Pietta cased G&G

[WestKentucky]

I stumbled across this. I really like the G&G guns, but know so little about C&B that I’m afraid to go wild on bidding and I keep being grossly outbid. It’s going to happen again.

What’s this actually worth? Realistically? Yes I’m bidding, no I didn’t bid enough to win it. I essentially just stuck a bid on it so that I could watch it easily.

https://www.gunbroker.com/Item/788835207

 

[arcticap]

It depends on who is bidding that wants a defarbed gun and is willing to pay extra for all of the accessories that are part of the set.
Each part of the set has a value in addition to the gun.
My wild guess would be somewhere between $250 to $300.

 

[Steel Hayes]

From the looks of it and the description the seller gave, he’s antiqued it( removed a lot of the blueing), which is to bad for a cased set.

 

[AlexanderA]

The whole set is just awful. The case is not authentic. The modern external (non-inletted) hinges and hasp give it away, as does the glass top. And, the case is too large for the gun, as indicated by the wide margin around the partitioned portion. Then we have the "Remington" type powder flask that doesn't belong with that gun. The set was just put together haphazardly.

The gun itself looks like a kit that was insufficiently completed. The brass frame looks like it was never polished. The fit around the trigger guard and grip is terrible. This is just a typical old, beat-up example, and from the description, it looks like the seller is trying to make "a silk purse out of a sow's ear." I don't know what to say, other than that I would never want to have that in my collection.

My wild guess would be somewhere between $250 to $300.

No. I would say less than $100, but some fool may bid more.

 

[arcticap]

I agree that it may sell for a lot less due to the seller willing to let it go for any bid based strictly on interest.
But I still think that the accessories add about $80 worth of value to the set.
And I wouldn't characterize anyone who bids over $100 for it as a fool or being foolish.
Even if the winning bid were $199, they may be getting a fair deal.

 

[AlexanderA]

I once had a cased set similar to that -- with two EIG brass-framed 1851's -- that I had trouble giving away. Gave it to my brother-in-law and a few years later he gave it back to me. (And those revolvers were in much better condition than this one.) Finally sold the whole set for $75, and was glad I got that much for it.

 

[expat_alaska]

I once had a cased set similar to that -- with two EIG brass-framed 1851's -- that I had trouble giving away. Gave it to my brother-in-law and a few years later he gave it back to me. (And those revolvers were in much better condition than this one.) Finally sold the whole set for $75, and was glad I got that much for it.

I would sure like to see a pic of two cased EIG brassers for $75. I would have bought it in a heartbeat. Obviously you have no idea about collecting replica 1851 Navy type guns from Italian manufacturers.

The whole set is just awful. The case is not authentic. The modern external (non-inletted) hinges and hasp give it away, as does the glass top. And, the case is too large for the gun, as indicated by the wide margin around the partitioned portion. Then we have the "Remington" type powder flask that doesn't belong with that gun. The set was just put together haphazardly.

The gun itself looks like a kit that was insufficiently completed. The brass frame looks like it was never polished. The fit around the trigger guard and grip is terrible. This is just a typical old, beat-up example, and from the description, it looks like the seller is trying to make "a silk purse out of a sow's ear." I don't know what to say, other than that I would never want to have that in my collection.

No. I would say less than $100, but some fool may bid more.

The frame has proof marks and a date code of [AN] which is not 1983 but 1985. Kit guns had no proof marks or date codes.

The gun is defarbed insofar as the barrel, but the frame and cylinder are not.

The case may be not authentic. The flask may be not authentic. The pistol is not authentic.

You had better get a real Colt Navy and forget about us replica guys.

Regards,

Jim

 

[expat_alaska]

Thank you mods.

 

[jmar]

I'd say that gun will sell for $350-500. In cased sets people often care more about what accessories they get than the case itself, and they all add up. When done right defarbed/antiqued guns can rake in hundreds more than the same gun pristine. I don't think that one is particularly well done though.

 

[Ephraim Kibbey]

Add up what it would cost to recreate it currently (some of these are slightly different) :

Flask https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index.../product_name/HA0250+Remington+Revolver+Flask
Wrench https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index/page/product/product_id/4116/category_id/586/category_chain/578,348,586/product_name/NW0601+Nipple+Wrench+-+Colt+&+Remington+L-Shaped+Revolver
Cap Tin https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...6+Eley+Percussion+Cap+Holder+-+For+Cased+Sets
Mold https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...MO0904+.36+Caliber+Double+Cavity+Pistol+Mould
G & G Revolver https://www.emf-company.com/store/pc/1851-Griswold-Gunnison-36-7-1-2-110p1859.htm
Case https://www.taylorsfirearms.com/acc...black-powder-gun-display-cases-glass-top.html

Then deduct money for anything that looks less than new or damaged.
Don't offer more than that amount!

 

[Stormson]

Ive fallowed this guy on GB for quite some time now. He usually does bulldogs and avenging angels in cigar boxes..

Hes quite good at WHAT he does, but you have to understand just WHAT that IS. He certainly isnt "correct" in most cases... If thats what ya need then look elsewhere. He does have a unique way of securing the bulldog pin.. A weird rubber washer deal with one round side and one flat (never seen that anywhere else), but apparently is seems to work, as this guy seems to have quite a fallowing on GB and his auctions usually go pretty high.

