are available for many rear sights; one that goes from .030" to .060" will cover all applications. Or get several screw in apertures then use the one best for your application. Champion's Choice, Brownells and Midway have them.

    Some have adjustable optics in them to help you focus best on front sight as well as the target.

    In use, always center the front sight in the rear sight field of view. It's a decades old myth that the aiming eye "automatically" centers the front sight regardless of where it appears through the rear aperture. The aiming eye doesn't automatically center a bead front sight in the notch of a leaf rear sight, does it?
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2016
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  3. Sav .250

    Sav .250 Member

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    The "hole" as you call it is the aperture. They do come in various sizes for different reasons. Look at the Wlliams Gun Sight Co web sight. All the information you`ll need . Plus, get educated in the process.

    If you don`t understand the concept of a peep sight, you might want to consider something else.
     
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  4. 0ne3

    0ne3 Member

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    Thanks, Bart B very nice information.
     
  5. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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    Some hunters remove the aperture sight and use that way. Good for close , fast shooting at running deer on a drive. Mostly the old timers get to be on stand. Let the young guys chase the deer. [​IMG]
     
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  6. Sistema1927

    Sistema1927 Member

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    The XS Ghost Sight apertures run .191 and .230. The larger one is almost 1/4", but they work surprisingly well. The human eye loves putting the top of that post in the very center of even fairly large holes.
     
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  7. imashooter

    imashooter Member

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    You need sights which are weapon - specific. If you're just gonna do all - around generic shooting, I'd get a dual - aperture rear sight. Iron sights are great.
     
  8. 0ne3

    0ne3 Member

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    I do not know about you guys, but when I was younger Iron sights were great. Now that I am older my eyes are not what they once were. Getting old is not handy.
     
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  9. dc.fireman

    dc.fireman Member

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  10. SARuger

    SARuger Member

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    At 50, my eyes still love peep/military sights. I shoot them better than a scope to be honest. And a rifle is soo much lighter, handles so much quicker, without a heavy optic. And there is a reason why the military likes them, they are reliable and durable.

    Unless you are shooting out past 200 (I practice up to 250 with my 30-30's/peeps) then you don't have to have optics unless its an eyesight issue.

    Many of my rifles have Williams sights, I prefer the Lyman 17A globe front with peeps, when I can, but a blade will work well for others. The Tech Sights work well with rimfire rifles and on the Mini 14/30.

    My peep/ghost ring, sighted 30-30's.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2016
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  11. Bart B.

    Bart B. Member

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    Not true. Ask any ophthalmologist or optometrist; or some rifle shooter whose won big matches and set records with aperture rear sights.

    If the rifle's zeroed correctly with aperture rear sights but the front sight's off to the right of center in the aperture field of view but centered on target, the shot will go to the left. Why? The bore axis moves to the left when the rifle's moved to the left putting that off center front sight to the left to align it with the target.

    Our eyes don't discriminate the types of sights we use.

    Your eye doesn't center a rifle's bead front sight in the rear sight V notch does it?

    Does your eye center a handgun's post front sight in the square notch in the rear sight?
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2016
  12. chicharrones

    chicharrones needs more ammo

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    My experience is like several of the posters in this thread.

    In bright light, I can use a .050 aperture fairly well and it improves my focus of the front sight. Any larger of an aperture than that and my 51 year old nearsighted/trifocal eyes can't focus on the front sight anymore.

    Saying all that, I can still shoot with larger apertures, just not with precision. Those larger apertures are definitely necessary when the light gets low. In fact, I'll pull the aperture out of my Williams sights at dusk or dawn just so I can still find the front sight and the target. That's using a white bead front sight to help out in low light, by the way.
     
  13. Sistema1927

    Sistema1927 Member

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  14. Bart B.

    Bart B. Member

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    I agree; Lew Wallace was very optimistic. I don't think he's a high qualified marksman with aperture rear sights.

    One can easily see what happens with aperture rear sights with an optical collimator in the muzzle, zero the front sight on its reticle by adjusting the rear sight. Then move the aiming eye to the edge of the field of view in different directions. See how the collimator reticle center moves about the front sight.

    I don't think Chuck Hawks is aware of how close together scope and aperture sight scores shot from prone are as close together as they are. I've had equal success with aperture sights and scopes shooting prairie dogs through 400 yards.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2016
  15. Sunray

    Sunray Member

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    The human eye naturally centres the post/blade. Would go as far as saying 'love' though. The sights still have to be centred on the rifle. Your Mk I Eyeball won't compensate for that, like Bart says. Your eye will centre the blade in the aperture though, but it'll be off.
    Biggest advantage to peeps is you're removing one optical plane. Your eye cannot focus on two or three things at once as in 'Patridge' sights. With a peep, you're focusing on one thing, the front blade/post. You look through the rear, not at it, focusing on the front and sit the target on top. They don't help much in low light. All irons tend to be difficult to see through in low light. Regardless of your level of Geezerhood.
    M1/M14 National Match blades are thinner than standard battle sights too.
    "...remove the aperture sight..." Means you have no rear sight at all. Mind you, it also means you could just use a shotgun bead. Usually called point shooting. Called "Quick Kill" by the U.S. Army. Basically shooting looking over the sights. Most people have no business shooting at a running deer though.
     
  16. Rembrandt

    Rembrandt Member

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    Extremely accurate as long as lighting is adequate. Aperture size can be changed to overcome the low light conditions.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  17. Bart B.

    Bart B. Member

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    I still disagree. So does all the top ranked rifle competitors I've talked about this with
    Do you mean in line with but above the bore axis? That's a bunch of hooey. Some right hand rifle competitors offset both the rear and front metallic sights a couple inches to the left so their left dominant eye sees through them with best visual clarity. I know of one whose set records with such a set up. Yes, he has to make a windage correction for zeros at different range to compensate for the sight's 2 inch offset horizontally. He replaces those sights with his scope for matches allowing them, so it also is offset 2 inches to the left.
    Where did I say that? Don't think I did.
    Please explain that as I don't grasp the message its sending.
    What's an optical plane? Never heard of that about aperture sights. But no sight plane is removed. Nor any eye lens focusing things down range on yout eye retina is removed. Light from the target to the shooter's aiming eye follows the same path regardless of where the sights are, on its way into your eye. All the sights do is be visible at some point relative to the rays of light coming from the target that never changes; unless mirage tends to wiggle the target image a little or a lot.

    I've a question for you "eye centering front sight in the rear sight aperture" gurus. Does the aiming eye also center the round black bullseye in the .080" diameter front sight aperture? What's the difference between the front and rear sight centering or not centering the front sight aperture on a round bullseye down range?
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2016
  18. chicharrones

    chicharrones needs more ammo

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    I'm not sure what others are referring to, but when I remove the aperture disc, the round "hole" portion of the sight body is still in place. It's much like a ghost ring and very usable in dusk or dawn conditions.

    To my eye, if I have one of the smaller apertures (.050" or .093") in one of my rifles and the light dims outside, it makes the aperture appear smaller than it is due to less light coming through it. So, I can go up an aperture size if I have a spare on me to compensate.

    When it gets really dim outside, my largest aperture at .125" shrinks visually as well. When I reach that point of low light I can pull the aperture disc all together and get a few more minutes of shooting time. Since the aperture continues to appear smaller with dimming light, as long as I can see the target through it, the rear sight body still works as an aiming device.
     
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