Pistol cartridge lever gun barrel length: 16" vs. 20"

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vincyr

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I'm considering picking up a .357 mag lever gun in the need future, but I'm a little torn on barrel length. I was originally thinking 16", but I'm seeing a lot more models available with 20" barrels. Does .357 gain much more vel. from a 20" barrel vs. a 16"? How about handling, particularly in thick woods? Capacity isn't really a concern for me, as this would be a hunting gun, and the 7-8 rnd capacity of the 16" models would be more than enough.

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If you need the extra velocity that 4" of barrel would give you, then I humbly suggest that you are shooting the wrong cartridge. In checking with the info given by Ballistics By The Inch (Google BBTI), going from 10" to 18" gives you at the most 150 FPS. At 16" you are getting the best of the cartridge already. A 20" barrel might give you 5% more velocity.

4" less barrel can be a blessing while moving through brush.
 
I don't think you gain enough speed to matter with those cartridges. It really comes down to how the rifle looks and balances with the different barrel lengths. And that is personal preference. I think 20" looks better. But there is no denying the 16" is quite handy.
 
pistol powder generally burns faster than rifle.. id suspect after 16 inches, powder would be burned already.. extra length only counts for velocity if there is still powder burning.. id say no significant difference between 16 and 20 velocity-wise.. in fact, friction beyond powder burn might actually slow the bullet a scosch...
 
if I was going for a 357 I would go with 16". If you feel like you need extra velocity from those 4", just get a 30-30.
 
Ballistics by the inch shows velocity going down between 16"-18" so 20" would be even worse...

Definitely 16" that is where velocity looks like it peaks and the shortest legal length, best of both worlds!
 
Cowboy action shooters use pistol caliber lever rifles. A ten round magazine is a must in a match rifle. That said, I own two rifles that started life with 20" octagon barrels. Both are .38 caliber so that's a lot of weight on the muzzle.

I had both shortened; one is about 16.5" and the other is about 17" but both will hold ten rounds of .38 Special. I like the way they handle.
 
Go 20".

Looks better.

If the 4" extra is a problem in brush, you're in so thick the 16" is gonna suck too (because it aint just about the barrel getting hung up).
 
pistol powder generally burns faster than rifle.. id suspect after 16 inches, powder would be burned already.. extra length only counts for velocity if there is still powder burning.. id say no significant difference between 16 and 20 velocity-wise.. in fact, friction beyond powder burn might actually slow the bullet a scosch...

It really depends on what pistol powder is in the cartridges.

Your assessment holds true for most off the shelf mainstream factory ammo, but if you handload using the appropriate powder, the velocity gains with a longer barrel are surprising.

Hodgdon H110 and Lil' Gun can make revolver carbines scream, as can Accurate #9.

When I had an 1894C, I was able to make 125 grain rounds exceed 2000 fps. at the muzzle and 158 grain loads almost hit the 1900 mark.
 
So it seems my first instinct to go with a 16" was the correct one. I'll have to see if my LGS can order one, since all they have in stock are 20" and 24".
 
So it seems my first instinct to go with a 16" was the correct one. I'll have to see if my LGS can order one, since all they have in stock are 20" and 24".
I have never purchased a .357 rifle with a barrel longer than 16". It has already been stated but you will gain very little if any velocity past 16" and, depending on your powder and charge you might actually lose a little. It wouldn't be enough to worry about though.

Sight radius comes up as well but I have found the difference to be almost non-existent between a 16 and 20" barrel. That really is preference more than anything. The 16" seems easier to carry and control to me as well.

Now, on the other hand I must admit that the 20 or even 24" barrels look very cool. Depending on the magazine tube length, you might even get 1 or 2 extra rounds with a longer barrel.

I guess what I am saying is that either will be fine. Go with what your preference is.
 
However, all the powder being burned does not mean the bullet stops accelerating. As long as the pressure applied to the base of the bullet generates a force that exceeds the friction between bullet and barrel, the bullet will accelerate. It doesn't matter if the powder is still burning or done.

Quickload says that for a maximum (35KPSI) charge of Lil'Gun driving a 180gr XTP, you get 54 ft/s of additional velocity and 70 ft-lbs of additional energy moving from 16in to 20in. So not much, but not zero either.
 
I've gotten 250fps increase from one 9mm load to another in a using a slow powder vs a very fast powder. Tested both in a pistol, then in the carbine. Used Red Dot And Power Pistol just under max loads of each.

How that translates in a 357 i can only guess.

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BBTI doesn't tell us much in this case. Pistol cartridge leverguns are going to gain right up to 18-20 inches, even with medium burning powders like Unique. At least 400fps over revolver velocities, if not more. The .357 seems to get the most out of the extra length with some loads gaining 700fps. IMHO, Trapper length guns (16") are neat but 20" is about the best compromise between performance, sight radius and handling.


However, all the powder being burned does not mean the bullet stops accelerating. As long as the pressure applied to the base of the bullet generates a force that exceeds the friction between bullet and barrel, the bullet will accelerate. It doesn't matter if the powder is still burning or done.
Llama Bob seems to be the only one who understands internal ballistics. Powder is "burned" in a very short span but the gases produced continue to expand and accelerate the bullet down the barrel. Even a 24" is not going to lose you any velocity.
 
I have a 20" and a 12" 357 mag and there is nothing I would do with the 20" gun that I wouldn't feel equally comfortable doing with the 12". If I need more than what the 12" gun can offer I'm likely going to be using something in a different cartridge anyhow.
 
A 20" barrel gains at least 200-250 fps over a 16" barrel using .357mag ammo.

If in doubt, call Buffalo Bore and ask them.
 
I have a 20" and a 12" 357 mag and there is nothing I would do with the 20" gun that I wouldn't feel equally comfortable doing with the 12". If I need more than what the 12" gun can offer I'm likely going to be using something in a different cartridge anyhow.
I'm sure the buttstock that comes with the 20" barrel, along with the added sight radius would factor in there somewhere. Barrel length isn't all about velocity. That said, when talking handgun cartridges, 200fps is a big leap.
 
That 200+ ft/s number from buffalo bore surprises me to the point where without additional evidence, I don't think it's true. Lil'Gun and H110 are about as slow a powder as you're going to load .357 with (bordering on being a fast rifle powder) and they only give 50 ft/s per QL going from 16" to 20".
 
Llama Bob seems to be the only one who understands internal ballistics. Powder is "burned" in a very short span but the gases produced continue to expand and accelerate the bullet down the barrel. Even a 24" is not going to lose you any velocity.

I don't disagree entirely but, in real world application I have personally seen bullets lose very small amounts of velocity in longer barrels. There is a great article written by David LaPell that references tests done by Phil Sharpe that argue against the notion that longer barrels always offer higher velocity. One thing to keep in mind is his tests were done with a .30-06 so it isn't really an apples to apples comparison. I remembered reading this a few years ago and a quick google search found it again.

http://www.guns.com/2012/02/16/the-myth-of-barrel-length-and-velocity-loss/
 
It's threads like this where I miss RCModel. :(

Mine is 16" and I shoot it very well. My next one will be 20" because I like the full sized Model 92 I plan to get in the same caliber, .357.
 
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