He seems to get whatever he can lay his hands on (California and all) and makes the best of it. It IS usually older, less costly arms that he tries to turn into something or other that someone would want.. and again, that usually works out pretty well for him. That being said, I have seen him offer stuff made from newer and better arms as well... Though, again, its usually cut down and unblued. He does seem to put nice front sights on...

I follow him, and have seen a FEW things I would spring for, but when they have come up I havent had the dough... Shrugs.. waiting for the right one at the right time. If that ever happens, great, if not then its interesting to see what he does come up with from time to time...

 

[Stormson]

BTW, when I say his auctions usually go for "quite high" I dont mean HE starts them that way.. he usually starts VERY low in fact.. they just get pushed that high by bidders..

 

[mh2000]

If you are confident in what you are selling, it is usually better to start with a very low bid to get people interested.

 

[WestKentucky]

I’m way outbid on the gun now, I will keep haunting the interwebs until I finally score a gun that’s interesting and cheap enough to play with. I want a junker to work on. Preferably a steel frame though.

 

[Ephraim Kibbey]

Stormson - Long ago ASM used wedge retaining screws with one flat side so that the wedge could be removed without having to completely remove the screw (and of course loosing it under some heavy piece of furniture.)

 

[expat_alaska]

Stormson - Long ago ASM used wedge retaining screws with one flat side so that the wedge could be removed without having to completely remove the screw (and of course losing it under some heavy piece of furniture.)

EK,

To me that is a complete oxymoron. Not doubting your word. The only reason for the wedge retaining screw is to capture wedge so it won't fall out of the barrel lug during disassembly, if the wedge has a spring. The wedge can easily be removed with the wedge screw in place by lifting it upwards and pulling it to the left to avoid the wedge screw.

I have seen 1851 Colt replicas where the wedge retaining screw has bad screwdriver marks in the slot, and there is absolutely no reason for that, and is not ever needed for disassembly. I have 7 Pietta 1851 types and can exchange barrels and cylinders without ever touching the wedge screw.

You are a good guy. Just sayin'.

Jim

 

[Ephraim Kibbey]

"I just calls them as I sees them:"

I own ASM AD/1978 3rd Model Dragoon SN 5872 with Colt barrel address "ADDRESS SAM^L COLT NEW-YORK CITY."
When I first got it, I tapped out the wedge with a plastic hammer and it hit the floor instead of stopping at the screw head.
I looked at the screw and thought that I had hit the wedge so hard that I had sheered off one side of its head.
On closer inspection, I found that the flat side was polished and blued like all of the rest of the screw.
After that, I started noticing this anomaly on ASM's for sale occasionally.

Here are a few of my finds from my collection of GB auction photos -

ASM 1969 2nd Model Dragoon SN 1756:


ASM 1977 3rd Model Dragoon SN 4581 (note the rounded right side of the screw head is broken off: )


ASM 1969 Walker SN 760:


When collecting, look for the rarities!

 

[Stormson]

Stormson - Long ago ASM used wedge retaining screws with one flat side so that the wedge could be removed without having to completely remove the screw (and of course loosing it under some heavy piece of furniture.)

That seems like a good idea, in a way, and I certainly dont doubt your word. But my single ASM Colt doesnt have that feature.. Of course, ASM being ASM it doesnt surprise me LoL

At any rate, that not what I mean. What I meant was on his Remington bulldogs he used a somewhat thick rubber washer to hold the cylinder pin in place.... When firing or carrying you turn the washer with the round side up so that it places pressure against the pin... I assume that means when reloading you would use the flat side against the pin so that it slides in and out easily.

Ive never had the money that his stuff goes for so I really cant say how well it works... But I guess a LOT of folks seem to like the idea... Hence the reason I could never afford one..

 

[Ephraim Kibbey]

The Spiller and Burr loading lever screw works on a similar flat/rounded system to allow the lever and cylinder arbor to be removed. I am not sure if the Whitney and the ROA also work that way. The flat/rounded rubber washer seems like a great fix.

 

[Fingers McGee]

The Whitney and ROA work on the same principle, the S&B and ROA being based on the 2nd model Whitney

 

[arcticap]

Right now, the bid price is at $221 with bidding in $5 increments.
I wouldn't be surprised if someone has already bid higher than that using auto bid, but it won't go up any further unless someone pushes it higher to test whether an auto bid is in place or not.
That may not happen until the last minutes of the auction, if at all.
It's still 6 bids away from selling for $251, even though someone may have already auto bid $250 for it.
It takes TWO to Tango!

 

[44 Dave]

Pietta mis-locates The wedge screw to high on many so that the wedge will not catch very well.

 

[arcticap]

Holy cow!
The high bid is now $291 with under 2 hours left:--->>> https://www.gunbroker.com/Item/788835207

 

[Ephraim Kibbey]

As arcticap was saying, a number of bidders used autobid. You can tell in "bid history" by the series of the same name chasing the bid up to someone who placed an earlier bid.

 

[AlexanderA]

I have to say that I'm very surprised at the bidding on this item. An item which, if I owned it, I would be willing to pay someone to take off my hands. I guess there's no accounting for taste.

The bright side, from my point of view, is that if a mundane item like this is going for that kind of money, I can just imagine what the ones in my collection must be worth.